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Old 09-09-2018, 12:14 PM
 
3,229 posts, read 2,240,423 times
Reputation: 3418

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KurtAZ View Post
So...if we take your $232k average on Zillow, and look for 3/2s in Maricopa County...you get West Valley (Glendale, South Mountain, etc.) and fringe East Valley (West Mesa). Nothing in the desirable areas (Best places to raise a family). Median home value...sure but there are going to be the low value homes (sub $200s in Alhambra, older Glendale, etc) and then everything above $250. Most of the new homes being built in the East Valley are "Starting in the mid-$300s" according to the signs...which means when all is said and done, you are in the $400s.

I understand that there needs to be a measuring stick when comparing affordability...but your experience in Tempe in '01 would be different now in 2018. It may change again in 2020...when a lot of professionals expect a decline in housing values again. Time will tell. Most of the time...I feel like all those reports put out touting the affordability of Phoenix Metro and the quality of life quotient espoused like the above article are engineered by our Chamber of Commerce and the Realtors Association to convince people to move here.

The fact of the matter is, the OP is asking if they should take a pay cut to move to the Phoenix Metro. As others from PA that have moved here have indicated...it is not much less expensive to live here than PA. Now that is going to take in a lot of factors...we have relatives living in rural PA that have a much bigger home than ours on 2.5 acres that is less expensive than our home in Chandler. Homes in Philadelphia would probably be much more expensive and carry a heavier tax burden...although a $5k difference in property taxes as noted before is really NOT that much in the greater scheme of things. Just wait...property taxes will be going up after November as the education funding in this state takes center stage and <whomever wins> will start looking for additional funding for the schools.
What you're saying makes sense but I don't see quite as cut and dry for the following reasons-

1. The premium paid to live in a major metro's most desirable areas is going to exist anywhere else, if you have to 70K to 170K to get into a desierable area of Phoenix the same is going to true elsewhere. The average price in Phoenix is $232K in Philly it's $282K, so add the same amount on top of the average to live in King of Prussia or whatever other nice suburb of Philly you'd want to be in. I'd say you're still better off if the average price point is lower.

2. When you say there are nothing in desirable areas available near the average home price, I agree it's limited but if you want to get into Gilbert under $250K it's still possible. I had some friends at work recently buy in Gilbert and another set in Chandler at a slightly higher budget.

Yes, it's limited and there's no endless options but you can still find some.
https://www.redfin.com/AZ/Gilbert/13.../home/27933601

3. The problems here feel much less dramatic then when I travel elsewhere, yes it's become more challenging and compared to living in rural mountain towns of central PA or anywhere else it does cost more, but compared to other major cities the salary/col ratio here has stayed fairly affordable.
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:21 PM
 
7,953 posts, read 13,746,748 times
Reputation: 9164
Quote:
Originally Posted by locolife View Post
What you're saying makes sense but I don't see quite as cut and dry for the following reasons-

1. The premium paid to live in a major metro's most desirable areas is going to exist anywhere else, if you have to 70K to 170K to get into a desierable area of Phoenix the same is going to true elsewhere. The average price in Phoenix is $232K in Philly it's $282K, so add the same amount on top of the average to live in King of Prussia or whatever other nice suburb of Philly you'd want to be in. I'd say you're still better off if the average price point is lower.

2. When you say there are nothing in desirable areas available near the average home price, I agree it's limited but if you want to get into Gilbert under $250K it's still possible. I had some friends at work recently buy in Gilbert and another set in Chandler at a slightly higher budget.

Yes, it's limited and there's no endless options but you can still find some.
https://www.redfin.com/AZ/Gilbert/13.../home/27933601

3. The problems here feel much less dramatic then when I travel elsewhere, yes it's become more challenging and compared to living in rural mountain towns of central PA or anywhere else it does cost more, but compared to other major cities the salary/col ratio here has stayed fairly affordable.
I agree with much of what you say, but for someone to move across country seeking a better quality of life only to move into that dump, is quite a sad thought. A 1300 sq ft house on a 3k sq ft yard in questionable condition that is in need of a full renovation for $225k is hardly a bargain when compared to some other parts of the country. There are places where that will still get your something decent, but clearly no longer here.
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:29 PM
 
