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Old 03-17-2008, 05:43 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
5,457 posts, read 13,507,449 times
Reputation: 4393
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverbear View Post
VP -- The tone of this makes me a little nervous. You've made so many good contributions to this board -- to the point that I respect your posts even when we disagree. Nevertheless, the tone here suggests we may be hearing from another Irwin in the future. If you really leave with positive memories of only the Sun Devils (a surprising outcome given some of your prior posts) and otherwise have negative feelings about Phoenix, then I'll hope you focus on productive posts in the boards for LA, San Diego, Denver, or wherever you end up. Good luck no matter where life takes you.
Thanks for the words of respect, silverbear. Ok, I think I exaggerated a little; there are all kinds of little things here and there I'll miss; especially the whole college experience, meeting all kinds of new people, all those weekends exploring Phoenix on bike before I had a car, living on my own for the first time. What I mean is, there's not much intrinsic about this place itself, independent of the memories of my time spent here, that I'll miss, at least not enough to make me want to continue living here. I need to continue my education since the field I want to go into is not what I majored in, and ASU won't even accept me since I don't meet their prerequisites, but USC will-- and USC happens to be the best school of the ones I applied to. So even if I did want to keep living here, I'd have to move to another city/ another school for at least a year anyway. I used to visit Phoenix at least once a year growing up, and I'll probably stop by from time to time on my grand circuit roadtrips I have planned throughout the southwest. (Denver to Utah to Las Vegas to San Diego to Phoenix to northern Arizona (Sedona, Flagstaff, etc) to Albuquerque and Santa Fe to back home. Or if I live in San Diego, same trip, just the reverse direction).

I sense that Phoenix, in terms of building urban cores and becoming more bustling, diverse, and interesting, is moving in the right direction, but the pace of Phoenix urban development and city-ification feels painfully slow to me. Valley Native, a poster I greatly respect, frequently identifies the reasons why. I only have one life to live, and I don't feel like waiting another 20, 30 years to wait for a downtown that *might* get better. I want a place where the results are apparent now. Meanwhile, I've found that I'm sick of extreme heat (when I first moved here, I actually kind of liked it, mainly because I had never experienced heat so intense before, so it felt kind of "exotic") and with every new house built on the fringes of town, every new parking lot created, the urban heat island effect gets worse and worse. True, every city has an urban heat island effect, but it's only a major problem that negatively affects quality of life in Phoenix, which is hot enough as it is. Denver, for example, has average summer night low temperatures in the mid-60s. Who cares if a heat island there makes that 5 degrees warmer? Whether it's 63, 65, or even 70 degrees, summer nights there are extremely comfortable. After shuffling back and forth the last several years between summer and winter breaks between Denver and Phoenix, I can confidently say I vastly prefer cool and even cold weather to extreme heat. I don't mind snow at all. I might be in a minority camp here, but that's the camp I'm in.

If Phoenix was the same exact city it is today, but bumped up another 2, 3 or 4,000 feet in elevation and moved another 100 miles north, with a high-desert climate like, say, Kingman, AZ or Albuquerque, NM, I think it would be a great place to live, and I'd shut up and make do with the extremely limited urban areas that exist. If Phoenix were just as hot as it is today, in the same exact location, but the city was replaced with a booming, kick-*** city like Chicago, I might be willing to put up with the heat for the great reward of being in such a cool city. But it offers none of those things. I think we all need to understand that everybody has different wants and different needs; for some people Phoenix is just what the doctor ordered, and offers the best possible combination of cost of living, jobs, climate, scenery, activities, etc. For others though, myself included, Phoenix is definitely not the best package deal. If there's one last thing I could say to people on this forum and to potential movers, it is this: Phoenix is an ACQUIRED taste. It's great for some people, but it is NOT for everybody.

 
Old 03-17-2008, 07:17 PM
 
997 posts, read 1,072,940 times
Reputation: 1260
vegaspilgrim: "Phoenix is an ACQUIRED taste. It's great for some people, but it is NOT for everybody."

True of every place on the planet.

 
Old 03-17-2008, 07:45 PM
 
87 posts, read 203,870 times
Reputation: 27
San Diego is indeed a nice climate. When I lived in Lisbon, Portugal temporairly, I often said the climate there was almost the same. If you do a climate comparision between the two cities, they really are almost the same.

It's just too expensive to live in San Diego so it's either Phoenix or Las Vegas for me at the end of August. Been in Seattle since 94 and it's time for a change.

Vegas, now that you said the above about PHX, which would you choose LV or PHX? I know you recently went back to LV for a visit.
 
Old 03-17-2008, 07:45 PM
 
Location: Chesterfield, MO
386 posts, read 1,061,389 times
Reputation: 176
I wouldn't live in Phoenix because I like the color green and 115 degrees sounds about as awesome as chewing on hot coals.

But most Denver cheerleading comes from people not actually living in Denver......
 
Old 03-17-2008, 08:06 PM
 
Location: Everywhere
1,921 posts, read 758,285 times
Reputation: 346
no, only my post is correct....everybody else is wrong. I say Phoenix is better and that should be the end of it. Phoenix is hot, and Denver can ROT, Id give you more rhymes, but thats all I got.
 
