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FCorrales and LVD, yes, A $30k millionaire can "afford" Porsches and such. A used Porsche Boxster is considered a status symbol (because people may think you bought it brand new). Also these young Trump wannabes may have rich parents but low paying jobs. They have roommates in most cases too, don't forget. I'm not saying there are some genuine high income or high net worth people driving those luxury cars.
I said "new" luxury car...anyone who knows about cars knows that a Porsche Boxster, much less a used one, is a good as a GTi and not a status symbol. You know when someone is not faking it but has an income or revenue stream that is truly wealthy when the car they drive is as expensive as many peoples' homes; Bentleys, S Class Sedans, Maybachs, Lambos, etc...
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Stanley and Danko wrote in "The Millionaire Next Door" that most millionaires do not display wealth, drive mediocre cars, and buy them used.
Correct, but many of those millionaires do not have liquid assets and thus are not millionaires in the traditional sense of liquidity. They don't make millions every year but have a net worth that define them as such.
Real estate investors, entrepreneurs, Californians who sold their homes for high prices and moved to AZ, doctors, lawyers, plastic surgeons, heirs and heiresses, retired folks, transplants who acquired money somewhere else, celebrities, etc.
Phoenix has seen a lot of transplants over the years, including wealthy people. Wealthy individuals are attracted to warmer weather and cheaper real estate prices just like your everyday person.
Just because Phoenix isn't a bastion of Fortune 500 companies doesn't mean that there aren't wealthy people.
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I did some price comparisons between Paradise Valley (here) and some pricey neighborhoods in Silicon Valley (SF Bay Area). It's a bit cheaper here but not that much - there MUST be a fair amount of high income here to support this and I just can't figure out where it's coming from.
Rreal estate investors - I was thinking they couldn't get 'that' wealthy here due to average sales prices being pretty low, but then I remembered, the Phoenix metro has grown by 30% or so in past 10 years so I guess RE development could be a huge money maker. 'entrepreneurs' - I guess every place has them, but does phoenix have more than most? I don't hear much about them and don't see startup companies sprouting up, so I can't see that being a significant factor. Doctors/pastic surgeons -well, I have heard that this is the plastic surgery capital of the US, and there are plenty of wealthy elderly, so that could be another factor. Celebrities, heirs/heiresses ... I guess the really wealthy can afford two (or more) homes, so have a home here to take advantage of the fall/winter/spring, and a home elsewhere to enjoy the summer.
I did some price comparisons between Paradise Valley (here) and some pricey neighborhoods in Silicon Valley (SF Bay Area). It's a bit cheaper here but not that much - there MUST be a fair amount of high income here to support this and I just can't figure out where it's coming from.
Rreal estate investors - I was thinking they couldn't get 'that' wealthy here due to average sales prices being pretty low, but then I remembered, the Phoenix metro has grown by 30% or so in past 10 years so I guess RE development could be a huge money maker. 'entrepreneurs' - I guess every place has them, but does phoenix have more than most? I don't hear much about them and don't see startup companies sprouting up, so I can't see that being a significant factor. Doctors/pastic surgeons -well, I have heard that this is the plastic surgery capital of the US, and there are plenty of wealthy elderly, so that could be another factor. Celebrities, heirs/heiresses ... I guess the really wealthy can afford two (or more) homes, so have a home here to take advantage of the fall/winter/spring, and a home elsewhere to enjoy the summer.
revoco:
That being said, Phoenix may only have a handful of Fortune 500 headquarters, but it is a regional headquarter hub. There are regional offices and headquarters for almost every company you can think of; from Microsoft to Charles Schwabb.
Much of the old money in Arizona also reside not in Scottsdale, but in the Catalina Foothills of Tucson and in Paradise Valley (the town), Camelback mountain area in Phoenix, Arcadia, Biltmore, North Central Phoenix, and all along the mountain preserves in the central cities areas.
They are investors, land owners, entrepreneurs, etc. The Valley is home to billionaires that are "new" to that scene like Hispanics whose companies in Arizona have gone national; i.e. Arturo Moreno (founder of Outdoor Systems). We also have a large number of heirs from companies founded in Arizona or from families who decided to make their homes in Arizona.
It is also notable that many wealth people in neighborhoods like PV, Acradia, Biltmore, etc generally do not move about, relocate often, or "flip" their homes and are long term investments...
FCorrales and LVD, yes, A $30k millionaire can "afford" Porsches and such. A used Porsche Boxster is considered a status symbol (because people may think you bought it brand new). Also these young Trump wannabes may have rich parents but low paying jobs. They have roommates in most cases too, don't forget. I'm not saying there are some genuine high income or high net worth people driving those luxury cars.
LOL, I have actually been looking at acquiring a used Boxster S the past couple of months, as there's some great deals out there. Guess I should reconsider.
