West or East Valley more diverse? (Phoenix, Mesa: transfer, school, university)

[FlipMC]

Hey guys so I've been accepted to Midwestern University and I'm choosing between West and East valley to do my clinical rotations. I was wondering which area is considered more diverse as I would prefer to work with a much more ethnically diverse population which I feel would only help me in the future. Here are the hospitals;

West Phoenix
St. Joseph's Medical Center
Veterans Administration Medical Center
Banner Boswell
Banner Del Webb
Banner Estrella
Banner Thunderbird
John C. Lincoln North Mountain
John C. Lincoln Deer Valley

East Valley
Maricopa Medical Center
Veterans Administration Medical Center
Banner Baywood
Banner Desert
Scottsdale Osborn
Scottsdale Shea
Scottsdale Thompson Peak
Mountain Vista
St. Luke's Behavioral Health
St. Luke's
Tempe St. Luke's

Thank you so much everyone!

[observer53]

I don't have actual numbers on this, but I think the East Valley is somewhat more diverse, thanks to ASU, which attracts foreign students and faculty, and a relatively significant Asian population in the Chandler area. Your East Valley list doesn't include Chandler Regional, but Banner Desert and Tempe St Lukes would also serve those populations.

[CheyDee]

I think the East Valley choices are far more diverse, particularly because of Maricopa Medical Center. Since MMC is the county hospital you will probably see a large number of indigent and diverse clients there, which you may not see as many of in the other facilities.

[pbenjamin]

For reference sake, St. Joe's and the VA are in central Phoenix, not west.

[observer53]

Originally Posted by pbenjamin

For reference sake, St. Joe's and the VA are in central Phoenix, not west.

So is JCL North Mountain. I think these are groupings as they've been given to the OP, and not necessarily geographically accurate.

[VOC1]

Originally Posted by pbenjamin

For reference sake, St. Joe's and the VA are in central Phoenix, not west.

This is absolutely true.

For the OP: out of that list, I would say the VA, St Luke (Van Buren) and St Joes would be the most diverse. By a good margin.

[azriverfan.]

There are so many wrong things with your post

1. Diversity doesn't necessarily mean diverse pathology. A lot of the poor or inner city hospitals lack the resources to properly work up a patient. Case in point, Banner Good Sam has one of the best Hepatology/Gastroenterology centers in the city and many patients from Maricopa hospital will be transferred to Good Sam for this reason.

2. You haven't even started medical school. Trust me when I say you really have no idea about anything and that's not an insult. Don't even think about clinical rotations. It's a long ways away. Finish basic sciences first.

3. Residency is where you become a doctor, medical school is kind of a joke. You spend the first two years going to classes and taking tests. Then during your last two years, you essentially spend a month in each field observing. That's why I laugh when the public tries to judge a doctor by where he or she went to medical school because they really have no clue about this fact ( I went to a good school UCSF in case people are wondering but it too was a joke compared to residency). You will receive your training during residency. During medical school rotations, you observe, write some notes and follow residents and attendings around but you aren't really involved in patient care nor do you make decisions. So if you really desire exposure to diverse patients, make sure to do residency at a hospital with a lot of ethnic diversity such as most county hospitals (Maricopa County, LA County, Cook County). It's a double edged sword because with increased diversity and pathology comes a lot of strife (non-English speaking can mean getting a proper history will be challenging to impossible at times, patients can take a long time to work up and require more care, facilities are not always up to par, teaching isn't the greatest because the hospital is so busy)

To answer your question, the most diverse hospital by far is Maricopa. It's not the VA (not even close). Maryvale is very diverse but it lacks the resources to work up patients so they will likely be transferred. St. Joes has a lot of diversity followed by Banner Good Samaritan. Banner Desert in Mesa presents a lot of interesting cases as well but Maricopa is the runaway leader in this category. The VA is not diverse. First of all, you don't see a lot of female patients. Second, most of the patients are geriatric caucasian males....how is that diverse?

[darly2004]

Sorry, I am a little late in the game answering the question. What program have you been accepted to at Midwestern? If it is the DO program, I would not worry about clinicals at this point. You have two years until you really need to worry about those. Although I did not do my clinicals here, I did do my residency here. What I've found is that you may not find the "perfect" area of town to focus on. I would think you'd be driving all over the Phoenix for your rotations since each hospital has its own specialty they are strong in. For example, the only real pediatric residency program is now at Phoenix Children's Hospital, so if you want to do inpatient peds you may have to go there. St Joe's has a really good neuro program. For OB, you may have to go to Good Sam. I would say the good academic hospitals are usually in Central Phoenix. Mayo Clinic may be a good choice as well. I don't know if I would necessarily pick an area based on diversity. I would probably pick an area that you feel would provide more solid clinical rotations, and I am not sure if I can pinpoint one specific part of the Valley. If you are planning to live near East Valley though, be aware that it will be a pain to drive to Midwestern, which is in the Northwest Valley, something I would not recommend especially with all the time you'll be spending at school. Well, I hope you are able to make a decision you are happy with. Good luck with school!

[synapse]

AZRiverFan has it right, FlipMC. Medical school is for learning - you really get your training in residency, and that's a very different ballgame. The first two years of medical school, it really doesn't matter where you live - you may as well simply choose a nice area that's accessible to the medical school. You're not going to be doing very much in the hospital. Third and fourth years you're going to rotate at so many hospitals that it, again, probably won't matter much where you live, you're going to be driving to those hospitals anyway.

It's *residency* that will make a difference. If you're in a diverse area then, you're going to see an interesting mix of patients and pathology (which is a good thing). For example (and granted I'm biased) I think Rush University Medical Center is one of the best hospitals in the country, because training there you get a fascinating mix of patients spanning all of Chicago, plus rotations at Cook County Hospital, one of the poorer but more powerful trauma centers where you see things you wouldn't see anywhere else. Amazing stuff.

In Phoenix, to answer your basic question, the East Valley is more diverse than the West Valley (St. Joseph's is downtown and probably gets the most interesting mix of patients along with Good Sam, however.) That said, this isn't something you should worry about yet.

[azriverfan.]

Originally Posted by synapse

It's *residency* that will make a difference. If you're in a diverse area then, you're going to see an interesting mix of patients and pathology (which is a good thing). For example (and granted I'm biased) I think Rush University Medical Center is one of the best hospitals in the country, because training there you get a fascinating mix of patients spanning all of Chicago, plus rotations at Cook County Hospital, one of the poorer but more powerful trauma centers where you see things you wouldn't see anywhere else. Amazing stuff.

Great Post Synapse

It's unfortunate the public doesn't understand this about residency. It's also unfortunate, they don't understand that the better training programs may not have the best reputation. I'm very familiar with Rush and know it's a great program but people in Chicago will be more impressed if you went to Norhtwestern even though at Northwestern, you are practicing in a cushy environment and having your hand held the entire time and wont be exposed to nearly the same diverse pathology that someone from Rush was exposed to. The same applies to the Phoenix area. The Mayo residents are pampered and I can assure the Maricopa residents have probably seen more and are better trained than the Mayo guys. But of course, your layman on the street will see "Mayo" and that's it. Nonetheless, I'm also aware programs don't make doctors. Ultimately it comes down to the doctor. I've seen amazing doctors come out of weak programs and horrible doctors come out of great ones. Compassion, Diligence, Thoroughness and Hard Work make a doctor not where they went to residency. Case in point, I stopped referring patients to a primary who came from a great program. The reason is he has a horrible bed side manner and rushes his patients out the door, guess where he trained...Mayo, Rochester. I received too many complaints about him from my patients and found them a new person who trained at St. Joes in Phoenix and they love her.