I thought Phoenix would be more progressive after all these years! (Scottsdale: technology jobs, construction)

[aj661]

Originally Posted by Robin Holland

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No they're not. Morgan-Quinton is reliable and credible as any other from the information that I have learned. Even if it's not perfect, it can't be as far wrong as you're suggesting, and no matter how it is spun

m.q.p. is NOT reliable and anything BUT credible. It's not just me suggesting it. The FBI is suggesting it . KSDK in St. Louis is suggesting it. They exposed the owners motivations: Publicity to sell his books.

http://www.ksdk.com/video/player.asp...31&bw=hi&cat=3

Originally Posted by Robin Holland

so isn't it best to just discuss the topics? I would like that.

It would be best, but nothing seems to be open for discussion with you.

*I checked m.q.p. for myself and discovered their methodology for determining what is "dangerous" is FLAT-OUT-WRONG. PROPERTY CRIME data is NOT relevant, yet m.q.p. includes it.

*I checked with the FBI, the national repository for this data. They tell the public NOT TO USE raw statistical data for comparison purposes, which is EXACTLY what m.q.p. does. You refuse to acknowledge this.

*You have repeatedly told readers that crime seems to be everywhere here whereas in other cities it is more segregated to specific areas. Again this information is WRONG. Crime can happen anywhere in any city, not just Phoenix. Phoenix has specific areas that should be avoided, just like any other city. If you LIVED here you would know that.

*You base your information about this subject on what you have read. I base mine on nearly 30 years as a police officer here and as a resident of 45 years.

[Robin Holland]

Originally Posted by aj661

m.q.p. is NOT reliable and anything BUT credible. It's not just me suggesting it. The FBI is suggesting it.

They are using FBI data to determine the rankings.

Originally Posted by aj661

KSDK in St. Louis is suggesting it.

St. Lous were ranked as the number one most dangerous city, so no wonder they are dismissing it. It is my belief that the cities and states that rank badly tend to dismiss Morgan Quinto, while the cities and states that rank well tend to value Morgan Quinto. It's probably the same for the people that live in these cities and states as well.

Originally Posted by aj661

It would be best, but nothing seems to be open for discussion with you.

I tell you what though. I will concede then for the sake of peace. The metropolitan area of Phoenix which is ranked in the top-25 most dangerous in the country, and third of cities over 3 million population, the state of Arizona, which is ranked as the 4th most dangerous and the 50th smartest in the country are all just Morgan Quinto ratings based on FBI data, and Morgan Quinto are completely useless and so is their methodology! They make things up, and they have no idea of what they're on about, and they're deliberately picking on Phoenix and the state of Arizona.

The metropolitan area of Phoenix didn't really have 524 cases of reported violent crime and 9.2 murders per 100,000 people in 2006, which although not as bad as Miami, Washington DC, Detroit, Los Angeles, Houston, or Philadelphia, it is worse than San Francisco, New York City, Seattle, Atlanta, Boston and Chicago of cities over 3 million population. Everybody knows that it's only car theft that occurs in Phoenix, and the weekly random spousal murders, random bar shooting murders, and party shooting murders are just a figment of the imagination.

Satisfied now?

[aj661]

Originally Posted by Robin Holland

They are using FBI data to determine the rankings.St. Lous were ranked as the number one most dangerous city, so no wonder they are dismissing it. It is my belief that the cities and states that rank badly tend to dismiss Morgan Quinto, while the cities and states that rank well tend to value Morgan Quinto. It's probably the same for the people that live in these cities and states as well.I tell you what though. I will concede then for the sake of peace. The metropolitan area of Phoenix which is ranked in the top-25 most dangerous in the country, and third of cities over 3 million population, the state of Arizona, which is ranked as the 4th most dangerous and the 50th smartest in the country are all just Morgan Quinto ratings based on FBI data, and Morgan Quinto are completely useless and so is their methodology! They make things up, and they have no idea of what they're on about, and they're deliberately picking on Phoenix and the state of Arizona.

Satisfied now?

It's quite obvious you will never get it.
You just repeated everything again and, once more, IGNORED the FBI WARNING NOT TO USE RAW STATISTICAL DATA FOR COMAPRISONS. I am through trying to explain it to you personally. However I will continue to counter morganquitnowpress garbage when I see it.

[irwin]

Originally Posted by aj661

It's quite obvious you will never get it.
You just repeated everything again and, once more, IGNORED the FBI WARNING NOT TO USE RAW STATISTICAL DATA FOR COMAPRISONS. I am through trying to explain it to you personally. However I will continue to counter morganquitnowpress garbage when I see it.

I am not really sure why you shouldn't use raw statistical crime data to calculate the most crimes per person in an area. Obviously there are other, non statistical reasons crime occurs but in the end it is still occuring.

[aj661]

Originally Posted by irwin

I am not really sure why you shouldn't use raw statistical crime data to calculate the most crimes per person in an area. Obviously there are other, non statistical reasons crime occurs but in the end it is still occuring.

That's not the part I'm arguing. It's the m.q.p. "dangerous cities" and "safest cities" rankings that are wrong. If you have a vehicle you absolutely want to have stolen as quickly as possible, I could tell you some locations around the valley to park it and make it happen. (I won't, but I could.)
But auto theft is a property crime. So is burglary. If m.q.p. dropped those two categories the data would be much more accurate and Phoenix and Arizona would drop dramatically in their rankings.

Calculating crime 'X' per whatever population number you choose does have some validity; homicides per 100k, etc. But again, relying on those numbers for large metropolitan areas can be misleading. If we were talking about Superior, AZ for example, it would be more telling than Phoenix. Superior is much smaller, so even if most of the homicides occurred in a two block area, ALL residents of Superior are close to it. Phoenix on the other hand, you could live many miles from the nearest homicide and your TRUE chances of being a victim would be considerably less than the published 'X' per 100k. Big cities need to have the data broken down into smaller geographical areas to be fair and relevant.

