Relocating to Phoenix (Tucson, Mesa, Scottsdale: transplants, getaway, employment)

[Robin Holland]

I'm not relocating to Phoenix but two of my friends are considering it. There are a lot of posts regarding this matter on here so it can be rather confusing. To try to simplify it for me, can anybody suggest any positive qualities at all regarding Phoenix in amongst all of the negative posts regarding the heat, the high random crime, the lack of urban culture, the pollution, the dust, valley-fever, the poor educational system, the unfriendly people and the strip-malls that I keep reading about? I understand the crime is high compared to most cities, but are these other things all factual or actual?

Thanks!

[silverbear]

Phoenix-area pros:


Outdoor recreation -- Few cities, if any, have as many miles of hiking trails within city limits. For me, this is the single greatest asset of the city.

Access to varied scenery and climate -- Phoenix is situated within two hours of pine forests, ski slopes, etc., allowing for a relatively easy getaway when needed.

Good cultural and performing arts facilities -- The Heard Museum, Phoenix Art Museum, Actor's Theater of Phoenix, and Arizona Theater Company are all first-rate. Sure, there may be even more attractions of this type in some other cities, but there are few cities that offers such a good balance between indoor and outdoor pursuits.

Good business climate for entrepreneurs and small business -- some of which have actually grown into large, locally-based corporations

Sense of opportunity and openness -- Being part of an "old boy network" matters far less here than in some places



Phoenix-area cons:


Summer heat

Lack of civic pride / inferiority complex on the part of many residents

Uncontrolled growth at the edges of the metro area

Too many new arrivals with unrealistic expectations and insufficient knowledge of the area

Perception of high crime (far worse than the reality in my experience)


With the exception of the summer heat, most of the negatives are not intrinsic to the area, but instead are byproducts of the circumstances under which people relocate to Phoenix. A lot of new arrivals come from small towns and do not have a realistic understanding of the challenges of urban life. Others that do come from major cities engage in unrealistic comparisons to their cities of origin rather than appreciating Phoenix on its own terms. Finally, some transplants are fleeing urban problems from their own hometowns and try to isolate themselves from the overall metro area rather than working to make it a better place. If your friends do not arrive with any of those unrealistic mindsets, they're more likely to be happy here.

With all that in mind, Phoenix has worked well for me for nearly two decades, but no place is appropriate for everyone. Your friends should visit and intensively research the area before making a decision.

[Boatdrinks]

Based on your response to the crime thread above, I was under the impression that you had factual knowledge that crime was worse here then it is in other large cities. I asked in that thread if you could post your sources b/c I'm very interested in reading the studies.

I've lived in big cities and I've lived in very small towns. I can tell you that my personal experience has been that crime here in Phoenix is no worse then it is in any other large city. As I posted in the other thread, there are horrible crimes committed in small towns just as there are in big cities. There are obviously more of them committed in big cities b/c there are more people. There is crime everywhere. You can not escape it. If your friend wants to move to a big city, that's just a fact they'll need to deal with.

As for your impression that people here are rude, I strongly disagree with that. Have you experienced that first hand, or just been told that by someone? For the most part, people here are very nice and friendly. I was in Baltimore last month and within a few hours, I'd been almost side-swiped and cussed at by some guy in a car. That's never happened to me here (and, based on that one experience, I wouldn't generalize and say that everyone in Baltimore is rude). Yes, there are some jerks here, but I've found less here then most other big cities.

Phoenix is close enough to the beach that you can drive for a weekend trip. We're driving distance to Disneyland, Legoland, and other SoCal attractions. We have hiking, biking, palm trees, sunshine, very little humidity. Yes, summer is HOT! VERY HOT! And that gets very old. But I've found that no place has perfect weather. Well, except SoCal, where you can't afford a house.

The Phoenix zoo is really a great zoo. Scottsdale is fun and very pretty. We have major league football, baseball and basketball teams, and baseball spring training too. The malls are great. I do agree with you that there is very little urban culture. Compared to Boston, Philly, DC, etc., Phoenix not only loses - it's not in the race. That's actually my biggest complaint about the area. I can deal with the heat, but the lack of urban culture has been hard to get used to.

