Wow Privatization of Public Transit is FAILING Already! (Pittsburgh, Mars: sales, how much)

[Herodotus]

Originally Posted by johnnytang24

So you're saying a private company can't compete with a heavily subsidized one that operates on a loss every year? Is that surprising, or is it supposed to be indicative of something?

Private bus systems will not work? Bus services in Hong Kong - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Comparing one of the most densely populated cities in the world to Pittsburgh is silly. The reason why we have public transit, is that after WWII, with the mass migration to far flung suburbs, and the explosion of car ownership, mass transit ceased to be a money making endeavor.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by UKyank

Maybe PAT should start charging $10, which apparently is what it costs to run such a route & they won't always be in the red

We should also toll every road--we'll need a toll gate at the end of every driveway--so that we stop spending public money on those too.

Having consistently insisted that every transportation service or project turn a profit, eventually this problem will take care of itself: Pittsburgh will turn into a ghost town after businesses and people flee for places that understand that providing robust transportation networks has been one of the core functions of governments for all of recorded history.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Pittsburgh does really lack good public transportation, but I blame the people who live here more than the companies providing transportation.

I don't blame either. The feds and the state take a bunch of transportation money out of the Pittsburgh Metro in the form of various taxes, then only give some of it back, and the money they do give back they don't let us spend as we see fit.

Let us keep all that money and spend it as we like, and then we can start blaming the locals for the results. Until then, I blame the feds and the state, because they are the ones determining what happens with our money.

[airwave09]

Everyone here that is suggesting that PAT has to make a profit in order to be successful is being a hypocrite unless they demand the same standards for every other form of transportation.

Place a toll the parkways to even things out and then see how many people jump to public transit in the burbs. Interstates are a lavish public luxury and therefore should be taxed. Want to still drive in and avoid the toll? Take the back roads. Now everything is on an even footing.

Stop expecting expensive things like interstates to be subsidized and given to you for free and yet at the same time expect public transit to pay for it self.

[Picksburg Stillers]

Originally Posted by airwave09

Everyone here that is suggesting that PAT has to make a profit in order to be successful is being a hypocrite unless they demand the same standards for every other form of transportation.

Place a toll the parkways to even things out and then see how many people jump to public transit in the burbs. Interstates are a lavish public luxury and therefore should be taxed. Want to still drive in and avoid the toll? Take the back roads. Now everything is on an even footing.

Stop expecting expensive things like interstates to be subsidized and given to you for free and yet at the same time expect public transit to pay for it self.

Do you know where the money for highways comes from? Here, let me help you out. The gas tax is essentially a user fee. Don't drive, and you don't have to pay the tax. Drive more, and you pay more.

[Aqua Teen Carl]

So much for the free market fixing everything.

[SuburbanPioneer]

Originally Posted by airwave09

Everyone here that is suggesting that PAT has to make a profit in order to be successful is being a hypocrite unless they demand the same standards for every other form of transportation.

Place a toll the parkways to even things out and then see how many people jump to public transit in the burbs. Interstates are a lavish public luxury and therefore should be taxed. Want to still drive in and avoid the toll? Take the back roads. Now everything is on an even footing.

Stop expecting expensive things like interstates to be subsidized and given to you for free and yet at the same time expect public transit to pay for it self.

Highways are being supported largely by the gas tax. There are other sources including subsidies, but the bulk of money comes from gas taxes.

Also, gas prices went from $1/gal to $4/gal in the past 10 years. That's arguably an equivalent of placing a toll on *all* roads, not just highways. So why is there still so much car traffic on the parkway today?

[airwave09]

Originally Posted by SuburbanPioneer

Highways are being supported largely by the gas tax. There are other sources including subsidies, but the bulk of money comes from gas taxes.

Also, gas prices went from $1/gal to $4/gal in the past 10 years. That's arguably an equivalent of placing a toll on *all* roads, not just highways. So why is there still so much car traffic on the parkway today?

Well, for starters because most of those people probably have no alternative transit options. There has to be a decent rail system in place first before people can switch how they commute. If it existed, then people would be switching in a hurry as the price of gas launches into the stratosphere.

[greg42]

Too bad none of the $1 to $4 gas increase goes to improve transportation. There's actually no increase in receipts because gas taxes are a fixed amount per gallon instead of a percentage. Indeed, it creates a decrease because at this level the consumption will go down....

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by UKyank

Maybe PAT should start charging $10, which apparently is what it costs to run such a route & they won't always be in the red

I wonder what would happen if they tried that strategy?