In some areas even zip codes may be a stretch. It may seem in reading my posts that I'm claiming Phoenix to be virtually crime free. Not even in my dreams! But much, much more property crime occurs than violent. ID theft is another category Arizona can be ashamed about. But look at some of the reasons; Phoenix is a target rich environment. The large population of retirees makes this place a hot spot (no nun intended) for crimes against the elderly.

I'm a little burned out right now (again, no pun) so I may have not done a good job explaining this to you. Irwin, you need to buy me a beer one of these days before you head back to RedSoxNation and I'll try again.

[kawgpz550]

Robin,
I still do not understand, what is your obsession with Phoenix and the state of Arizona? You say you do not live here and there ARE other states that are more dangerous than Arizona. Why do you keep kicking up the dust here, but not any other state thread? Just curious?

[Boatdrinks]

Originally Posted by moose168

The majority of California's housing is still much more expensive than Arizona's. Prices here are still dirt-cheap compared to both coasts. Don't blame the recent spike all on Californians. That was mostly the real-estate market, fueled by greedy developers building as many ticky-tack subdivisions in a short time so they could reap a quick profit.

Who bought all the houses thrown up by the greedy builders?????? Investors from CA. The investers completely screwed up this market - bought houses like crazy and flipped them for a quick profit, which drove up the market and increased demand. Now Phoenix is paying for it. And who else bought all the houses besides CA investors???? CA residents who couldn't afford a cardboard box to live in CA.

It makes me laugh that you think CA is a utopia compared to AZ. Their economy sucks, their illegal problem is just as bad as AZ, their housing market is WAY overpriced, traffic is HORRIBLE, pollution is horrendous, and seriously - you want to talk about unfriendly, snobby people? Geez, CA is king of that mountain. I've never met a higher number of materialistic unfriendly people then in CA. When we went to Legoland, which is a stinkin amusement park for young kids, I couldn't believe how many botoxed, lipo'd, fake boobed moms wearing mini skirts and high heels pushing their strollers we saw. It was laughable. And you think SF is nicer then here? Wow - that's laughable as well. The only people who can afford to live there are the rich or the homeless. Schools are horrible. People are unfriendly. It's just SO not what the utopia you're making it out to be.

And the really funny thing is that you're talking so badly about a city that your mother lived for 50 yrs so you're putting her down in the same breath that you're putting all of us uneducated, superficial people.

[Boatdrinks]

Originally Posted by aj661

Having been educated in Arizona this may be too difficult, but I will attempt to analyze these two opposing views. Please bear with me:


Jill Warner has had a very negative personal experience in San Francisco, where she "stepped over human waste and even had the displeasure of watching someone relieve himself between two BMW's."

Ms. Holland however, dismisses this observation with the comment, "Of course there are going to be people though that don't like San Francisco."

Ms. Holland supports her position with, "San Francisco has actually been rated, along with Honolulu, as the highest rated most liveable (sic) American city in the world city rankings. Phoenix rated extremely poorly."

Sorry Jill, but Ms. Holland is right. The conduct of this worldly, intelligent and no doubt highly educated gentleman you encountered in San Francisco was surely an aberration and certainly not indicative of the societal norm of this world class city.

Or perhaps, in your judgmental, narrow mindedness, you failed to grasp that you were witnessing an exquisitely talented visual artist asserting his indigenous sovereignty against the onslaught of governmental oppression which seeks to enslave him, in so doing expressing his anarchistic philosophy concerning nihilistic consumerism which has permeated the industrialized neoconservative machine that is America today.

Even a dim-wit like me figured this out! Come on Jill, what were you thinking???


To be completely fair, we must consider that this gentle, misguided soul (or drunk dirtbag) was simply urinating between two vehicles.

Ms. Warner says they were two BMWs, and we all know that in Phoenix it would have been two pickups. CASE CLOSED.

Regardless of which scenario you believe to be true, the only logical conclusion can be that THERE CAN BE NO DOUBT but that San Francisco is 'world class' and deserves to be one of 'the highest rated most livable American cities' while Phoenix is "at the cesspool end." (Have a few more drinks and keep telling yourself that.)

That reminded me of something also. That web site, "www.infoplease.com" uses morgan quitno data.

I found this interesting little video clip which aired on a St. Louis news channel in 2006.

http://www.ksdk.com/video/player.asp...31&bw=hi&cat=3

Momma always said, "stupid is as stupid does"

Wish there was a thumbs up icon, but this will have to do:

[Boatdrinks]

Originally Posted by aj661

Well HOORAY FOR MAYBERRY!!!!!

You've made almost 50 posts to city-data.com and all but one have been on an Arizona forum. Based on this and adding your rabid obsession with bashing everything about Arizona and Phoenix, plus the incessant re-posting of invalid crime data, I believe it's fair to conclude that your hometown must be on the most boring cities in the world list also! If it's such a wonderful place, go out and experience it! Is there nothing else in your world from which you might derive some pleasure other than all this negativity about places you know nothing about? All the "it would seem this" and "of course that", You can't KNOW this city or this state without living there. You are not qualified to TELL people what it's like to live here, yet you do, over and over again. What a sad little world you must live in.

You know, I've tried a few different times to say this but the mods delete my posts so I'm just going to "ditto" what you said

[kawgpz550]

You are so right and I will ditto everything that was said there as well. And as for your thumbs up icon, you can do it in the title of the reply, just not the body of the message