Phoenix Job Growth (Sun City: sales, 2014, insurance)

[FirebirdCamaro1220]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Don't worry. Your side already won the battle. Socialism seems to be accepted now more than ever in this country. As a result, we have an outrageously bloated public system that every taxpayer is obligated to subsidize, regardless of how much of a hardship it can be on an individual or household. I hope you're happy.



Seriously? I went to a secular private school. To this day, I'm about as non religious as you can get. Even so, what's the big deal if a school is financed with private money by wealthy donors? That's certainly better than grabbing everybody's tax money and feeding the beast known as public education.



We've had these discussions previously, and we obviously have differing viewpoints. It's fine and dandy if you don't mind handing over your money to the government. The schools are hungry for every dollar you can give them ... however, where it goes from there is anybody's guess. Ten years from now, I'll probably be living somewhere like Sun City where I can finally get some relief from paying that ridiculous school tax every year. Incidentally, it should be fully the parents' responsibility to raise & support the children which they chose to give life to, not all of society.

Unless you want to change the laws to make primary education no longer mandatory, and are ok with a bunch of uneducated criminals walking around, not going to happen....

[Hschlick84]

Over educated students lead to this, more indoctrination and brainwashing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MqghqCoC4A

[FirebirdCamaro1220]

Originally Posted by Hschlick84

Over educated students lead to this, more indoctrination and brainwashing.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MqghqCoC4A

We're talking primary education, not secondary. Try to keep up

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Don't worry. Your side already won the battle. Socialism seems to be accepted now more than ever in this country. As a result, we have an outrageously bloated public system that every taxpayer is obligated to subsidize, regardless of how much of a hardship it can be on an individual or household. I hope you're happy..

I've benefited economically from the USA style system. If you are smarter than average and work harder than average (and you pick the right field to work in; often by some luck), you can be grossly overpaid for your services. That said, you need to get out to Sweden or Norway for example to appreciate what "socialism" has to offer. When you see it in action, it's not a swear word. I predict you personally could have a higher standard of living. The Swedes don't take advantage of socialism like we do with our government systems. So if you don't see the downside of capitalism, then you need to think deeper. I've personal benefited big time. So have my kids. My point is no system is perfect.

At the same token, if you want to see how bleak socialism can work (with the "help" of the our government), head off to Cuba. I was there about a month ago. Doctors get paid $45 a month.... Really. All and all, I was extremely impressed by the Norwegian like systems. Since I'm as greedy as the next guy, I like the way I'm gaming this supposedly great system here in the USA. Never mind it leaves behind well over 1/2 of the population. Want proof? Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett are wealthier than poorest half of US! https://www.theguardian.com/business...est-half-of-us

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

We've had these discussions previously, and we obviously have differing viewpoints. It's fine and dandy if you don't mind handing over your money to the government. The schools are hungry for every dollar you can give them ... however, where it goes from there is anybody's guess. Ten years from now, I'll probably be living somewhere like Sun City where I can finally get some relief from paying that ridiculous school tax every year. Incidentally, it should be fully the parents' responsibility to raise & support the children which they chose to give life to, not all of society.

I look at it from a different perspective. I want the kids to have the same opportunity as I had. They may chose to waste their opportunity, but many others won't. The 80-20 rule is alive and well. So while our kids went to a well funded school where a solid 25% didn't pass the standardized tests, others kicked arse like our kids. Soon, both of our kids will be paying mega dollars in the state and federal coffers (one is out; and the other has many more years to go). There all all kids of other 20% (80-20 rule) that are kicking butt that will be doing the same (paying a lot in taxes).

Now let's use your approach. In the spirit of making sure there is no waste, go ahead and cut out dollars so that the 20% who were motivated and parented well get a diluted education. That's terrible ROI. Furthermore, if funding the schools (yea, there will ALWAYS be waste) means that I have to pay more in property taxes, then so be it. To be clear, I fully realize there will be waste anytime you spend other peoples $$'s. I viewed the solution of having to pay more in taxes by simply making more money so than I have more than I need. If your $1500-$2000 in school tax is breaking your bank (enough to relocate to Sun City), then I propose you made some less than ideal career and investment choices. Take my approach and don't be bitter about a couple Grand a year. Because there are people counting on it.

Even if you completely disagree with what I said, "perception becomes reality". It is perceived that the AZ schools are underfunded. That's going to keep a certain level of educated families away from the state. It's also keeping some businesses away. Even if every single $$ of tax increase was a waste (and OF COURSE that's not the case), getting out of the bottom tier of spending (even to the middle of the pack) will be good for PHX perception as a whole. It should be obvious. YMMV. But in my eyes, it's not up for debate. The net-net is well funded schools matter. I am all about saying NO to levy's for a couple of rounds until a lot of waste is out of the system. There isn't nearly as much waste as their use to be.

[KurtAZ]

Originally Posted by FirebirdCamaro1220

We're talking primary education, not secondary. Try to keep up

Just dreaming that over-educated kids will lead to his dream of whorehouses.

[Returning2USA]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

I've benefited economically from the USA style system. If you are smarter than average and work harder than average (and you pick the right field to work in; often by some luck), you can be grossly overpaid for your services. That said, you need to get out to Sweden or Norway for example to appreciate what "socialism" has to offer. When you see it in action, it's not a swear word. I predict you personally could have a higher standard of living. The Swedes don't take advantage of socialism like we do with our government systems. So if you don't see the downside of capitalism, then you need to think deeper. I've personal benefited big time. So have my kids. My point is no system is perfect.

At the same token, if you want to see how bleak socialism can work (with the "help" of the our government), head off to Cuba. I was there about a month ago. Doctors get paid $45 a month.... Really. All and all, I was extremely impressed by the Norwegian like systems. Since I'm as greedy as the next guy, I like the way I'm gaming this supposedly great system here in the USA. Never mind it leaves behind well over 1/2 of the population. Want proof? Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett are wealthier than poorest half of US! https://www.theguardian.com/business...est-half-of-us

Yes, Sweden is a good example but Sweden and Scandinavia and their model cannot be compared to
The US, or be possible in the US.

Sweden does not have:

Wall St banks

A military-industrial complex. Pentagon and 15+
MIC corporations to drain taxpayer money

Not as much corruption as the US.

Higher IQs in general at about 102 on average.

Sweden does not have powerful corporate lobbies

Big pharma


That said, I have distant family in Sweden and Swedes be "Socialist" to a fault.

[Hschlick84]

Originally Posted by KurtAZ

Just dreaming that over-educated kids will lead to his dream of whorehouses.

Seriously, what's your problem man?

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by Hschlick84

Over educated students lead to this, more indoctrination and brainwashing.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MqghqCoC4A

"Over educated"? How about barely educated. The video you showed was full of people that were on the left side of the bell shaped curve specifically in the brainpower department. Saying that, they are not alone. 60% of Americans want "free" tuition. https://www.cnbc.com/2016/08/01/over...rvey-says.html

[wase4711]

maybe if these universities would stop paying football/basketball/whatever coaches millions per year in salaries, and, the same goes for their deans/presidents, etc college wouldnt be so insanely overpriced for ALL kids..

kinda makes you sick, doesnt it..

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa...01pg4omwulw3ar