3,229 posts, read 2,240,423 times
Reputation: 3418
Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitN8V View Post
I agree with much of what you say, but for someone to move across country seeking a better quality of life only to move into that dump, is quite a sad thought. A 1300 sq ft house on a 3k sq ft yard in questionable condition that is in need of a full renovation for $225k is hardly a bargain when compared to some other parts of the country. There are places where that will still get your something decent, but clearly no longer here.
Yeah, maybe there's some hidden gems out there, I travel a fair amount for work and have not run into many major cities where you can grab a fully remodeled home in a very desirable area for under $250K without being on the fringes of town.
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Old 09-09-2018, 03:26 PM
 
944 posts, read 1,031,232 times
Reputation: 1046
OP, visit Phoenix first – right now is a great time to check it out and see if the heat is something you can live with. Some people come here and fall in love with the desert, but then there are some who absolutely hate it. Check it out before you make any decisions. If you do decide to move, rent first. The housing market has gone up quite a bit over the last few years, and at some point there’s bound to be a correction. At the very least it will shift to the buyers market eventually. It will give you a chance to get your bearings and find an area that you like to settle in permanently.
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Old 09-09-2018, 07:40 PM
 
Location: San Antonio
4,429 posts, read 9,395,449 times
Reputation: 4151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesop. View Post
Present evidence to prove phoenix is not an affordable city.
From a renters perspective, Phoenix is expensive.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/mone...udy/338127002/

And it's getting more expensive every year. This is a hot market for rental resales, which increases rent prices. My complex was sold last month. The complex across the street was also sold in the past 6 weeks or so. A complex about 4 blocks away was sold earlier this year. Rents are higher now than when I moved in, less than a year ago. I was factoring on a rent increase of $100/mo or less when my lease renews in December, but now I think it may be more than that. My rent is around 33-35% of net/takehome pay right now, and I make a decent wage. The "market" rate of my unit was $900 at move in, it's now being touted at $1150.

If I want to buy a house, PHX is out of my price range. I've already started researching more affordable housing markets.

And to whomever said Dallas was cheap, you haven't looked at rents there. They are higher than here but salaries are about the same for my field (accounting).
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Old 09-09-2018, 07:54 PM
 
Location: Arizona
1,052 posts, read 2,852,258 times
Reputation: 449
Quote:
Originally Posted by yukon View Post
From a renters perspective, Phoenix is expensive.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/mone...udy/338127002/

And it's getting more expensive every year. This is a hot market for rental resales, which increases rent prices. My complex was sold last month. The complex across the street was also sold in the past 6 weeks or so. A complex about 4 blocks away was sold earlier this year. Rents are higher now than when I moved in, less than a year ago. I was factoring on a rent increase of $100/mo or less when my lease renews in December, but now I think it may be more than that. My rent is around 33-35% of net/takehome pay right now, and I make a decent wage. The "market" rate of my unit was $900 at move in, it's now being touted at $1150.

If I want to buy a house, PHX is out of my price range. I've already started researching more affordable housing markets.

And to whomever said Dallas was cheap, you haven't looked at rents there. They are higher than here but salaries are about the same for my field (accounting).
All this. And no, Dallas isn’t cheap now by any stretch. One reason I’m here. Only affordable on the outskirts and even then, property taxes are ridic, which helped push me away.

In my field, looking at Salary.com for instance, salaries are comparable. But for the jobs I’ve seen that show salaries, they seem to be a great deal lower here.

I just wouldn’t do a pay cut moving here, to be on the safe side no matter what.
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Old 09-09-2018, 11:03 PM
 
Location: Uptown Phoenix, AZ
5,118 posts, read 4,564,951 times
Reputation: 4523
Quote:
Originally Posted by yukon View Post
From a renters perspective, Phoenix is expensive.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/mone...udy/338127002/

And it's getting more expensive every year. This is a hot market for rental resales, which increases rent prices. My complex was sold last month. The complex across the street was also sold in the past 6 weeks or so. A complex about 4 blocks away was sold earlier this year. Rents are higher now than when I moved in, less than a year ago. I was factoring on a rent increase of $100/mo or less when my lease renews in December, but now I think it may be more than that. My rent is around 33-35% of net/takehome pay right now, and I make a decent wage. The "market" rate of my unit was $900 at move in, it's now being touted at $1150.

