Block vs. Stick-Built Homes (Tucson, Scottsdale: crime, new home, neighborhood)

[Andre5140]

I am looking at houses in south Tempe (near Guadalupe and McClintock) and two have caught my eye:

One is a 1,100 sq ft stick home from 1985 in Kyrene schools. (stick home)

The other is a 1900 sq ft fixer upper from 1973 with larger yard, pool, and block construction. It is in Country Club Way neighborhood off Guadalupe.

I like the idea of block. It is solid, termite-proof and *SEEMS* to be more energy efficient.

Thoughts on energy savings?
Block is anti-termite but does it create more places for roaches and rats?
Also, one has an orange tree. Why are these citrus trees so coveted if they attract rats?

Thoughts on the home construction (and even the neighborhood) are welcomed and appreciated!

Thanks!

[twiggy]

The rats aren't really up that far south yet. I have a block on bottom, wood on top. The block does seem to make it cooler in the day but at night it radiates the heat it absorbs all day. Good anti termite. Harder to renovate (husbands a plumber). But all in all I think block would be best. Roaches like both, get a cat if you don't like them. Since I got a cat (at first against my will), I no longer see the roaches or crickets or anything alive. He hunts them all night. If a male cat get him fixed early. Females are better hunters though. Don't get a foofoo cat, persians don't hunt. Should take care of any rats in the future to! Hope this helps.

[Ponderosa]

Block has lousy insulative properties. It must be much thicker than the standard construction brick or block to even begin to approach the R-value of a framed and insulated wall. A lot of those older homes were built with 2x2 furring over the block and, in some cases, none at all.

The other side of things is that, if you can do the work yourself, fixer-uppers are good deals. The sweat equity accumulates quickly. If you have to pay someone to do things it is a lot harder to get return on investment.

[exit2lef]

I've got a block wall house and love it. I honestly can't tell you about its energy efficiency because I haven't lived in another type of house of comparable size. What I love about the block, however, is its sturdiness and sound insulation. I just has a more solid feel than anything else I've ever lived in.

As for citrus, the trees have a pleasant scent, look nice, add shade, and produce fruit. All those qualities can outweigh the danger of rat visits, which can be minimized by not letting fallen fruit rot on the ground.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by silverbear

I've got a block wall house and love it. I honestly can't tell you about its energy efficiency because I haven't lived in another type of house of comparable size. What I love about the block, however, is its sturdiness and sound insulation. I just has a more solid feel than anything else I've ever lived in.

As for citrus, the trees have a pleasant scent, look nice, add shade, and produce fruit. All those qualities can outweigh the danger of rat visits, which can be minimized by not letting fallen fruit rot on the ground.

I lived in a block home for several years and agree with the sense of solid structure they provide. The three little pigs made a good point.

Someone commented on how block might be better for termites, and that is true - but only if the house were entirely block. In reality, most block construction has furred walls, drywall (they eat the paper), and wooden roof members. The block provide convenient and protected cavities for termites to build their tubes to the framing elements. So you need to be vigilant for termites even with block homes.

[country pride]

Ever heard of E-Crete? Its energy efficient, similar to block but lighter in weight and just as sturdy, termites and other critters cant occupy within it. We've built a lot in the past and every one of the owners love it, the energy efficiency has been incredible, wont burn like stick built homes and pretty inexpensive in comparison to some other building materials. I would be impressed.
The one thing too, I find amusing is when people try to push those stick built homes onto some potential new homeowners and say '...they are 2x6's now, not 2x4's...' and someone else replies '....oh good, more wood to burn, in a fire...' (Ive heard that subject come up on many jobsites between builders and generals).

[Andre5140]

Very interesting points. Thanks everyone!

Yeah, I understand what you mean about sweat equity. Seems like a lot of house but it's also the most expensive. I like the neighborhood, too.

With respect to block radiating the heat at night that it collected throughout the day, I can totally understand that one. This effect relaly concerns me since the block house I'm looking at faces east with the rear facing west. Seems to be plenty of shade trees in the yard though and the idea of seeing a sunset straight out of my rear kitchen window sounds appealing.

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

Block has lousy insulative properties. It must be much thicker than the standard construction brick or block to even begin to approach the R-value of a framed and insulated wall. A lot of those older homes were built with 2x2 furring over the block and, in some cases, none at all.

Thanks, Ponderosa. Coming from the midwest where block homes are not prevelant, I was curious what, if anything, was between the drywall/plaster and blocks.

If block radiates heat, why was it ever so popular in the valley? Still, the thought of a solid home is appealing enough. That is, until you consider that I'm moving out of my RV to a better insulated, easier-to-cool home

Keep thoughts coming!

Best,

Andre5140

[Ponderosa]

Older houses here had fewer windows than today and that is a huge factor in heat gain/loss and helps offset the less efficient construction practices of the day. No one really thought much about energy conservation before the oil embargos. I had a house in Tucson that was just "slump block", no insulation, no drywall on interior walls. That was in '72 or so. But then we cooled with an evaporative cooler so it probably did not matter.

That's a thought too. You can save a bundle of money using an evap cooler. If the house you are looking at has a roof top A/C, it is pretty easy to put in a piggyback cooler. Tile roofs and ground mounted condensers killed the seasonal use of coolers.

[sablebaby]

I like block homes, they are much better than the stick homes from the 80's. We had one when I was growing up, but we had termites and many on our block had them, too. I never heard of block homes being termite-free. There is still some wood in the house for them to eat. One friend had one wall completely chewed up from termites in a block home. The sad thing was that we had just installed tile throughout the house and then had to have them drill holes every foot throughout.

[aj661]

1973, Guadalupe and McClintock? May be a Suggs Home. They built great houses. I grew up in a Cox block home in Scottsdale-very similar floorplans. Boring by today's standards but a very efficient use of space. A frame home from 1985 vs. a block home from '73 may be a toss up for electricity costs. They should both be SRP which beats APS for rates hands down. The comment on an evap is a good suggestion. I had a piggy back on a frame home built in 1986. I only needed the a/c during the monsoon and the swap cooler costs next to nothing to run. Also we installed dampers (brand name Up-Dux Up-Dux ® The Comfort Maker Ceiling Things!) in the ceiling so we didn't need windows open when running the swap cooler. This had the added benefit of cooling the air in the attic. Also, if the previous owners haven't installed energy efficient windows, do it.

I'm not a termite expert so I don't know everything about them, but we do have them in the far east valley. Ours are easy to spot: Look for 1/4 inch wide mud tubes coming up from the ground on your foundation. According to one of the guys who treated my house, they travel back and forth between the ground and the food source-they don't establish colonies in your home. On the rare occasion I've found a tube, I just knock it off, dig a small trench at the base and pour a heavy concentration of insecticide in it. The last one I treated myself has been dormant for almost a year.

If you are interested in Crime stats, here's the link for Tempe PD's crime analysis unit. If you go to the "Beat Information" link from there, you can check the numbers and types of crimes going back to 2000. You can even narrow it down with the house address.
City of Tempe - Crime Analysis

Good Luck. BTW, my vote goes to the block home if only for nostalgic reasons.