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Old 01-27-2015, 08:08 AM
 
9,673 posts, read 11,028,153 times
Reputation: 8386

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gixxer1K View Post
The map below should give you an idea of the metro area. Most homes with post tension slabs it will be stamped in the garage on the floor.

ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/AZ/phxshrinkswell.pdf
Mine is stamped on the garage floor. With that said, our 2006 Surprise home has a hairline crack in the ceramic about 15 feet long. It has been the same way since we bought in 2011. There is a process to make the crack disappear and look perfect but I have not bothered yet. I'm talking about a super think hairline crack.

We also have hairline stucco cracks. The painters who I am getting quotes from all say it's not bad and they fill them with an elastomeric product. Sun facing walls are worse. But we are in AZ where the walls get incredibly hot.

In summary, my home is supposedly in a "moderate" area but the post tension slabs seem to be working.
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Old 01-27-2015, 08:35 AM
 
Location: AZ
2,090 posts, read 3,785,923 times
Reputation: 3736
Quote:
Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised View Post
Mine is stamped on the garage floor. With that said, our 2006 Surprise home has a hairline crack in the ceramic about 15 feet long. It has been the same way since we bought in 2011. There is a process to make the crack disappear and look perfect but I have not bothered yet. I'm talking about a super think hairline crack.

We also have hairline stucco cracks. vThe painters who I am getting quotes from all say it's not bad and they fill them with an elastomeric product. Sun facing walls are worse. But we are in AZ where the walls get incredibly hot.

In summary, my home is supposedly in a "moderate" area but the post tension slabs seem to be working.

I'm lucky not to have any hairline cracks in my tiles floors here in Goodyear but I do have a couple on the walls. Back in Ma. like you in Mn. we go through many weather changes from fall-summer and the best product I've used ( being a painter ) is called Big Stretch caulk. Sounds to goofy to even work like one of those "As seen on tv" ads but it really does work. We get a lot of cracks back east in the wall corners and especially around the top edge where the crown moulding meets the ceilings and this stuff remains pliable even after it's cured. I know Lowes carries it and I think even some Walmarts.

Big Stretch® by Sashco, Acrylic Latex Caulk
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Old 01-27-2015, 08:53 AM
 
41 posts, read 110,921 times
Reputation: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippyman View Post
Especially in a new-build, the buyer gets lots of chances & good advice from the state. Those geo-maps are out there & free. The public report is given to a buyer by law. Contracts that specify a warranty are given by law & further, any one who can read my rant here can very easily Google "greedy McBuilder Az" & read all the dirt before signing a contract on a semi-custom McHome. We don't sell property to minor children in Az, so there really is no good excuse for a lack of knowledge & follow-up by the buyer.
So are you saying it's the homeowners fault when their houses start falling apart? That's like blaming a rape victim for wearing the wrong clothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippyman View Post
Lots of people like to bloviate on for hours about "the most expensive purchase in their life", while simultaniously taking no action to protect themselves, doing no research on the subject & not bothering to even read the documents passed across the closing table that may affect them for the next thirty years. If your physical safety & entire financial future are on the line & you don't understand the product you are buying & the documents you're signing, then yes, you might be an uninformed hick.
Please explain how reading all the documents when closing escrow can protect a buyer from something the builder did or didn't do 10 months earlier but failed to disclose.
Also, over the years there have been thousands of buyers who performed extensive due diligence yet still became victims of shoddy workmanship.
Worse, when those victims are forced to litigate legitimate claims, they get tied up for years in court and eventually bankrupted by legal fees.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippyman View Post
No one cries for those that pay over-sticker-price at a car dealer - something that may cost ten-times as much deserves a little more care and thought before purchase
Bad analogy. The victims whose houses are falling apart never claimed they overpaid. They worked and saved for years to buy their dream retirement home. Many were sold homes that started falling apart or were built on unstable ground.
A better analogy would have been car buyers who ended up with Takata air-bags.

There seems to be way too many potential traps unwary buyers can fall into through no fault of their own.

See this article from the New York Times regarding why the Attorney General of Arizona filed a lawsuit against Pulte, contending that the company’s mortgage sales practices deceived consumers.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/06/bu...gret.html?_r=0

Last edited by bustoff1; 01-27-2015 at 09:20 AM..
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Leaving, California
480 posts, read 840,246 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bustoff1 View Post
I'm really sorry that was your perception -- it was really not my intent.
Fair enough.

Although even with that understanding, your 7:53 AM remarks are unnecessarily confrontational, even trolling. Did you really compare a "caveat emptor" attitude toward home purchases with rape-shaming? You realize you're talking with real people here, don't you?

Let's talk about the point you seem to be having problems with, and let's use the car example. Many people won't buy a used car without having a mechanic check it out. On the other hand, some people will buy a used car without even checking the title for liens or salvage status. That's a spectrum of behavior. If you ask for advice on a used car purchase, you will hear people coming from that entire spectrum of behavior. Some people will say "no sweat, buy from a dealer." Some people will say, "I've never had a problem with a used car purchase." Some people will say, "I never buy used cars, not worth the risk."

Some will say "buyer beware, and if you don't check out your car before you buy it, you're partly responsible if something goes wrong." We live in a world where we can investigate before major purchases. I'm sure many people spend more time researching big-screen TVs than on due diligence for a house.