I would recommend that your friend thoroughly research the area, consider employment options, and visit both during the summer and during the winter, as the weather is very different. Phoenix is not for everyone, just as LA or NYC or Boise isn't for everyone. But for many people, including me, it's a great place to live.

[Ponderosa]

In addition to the usual "we have football, etc", we also have:

Herberger Theatre
Dodge Theatre
Scottsdale Centre for the Arts
Mesa "
West Valley Arts Council
Phoenix Opera Company
Phoenix Symphony
Phoenix Boys Choir
Childsplay Children's Theatre and Camps
Phoenix Little Theatre
Scottsdale art galleries
North Valley Playhouse
Tempe Performing Arts Center
Several ASU theatre/dance/music venues
Poetry and reading clubs all over
Cultural centers for a dozen or so ethnicities

and many others...

There is a different cultural experience to be had every weekend, if not every day of the week, here. NO, you can't just stumble out of your downtown midrise and walk to the event. YES, you have to get in the car. I think that most of the people who complain about a lack of culture here don't really know or care about culture anyway. It's just something they can whine about while dreaming of moving back to wherever they came from.

[sablebaby]

Originally Posted by Boatdrinks

As for your impression that people here are rude, I strongly disagree with that. Have you experienced that first hand, or just been told that by someone? For the most part, people here are very nice and friendly. I was in Baltimore last month and within a few hours, I'd been almost side-swiped and cussed at by some guy in a car. That's never happened to me here (and, based on that one experience, I wouldn't generalize and say that everyone in Baltimore is rude). Yes, there are some jerks here, but I've found less here then most other big cities.

I have experienced this almost everyday! I have always thought that phx has a lot of rude people (especially behind the wheel!). However, once you meet someone they usually become quite nice. I think it's pretty evened out with both nice and rude. I also believe that the heat plays a big part in people's moods. Tempers are shortened in the summer.

[sablebaby]

Originally Posted by Robin Holland

but are these other things all factual or actual?

Thanks!

I think it's actual.

[Boatdrinks]

Originally Posted by sablebaby

I have experienced this almost everyday! I have always thought that phx has a lot of rude people (especially behind the wheel!). However, once you meet someone they usually become quite nice. I think it's pretty evened out with both nice and rude. I also believe that the heat plays a big part in people's moods. Tempers are shortened in the summer.

Wow. That's too bad. I guess I've just been fortunate during my years here. And maybe it has something to do with the fact that I don't have to commute into the city everyday. Most of my driving is in the suburbs. Although, my Baltimore experience wasn't during a rush hour commute, so that guy didn't have commuting anxiety as an excuse (or heat....it was COLD!).

[Robin Holland]

Originally Posted by Boatdrinks

Based on your response to the crime thread above, I was under the impression that you had factual knowledge that crime was worse here then it is in other large cities. I asked in that thread if you could post your sources b/c I'm very interested in reading the studies.

Yes I came across it in a different thread on this site as I was looking around at the different discussions regarding Phoenix. On this list, only Detroit, Las Vegas, and Miami finished higher of the major cities. Mid-size cities suchs as New Orleans, Memphis, Tucson, and Albuquerque did finish higher too though. However, other major cities such as Boston, New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, San Francisco, Atlanta, Philadelphia, Seattle, or Washington DC are not in the top-25.

http://www.morganquitno.com/cit06pop.htm#METRO

Arizona is also ranked as the 4th most dangerous state behind only Nevada, Louisiana, and New Mexico. Surely most of Arizona's crime would be centered in Phoenix and Tucson...

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0922223.html

[Robin Holland]

Originally Posted by silverbear

Your friends should visit and intensively research the area before making a decision.

Thanks for your in depth response! From what I have seen, and from what I have also been able to forward to my friends, a visit first would most definitely be in order! I think they are looking at other alternatives now though after reading some of the posts.