Moving to Phx area from WI: Honest Opinion (Phoenix, Mesa: housing, rent)

[movin'on]

Well, I'd recommend N. Scottsdale, where I live. You should be able to get into something for minimum 500K and up. It's really quite lovely, if one can forget the fact that the property just happens to be in Az.

[cmist]

Originally Posted by sweattea

The layout of the land in Chandler / Gilbert though is flat gridded out farmland as far as the eye can see, but in North Glendale & North Peoria, you have mountains and just 20 minutes to lake pleasant.


We have the Superstition Mountains to the NE of us and the San Tan to the South. Canyon lake is 35 minutes we are not all flat land here in Gilbert. I'm not sure how you missed the mountains here we are surrounded. Gilbert is a family friendly area but not a friendly people area.

Glendale is more down to earth but be careful in what area in Glendale you want to reside. It's true Kyrene school district has nothing on Peoria schools. Peoria is an excellent school district.

There are mountains in the distance... but superstitions are really in apache junction and not comparable to how mountains are *IN* the neighborhood in Glendale/Peoria... Same with the San Tans, They are VERY far south. Not sure if they are "in" chandler but if you live anywhere near the san tans, you are definitely far out there.

Don't misunderstand me, I'm just trying to say that there are lots of neighborhoods on the NW side that are fairly close to the main parts of town that actually have mountains right in the neighborhood that you can go to the end of your street and hike, and not just on the distant horizon. Agree?

[Nea1]

Originally Posted by irwin

Maybe compared the to average Arizonian I am bizzare. That's a compliment as far as I am concerned.

Spend time in the Northwest, New England, Canada, Europe...80's is hot weather. You don't have to go to Alaska to experience a temperate climate. If anything, living in a desert is bizzare, especially the way people live here in AZ. There is a reason Arabs wrap themselves from head to toe with clothing.

I have, I have lived in NW, NE and SE and now AZ, they all get above 80 in the summer and some fall, Se had high 80's a few days ago. You get it no matter where you are(except Alaska). 80's is warm not hot , 90's is hot, 70's extremely comfortable. I laugh when I see people in 60 degree weather wearing sweatshirts or coats, they dont know what cold is. And sweating in your car is normal even if it is in the 70's, the car is a heat conductor, it is actually hotter in your car than outside.

[Down Logan]

It really doesn't matter where you live in the Phoenix metro area. Every street looks the same. It's the same strip malls, same bad cookie cutter homes and offices. No real sense of a neighborhood feel at all. The focal point of every home is the garage door and don't even think you'll meet or get to know your neighbors easily. It's a strange lifestyle in that city. Prices are cheap compared to the rest of the country. The schools are not rated well compared to others but they're not real bad either. I'd be concerned about raising my children in a city that does not have much to offer for higher education and the residents are pretty sheltered in their outlook of the rest of the world.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by Down Logan

It really doesn't matter where you live in the Phoenix metro area. Every street looks the same. It's the same strip malls, same bad cookie cutter homes and offices. No real sense of a neighborhood feel at all. The focal point of every home is the garage door and don't even think you'll meet or get to know your neighbors easily. It's a strange lifestyle in that city. Prices are cheap compared to the rest of the country. The schools are not rated well compared to others but they're not real bad either. I'd be concerned about raising my children in a city that does not have much to offer for higher education and the residents are pretty sheltered in their outlook of the rest of the world.

I have traveled to many, many cities and the suburbs are all the same. Doesn't matter if it's Atlanta, Chicago, Detroit, LA, or Dallas. The houses in the burbs all look alike and are being built on smaller and smaller lots. Here it's stucco, there it's vinyl siding, over there faux brick. Burbs are boring architectually. People move to them for reasons other than what the houses look like. I also much prefer the look of SW tract homes (CA/NV/AZ) to the vinyl clad, fake dormer jobs in most other places. Maybe it is an acquired taste from being here so long.

As for the malls and offices it is the same old story being repeated across the land: some office park out by the freeway surrounded by Applebee's, a Chinese Buffet, a Rib joint, a mattress store. It's not just in Arizona, it is EVERYWHERE.

[Down Logan]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

I have traveled to many, many cities and the suburbs are all the same. Doesn't matter if it's Atlanta, Chicago, Detroit, LA, or Dallas. The houses in the burbs all look alike and are being built on smaller and smaller lots. Here it's stucco, there it's vinyl siding, over there faux brick. Burbs are boring architectually. People move to them for reasons other than what the houses look like.

As for the malls and offices it is the same old story being repeated across the land: some office park out by the freeway surrounded by Applebee's, a Chinese Buffet, a Rib joint, a mattress store. It's not just in Arizona, it is EVERYWHERE.