The message you received, loud and clear, because it has been repeated several times, is that cracking and settling is common in areas with expansive soils. Arizona has expansive soils. Arizona may be more complicated than other regions because of the extreme summer heat. However, homes here aren't "plagued" by that, any more than homes in Seattle are "plagued" by mold, or homes in South Dakota are "plagued" by radon. Regional problems require regional mitigations. Reasonable people exercising due diligence are aware of those regional problems, and approach home purchase transactions with due caution.

If you don't want to buy in an area with expansive soils, read the soil report. If you still want to live in an area with expansive soils, try to find a house with a post-tensioned foundation. If your foundation cracks anyway, fix it. If you get cracks on the interior, spackle and paint. If you find that the local builder did something wrong, take that to the courts, but understand that the simple fact that a builder is offering a home in this environment doesn't indicate that they intended to do something wrong if the house develops foundation problems.

As the person asking for the feedback, and presumably asking in good faith, it's up to you to acknowledge a reasonable response for what it is.

If you have a private issue that should affect your feedback (for example, if you have been badly screwed because you bought a home on expansive soils, and now you're saddled with expensive and intrusive repairs), it's useful to state it up front. "I've run into major problems with my house, and it seems a lot of houses here are affected by cracks and settling, blah blah blah. Can anyone give me information about this?"

That's the way you have a conversation without turning your audience into punching bags if they inadvertently say something that gets under your skin for some reason. If someone responds to that message saying "dude, you were stupid," then feel free to be irritated. But you posted this as a hypothetical, not as a personal issue for you.

By simple adult common sense, if someone buys a house, literally the most expensive thing that most people ever buy, they should conduct due diligence. For some people, "due diligence" means they're checking the paperwork to be sure they signed and initialed all the right places. For others, it includes a comprehensive home inspection and careful analysis of the soils report. However, in either of those cases, you can run into cracking and settling out here. If you go to Seattle, you can run into mold in the cleanest house. In South Dakota, you can get radon buildup in a crawlspace. It's not improper for someone to effectively shrug and say that it's up to the buyer to be aware of these issues.

Or think of it this way. You posted up front that you understood Arizona had expansive soils. What response were you looking for? Would you have been satisfied if everyone just posted "yeah sorta" in response to your question? If you were just itching for a fight about who is "responsible" for foundation issues, you're a troll.

Last edited by WriterDude; 01-27-2015 at 10:26 AM.. Reason: corrected the time of response
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:54 AM
 
9,673 posts, read 11,028,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gixxer1K View Post
They also sell something by that name at the adult stores. Statistically speaking, some applied colors stretch more than others.
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Old 01-27-2015, 12:43 PM
 
1,567 posts, read 1,939,002 times
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One of the main issues is that people that are supposed to protect the buyers (home inspectors, realtors) shrug these issues off. I bought a house last year in Gilbert and it had some of the signs such as sticking doors and drywall cracks. In hindsight, if I were to purchase a property in Gilbert again, I would hire a structural engineer to inspect. I might even skip the home inspector, because I can do what he does by myself. Not sure what a structural engineer would charge, but it would be a wise investment. My home inspector told me settling and cracks were normal.

I ended up filling in the cracks and moved some dirt around to keep water away and so far the cracks have not resurfaced, knock on wood (or concrete). Buying a house in the red zone shouldn’t be a problem in itself. If construction was done properly it shouldn’t be too big of an issue. But I wish as a buyer I knew what to look for.

My recommendation is to drive around the neighborhood and look at the block walls and sidewalks. The soil affects them more and the damage is more apparent. If a neighborhood seems to have a lot more damage in these areas, that is an indicator as well.
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Old 01-27-2015, 12:49 PM
 
9,673 posts, read 11,028,153 times
Reputation: 8386
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajonesaz View Post

My recommendation is to drive around the neighborhood and look at the block walls and sidewalks. The soil affects them more and the damage is more apparent. If a neighborhood seems to have a lot more damage in these areas, that is an indicator as well.
Tree roots lift sidewalks and block walls and cause many cracks. So a person needs look at that as well. I have no issues with cracking block walls. But my trees are not all that close to the walls. Others have cracking walls. But I'd have to know about their roots before I could conclude anything.
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Old 01-27-2015, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Buckeye
550 posts, read 1,116,752 times
Reputation: 482
A house over time settles. In Houston we had a hairline crack over about 3 or 4 tiles in the kitchen in front of the sink. We had this from the beginning. It came out after the winter. The builder replaced the tiles. I personally checked the concrete under them. THERE WAS NO CRACK on the concrete. After the next winter the same tiles were cracked again. Since it was barely noticeable we did not care anymore. But still don't know why this happened. After some 25 years we also got a few cracks on some walls. Nothing major. I had them repaired and the contractor who did the repairs told me that Houston is full of cracks. We moved in here in 2008 and there was a small crack on a wall that the builder repaired. It's now 2015 and no cracks. We know that there was a crack in the slab in the bedroom. The people who tiled the bedroom took care of it. We have a post tension slab. For now there are no cracks anywhere.
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:03 PM
 
391 posts, read 784,369 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised View Post
They also sell something by that name at the adult stores. Statistically speaking, some applied colors stretch more than others.
Haha!
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Old 01-28-2015, 11:38 AM
 
Location: galaxy far far away
3,110 posts, read 5,359,091 times
Reputation: 7280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippyman View Post
No one cares as much about your financial future as you do.


That should be emblazoned on billboards across the country, added to high school and college diplomas, and tattooed inside the eyeballs of our burgeoning millenial generation...

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