To answer the original question, there's still a lot of high paying jobs out there. Some of the people at the HQ of Freeport McMoRan, Taser, Insight, PetSmart and others have enough money to make Tiger Woods jealous. Well, maybe not tiger, but definitely Billy Mayfair. Also, there's a lot of current and retired professional athletes in the valley, from here or other cities. I have a lot of current or retired NFL players living in my part of Chandler, as well as current LA Dodger Andre Ethier, current Eagles Quarterback Donovan McNabb, current Chicago Bear Lance Briggs, etc. I would imagine it is much the same in Scottsdale. Athletes love to come to the PHX area to live. Just look at all the pro golfers that live in Scottsdale. And spring training makes this place a hotbed of current and former MLB players.
Much of the old money in Arizona also reside not in Scottsdale, but in the Catalina Foothills of Tucson and in Paradise Valley (the town), Camelback mountain area in Phoenix, Arcadia, Biltmore, North Central Phoenix, and all along the mountain preserves in the central cities areas.
Yes, I noticed this about the Catalina Foothills of Tucson, of Lincoln Blvd and some older districts in Phoenix metro. The Melissa Data website has some interesting zip code statistics. I zero in on the zips with high AGI. For instance, 85718 (Catalina Foothills closer to Sabino Cyn) and 85018 (Arcadia district) have high AGIs. Lots of it from old moneyed families. I reckon this is the way it is with McCain and his Phoenix residence(s).
One modern approach to maintaining "high incomes" is to be very mobile and have very little baggage to keep the high paying jobs. I'm at a point where I am considering leasing a high end car. I would use my municipal bond interest to pay for the entire monthly payment. I'd keep my little paid-off car to use for commuting. But my little car is uncomfortable to drive long distances as I have long legs and cannot get the stretch I need! I like the idea of renting "everything" these days.
LOL, I have actually been looking at acquiring a used Boxster S the past couple of months, as there's some great deals out there. Guess I should reconsider.
LOL! Get a Corvette!!! American, MUCH MUCH faster, beautiful and you'd be considered a "car man" and not someone just acquiring a "status symbol" LOL! A new Corvette is also about as much as a new Boxster (not Boxster S); around $42K...and a 100,000 mile warranty, you don't get that with a Boxster.
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To answer the original question, there's still a lot of high paying jobs out there. Some of the people at the HQ of Freeport McMoRan, Taser, Insight, PetSmart and others have enough money to make Tiger Woods jealous. Well, maybe not tiger, but definitely Billy Mayfair. Also, there's a lot of current and retired professional athletes in the valley, from here or other cities. I have a lot of current or retired NFL players living in my part of Chandler, as well as current LA Dodger Andre Ethier, current Eagles Quarterback Donovan McNabb, current Chicago Bear Lance Briggs, etc. I would imagine it is much the same in Scottsdale. Athletes love to come to the PHX area to live. Just look at all the pro golfers that live in Scottsdale. And spring training makes this place a hotbed of current and former MLB players.
I forgot about all the althetes and famous people who live in the valley, those that fell in love with the valley while playing a pro sport here, etc:
Alice Cooper, Charles Barkley, Randy Johnson, Gonzo (Luis Gonzalez), Stevie Nicks!, Shaqtus aka Shaquille O'Neal (said he was keeping his Phoenix home and he loved AZ and has kept his nickname acquired here and using it in NBA promos), Mohammad Ali, Dan Rather, Mike Tyson, and the list goes on...
Other companies in Phoenix (Fortune 500) are The Apollo Group, Waste Management, Avnet, etc.
Other huge and notable companies that create significant wealth, just for starters: Pinnacle West Corporation, Banner Health, Best Western, Clear Channel, Coldstone Creamery, Dial, Discount Tire, Fender, First Solar, GoDaddy, Honeywell Aerospace, Harkins, Hensley & Co (Cindy McCain heiress), Hunt Construction, Hypercom, Inventure Group, iCrossing, Incentive Logic, Shamrock Farms, Swift Transportation, Viad, and tons more.
The international market will start bringing more wealthy movers and shakers to Phoenix, and like Seattle, this will and can have a significant impact on education in Arizona including more university prestige and also increased philanthropy in the region.
Last edited by fcorrales80; 01-24-2010 at 12:56 PM..
Yes, I noticed this about the Catalina Foothills of Tucson, of Lincoln Blvd and some older districts in Phoenix metro. The Melissa Data website has some interesting zip code statistics. I zero in on the zips with high AGI. For instance, 85718 (Catalina Foothills closer to Sabino Cyn) and 85018 (Arcadia district) have high AGIs. Lots of it from old moneyed families. I reckon this is the way it is with McCain and his Phoenix residence(s).