If I want to buy a house, PHX is out of my price range. I've already started researching more affordable housing markets.

And to whomever said Dallas was cheap, you haven't looked at rents there. They are higher than here but salaries are about the same for my field (accounting).
Why not New Orleans since you're already a Saints fan? I'm just joking I heard New Orleans is expensive now too. I'm curious to see where you end up looking though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KurtAZ View Post
So...if we take your $232k average on Zillow, and look for 3/2s in Maricopa County...you get West Valley (Glendale, South Mountain, etc.) and fringe East Valley (West Mesa). Nothing in the desirable areas (Best places to raise a family). Median home value...sure but there are going to be the low value homes (sub $200s in Alhambra, older Glendale, etc) and then everything above $250. Most of the new homes being built in the East Valley are "Starting in the mid-$300s" according to the signs...which means when all is said and done, you are in the $400s.

I understand that there needs to be a measuring stick when comparing affordability...but your experience in Tempe in '01 would be different now in 2018. It may change again in 2020...when a lot of professionals expect a decline in housing values again. Time will tell. Most of the time...I feel like all those reports put out touting the affordability of Phoenix Metro and the quality of life quotient espoused like the above article are engineered by our Chamber of Commerce and the Realtors Association to convince people to move here.

The fact of the matter is, the OP is asking if they should take a pay cut to move to the Phoenix Metro. As others from PA that have moved here have indicated...it is not much less expensive to live here than PA. Now that is going to take in a lot of factors...we have relatives living in rural PA that have a much bigger home than ours on 2.5 acres that is less expensive than our home in Chandler. Homes in Philadelphia would probably be much more expensive and carry a heavier tax burden...although a $5k difference in property taxes as noted before is really NOT that much in the greater scheme of things. Just wait...property taxes will be going up after November as the education funding in this state takes center stage and <whomever wins> will start looking for additional funding for the schools.
Hey now, nothing wrong with West Valley. Laveen seems like a fairly decent area (wouldn't do Estrella though personally) and seems to offer some bargains. It's not too deep into West Valley either where you are looking at a commute from hell. The 202 extension will cause Laveen to boom I can guarantee that. I haven't been down that way since the 202 though, last time I was over there I was trying to get to far western edge of Maricopa (town) from Glendale and it was easier to go down 51st avenue than deal with the I-10 at the time. West Valley last I checked was having the largest housing boom in the metro. Otherwise, good post.

OP if you are like me and open minded to a condo or townhouse, you can get into some good areas still. But it also depends on your standards and budget. Saw a dream townhouse (at least to me) which was in the best school district in Phoenix (Madison), close to restaurants and shopping, and was sub-300k and updated. HOA was high but included all utilities like the A/C, cable, electric, etc. which is why I think it's still on the market. But for a single-family house, you can kiss living in town goodbye unless you have a really good job or are willing to take on something old. Nothing wrong with old either, but people who move out here seem to be really opposed to old construction.

Last edited by Prickly Pear; 09-09-2018 at 11:49 PM..
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Old 09-10-2018, 12:42 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
31 posts, read 15,766 times
Reputation: 66
I pay $1,500 for a studio in Denver. Phoenix is affordable.
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Old 09-10-2018, 12:59 AM
 
7,953 posts, read 13,746,748 times
Reputation: 9164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesop. View Post
I pay $1,500 for a studio in Denver. Phoenix is affordable.
Sorry to hear about your lack of a bedroom, but that proves nothing. By that standard, Denver is “affordable” as well, since there are $1500 studios here. Check out Cityscape in Phoenix or West 6 in Tempe, for example.
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Old 09-10-2018, 01:23 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
31 posts, read 15,766 times
Reputation: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitN8V View Post
Sorry to hear about your lack of a bedroom, but that proves nothing. By that standard, Denver is “affordable” as well, since there are $1500 studios here. Check out Cityscape in Phoenix or West 6 in Tempe, for example.
Phoenix is affordable.
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