Old 03-17-2008, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
5,457 posts, read 13,507,449 times
Reputation: 4393
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2PAK View Post
Vegas, now that you said the above about PHX, which would you choose LV or PHX? I know you recently went back to LV for a visit.
Hmm, now that's a tough one! Las Vegas is one of my favorite cities, and I toyed with the idea of moving there at one point in time but I've never been serious about living there. I'd say it depends on what you're looking for, what kind of "vibe" you want, and what you do for a living. Vegas is really a two-industry town: resort/gaming/entertainment and home building/construction-- as well as all the services needed to sustain the people who work in the above two industries. I don't consider Phoenix a well diversified economy either (home building/construction is THE number one industry here too), but compared to Las Vegas, Phoenix offers a lot more options career-wise. Vegas (off the strip) right now is in a MAJOR slump, hit even harder than Phoenix by the housing market crash. Las Vegas is the entertainment mecca, obviously, but surprisingly, most locals don't go to the strip all that often. They do frequent a lot of off-strip casinos, such as the Red Rock. If you only casually partake in nightlife, you may really like Scottsdale.

I personally think Vegas has a better location within the southwest when it comes to roadtrips. The Spring Mountains (including Mt Charleston) is one of my favorite places, and it's less than an hour from the center of town. I prefer Vegas's climate to Phoenix's, however, I personally prefer the scenery and vegetation of the Sonoran desert to the Mohave desert; there is nothing on earth like the Sonoran desert-- especially this time of the year when it is extremely green and lush. (Unfortunately climate & vegetation go hand in hand-- you can't have it all!) Also, a lot of the new neighborhoods constructed on the edges of the Las Vegas Valley look like crap. Summerlin is my favorite area, but you also pay sky high prices (almost California-level prices) to live there. I think Phoenix has a wider range of neighborhoods, both old and new, to choose from, at a wider range of prices than Las Vegas. So overall, I don't know... it's a toss up, but I think I might give Phoenix the edge when it comes to living, Vegas the edge when it comes to visiting. Especially if you have kids. With no kids, the scales are a little more equal.
 
Old 03-18-2008, 01:16 AM
 
Location: New Mexico to Texas
4,584 posts, read 9,082,515 times
Reputation: 1940
I cant believe people move to Phoenix and Vegas just to be close to a city they cant afford.You would rather suffer the Phoenix temps and the lack of a city to be closer to San Diego.To me it makes no sense, I really like Dallas but Im not going to move to a crappy city like Oklahoma City to be closer to Dallas cause I couldnt afford it.

There are so many nicer places than Phoenix or Vegas in the southwest region,but if you love suburb after suburb and spending lots of time in traffic and driving from one end of the city to the other than those are great choices for you.
 
Old 03-18-2008, 10:22 AM
 
599 posts, read 1,497,514 times
Reputation: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim View Post
If Phoenix were just as hot as it is today, in the same exact location, but the city was replaced with a booming, kick-*** city like Chicago, I might be willing to put up with the heat for the great reward of being in such a cool city.
I grew up in a city north of Chicago. I've spent some time in Chicago, but mostly drove through to other places. Most of Chicago looks dirty and old to me. Apparently I haven't seen the "great" of Chicago. What makes Chicago great?
 
Old 03-18-2008, 10:32 AM
 
2,755 posts, read 8,211,726 times
Reputation: 1358
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCoDude View Post
But most Denver cheerleading comes from people not actually living in Denver......
Sure, this is the Phoenix forum? Not going to have a lot of Denver people even around to witness this discussion.

I like Denver, but I'm not really into these City A versus City B discussions. I'm of the opinion that most places have some strong selling points, if appreciated on their own terms. Even some places that, on paper, look like dreadful places to live are often redeemed by the people you'll meet there.

On the topic at hand, Denver and Phoenix tend to draw somewhat different sets, so citizens of the two cities are mostly talking different languages. One of the main reasons people move to Phoenix is climate, which is certainly different than Denver, as well as most of the U.S ("better" weather is purely a matter of taste). Denver's big selling point tends to be proximity to skiing, mountaineering, and other recreational sports, though Phoenix does have the advantage of being in the Mountain West as well with its own natural wonders.

For my taste, I pick Denver, but if I couldn't have it, I'd probably be interested in other western cities like Phoenix, Salt Lake City, Albuquerque, Portland, or Boise (California is way too crowded). I like the wide open spaces, mountains, and scenery of the west, and I think that any of the west's cities main appeal is offering jobs to make a living to enjoy relatively uncrowded access to that kind of recreation.
 
Old 03-18-2008, 11:12 AM
 
Location: Western Chicagoland
18,533 posts, read 48,413,937 times
Reputation: 7278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Joy View Post
I grew up in a city north of Chicago. I've spent some time in Chicago, but mostly drove through to other places. Most of Chicago looks dirty and old to me. Apparently I haven't seen the "great" of Chicago. What makes Chicago great?
Did you drive through with your eyes closed or something?

Dont want to get off topic, so you can visit the Chicago boards and find the "Chicago pictures" thread and see for yourself.
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