Yes, with the McCains, much of the wealth is actually from Cindy since she is from old Phoenix money and heiress to Hensley & Co.
LOL! Get a Corvette!!! American, MUCH MUCH faster, beautiful and you'd be considered a "car man" and not someone just acquiring a "status symbol" LOL! A new Corvette is also about as much as a new Boxster (not Boxster S); around $42K...and a 100,000 mile warranty, you don't get that with a Boxster.
No way, I have had American cars, and I'm not doing that again for a while. Besides, I love German sports cars. They just hug the corners so well. The corvette is OK in a drag race, throw in a couple of turns, and I'll honk at you as my Boxster whistles on by. We actually currently have a BMW M3 that is now over 7 years old. It is used as a 3rd car, as we have a SUV and Minivan already. (kid ). We are just kicking around the idea with replacing it with a less used Boxster S, Audi S4 or BMW M3. Although the final decision may not be made until we decide if we are having another baby or not. Probably will end up with something more sensible and boring like a Maxima if we end up with another kid. Anyway, this is off topic, maybe I should start a thread for car enthusiasts?
No way, I have had American cars, and I'm not doing that again for a while. Besides, I love German sports cars. They just hug the corners so well. The corvette is OK in a drag race, throw in a couple of turns, and I'll honk at you as my Boxster whistles on by. We actually currently have a BMW M3 that is now over 7 years old. It is used as a 3rd car, as we have a SUV and Minivan already. (kid ). We are just kicking around the idea with replacing it with a less used Boxster S, Audi S4 or BMW M3. Although the final decision may not be made until we decide if we are having another baby or not. Probably will end up with something more sensible and boring like a Maxima if we end up with another kid. Anyway, this is off topic, maybe I should start a thread for car enthusiasts?
You should, LOL, because I was just about to hijack this thread and jump on you about the Corvette in speed competitions with all the other sports cars on the Nurburgring...and don't make me laugh about a Boxster out-cornering a corvette! Just dont' buy Japanese, it may accelerate on its own and not stop!
The new ZR1 has an estimated 0-60 in 3.3 sec, faster than any Lambo, Porsche 911 GT2, and achieves a 1g cornering grip (yet still maintaining a MUCH cheaper price tag compared to any other foreign sports car)! A Boxster, LOL! Maybe the Boxster can better perform with the new Camaro SS, MAYBE! Oops, I just hijacked the thread...
Well back to what Howard was saying; there is much mobility in society today, so many of the wealthy in Phoenix, aside from celebrities and athletes, love the Phoenix area and bring their cars with them or buy new ones since our roads are so enticing to drive them on.
Last edited by fcorrales80; 01-24-2010 at 01:11 PM..
You should, LOL, because I was just about to hijack this thread and jump on you about the Corvette in speed competitions with all the other sports cars on the Nurburgring...and don't make me laugh about a Boxster out-cornering a corvette! .
You had to go there. The Porsche Boxter S (not a plain Boxster) is considered an animal at handling. Probably the best at cornering in the sports car world along with the Lotus and M3. The corvette is more of a muscle car, and will undoubtedly have a higher 0-60, but like I said, mix in some corners and the Boxster S will win. Not saying the Vette is terrible at handling corners, just not in the same ballpark as the Boxster S. Read some of the online forums about this, just not the biased corvette or porsche forums.
Besides, isn't one of the requirements of owning a Vette that you have to have "smokes" rolled up in the sleeve of your dirty t-shirt?
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American, MUCH MUCH faster, beautiful and you'd be considered a "car man" and not someone just acquiring a "status symbol" LOL! A new Corvette is also about as much as a new Boxster (not Boxster S); around $42K...and a 100,000 mile warranty, you don't get that with a Boxster.
Besides, I love German sports cars. They just hug the corners so well. The corvette is OK in a drag race, throw in a couple of turns, and I'll honk at you as my Boxster whistles on by. 
We actually currently have a BMW M3 that is now over 7 years old. It is used as a 3rd car, as we have a SUV and Minivan already. (kid 
). We are just kicking around the idea with replacing it with a less used Boxster S, Audi S4 or BMW M3. Although the final decision may not be made until we decide if we are having another baby or not. Probably will end up with something more sensible and boring like a Maxima if we end up with another kid. Anyway, this is off topic, maybe I should start a thread for car enthusiasts? 
The Porsche Boxter S (not a plain Boxster) is considered an animal at handling. Probably the best at cornering in the sports car world along with the Lotus and M3. The corvette is more of a muscle car, and will undoubtedly have a higher 0-60, but like I said, mix in some corners and the Boxster S will win. Not saying the Vette is terrible at handling corners, just not in the same ballpark as the Boxster S. Read some of the online forums about this, just not the biased corvette or porsche forums.