Yes, very true but the cities you mentioned all have older, established neighborhoods that are known for their housing stock, ethnicity, demographics, restaurants, etc. They have issues with suburban sprawl also but at least you can choose to live in their urban neighborhoods if you are looking for that. Phoenix has no urban feeling. You can't built it, it has to evolve over time with business, residents, and retail/restaurants forming it. It just isn't happening for Phoenix and sadly probably never will.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by Down Logan

Yes, very true but the cities you mentioned all have older, established neighborhoods that are known for their housing stock, ethnicity, demographics, restaurants, etc. They have issues with suburban sprawl also but at least you can choose to live in their urban neighborhoods if you are looking for that. Phoenix has no urban feeling. You can't built it, it has to evolve over time with business, residents, and retail/restaurants forming it. It just isn't happening for Phoenix and sadly probably never will.

Yes, and therein is good advice. If an urban lifestyle is what you seek, look elsewhere.

As for it happening, there is a ray of hope for those who would like to see that. ASU now has a downtown campus and soon will be building a multi-story residence hall (over a 1000 students as I recall). I also read where a supermarket (food) is going to go in downtown, finally. Then there is the light rail system that is being built. Phoenix has attempted a number of downtown projects over the years which have largely failed because the vast majority of family-oriented people who move here do not want an urban lifestyle. Maybe bringing young people in will do the trick. Youth and food seem to be requisite items for a vibrant downtown district.

Also: University of Arizona is going to be building a medical school/campus on 13 acres in the downtown area next to TGen, the genetic/bio research firm.

[azloafer]

I think neighborhoods really fell apart with the demise of the front porch. Here in Green Valley, AZ there are no front porches, just garage doors. People drive into the garage and the door goes down, locking out any interaction with neighbors. I don't even know what some neighbors look like, not because I am unfriendly, but because I just never see them. I wave at every person in a car that passes if I am outside, but the cars whiz by, only to disapperar into a garage. When I lived in Wisconsin, the older sections had front porches. Most people spent a lot of time on the front porch and talked to all the neighbors who passed by on the sidewalk. Many people made friends this way. Beer was the drink in Milwaukee and it was a gesture of friendship to invite someone up to the porch for a cold one. Now we just see garage doors closing! Where have all the porches gone and why???

[Down Logan]

I wish I could be as optimistic as you are about Phoenix and their attempts to "build" a downtown. The light rail they are attempting is only going to be another burden on the taxpayers just like all the stadiums that no one supports any longer. There is no density to support light rail. No real big building or area where lots of people work or live. As long as there are all the big huge parking lots surrounding every bad strip mall, nobody will be incented to ride the rail. Why would you when it's so much easier to hop in your car and drive to your destination and then park. NY, DC and SF have subway systems that work because their stations are under huge buildings like the Pentagon or towers where 30 to 50 thousand people work everyday. That doesn't exist anywhere in Phx. They also have limited space so parking is very expensive. Phx has parking available for free anywhere you go. The traffic is still very easy compared to the traffic woes and long commutes that LA, DC, SF, NY, Chicago, and Atlanta have. Check out the DOT website for traffic. Phx doesn't know what real traffic is. They are all rated much higher than Phx for traffic on their interstates and freeways. These are all things that drive the need for rail systems. The need just isn't there yet in Phoenix and with their overall surburban mentality and growth planning, they really never will need mass transit. Have you ever tried to ride the bus in Phoenix. It's a joke!

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by Down Logan

I wish I could be as optimistic as you are about Phoenix and their attempts to "build" a downtown. The light rail they are attempting is only going to be another burden on the taxpayers just like all the stadiums that no one supports any longer. There is no density to support light rail. No real big building or area where lots of people work or live. As long as there are all the big huge parking lots surrounding every bad strip mall, nobody will be incented to ride the rail. Why would you when it's so much easier to hop in your car and drive to your destination and then park. NY, DC and SF have subway systems that work because their stations are under huge buildings like the Pentagon or towers where 30 to 50 thousand people work everyday. That doesn't exist anywhere in Phx. They also have limited space so parking is very expensive. Phx has parking available for free anywhere you go. The traffic is still very easy compared to the traffic woes and long commutes that LA, DC, SF, NY, Chicago, and Atlanta have. Check out the DOT website for traffic. Phx doesn't know what real traffic is. They are all rated much higher than Phx for traffic on their interstates and freeways. These are all things that drive the need for rail systems. The need just isn't there yet in Phoenix and with their overall surburban mentality and growth planning, they really never will need mass transit. Have you ever tried to ride the bus in Phoenix. It's a joke!

Gee, you make Phoenix sound pretty good.


Let's see, shopping opportunities near all the suburbs with ample parking, no huge buildings housing 50000 people trying to get to and from work at the same time, free parking everywhere!, traffic so light that we don't "know what real traffic is", and short commutes compared to LA, DC,SF, NY, Chicago or Atlanta. Most commuters would say that sounds like a very nice place to be.