Evidence of Global Warming in Pittsburgh (Erie, Monongahela: manufacturing, commuting, cities)

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by raubre

Maybe we'll see palm trees and cacti.

I'll bet there's probably some palms around Pittsburgh. They might look a little out of place, but actually some of the palms are very hardy and can live in Canada. I don't know about catci, though--it's probably too soggy there.

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by greg42

Possibly it's a little of both. Although it might not be too surprising for some of the coastal areas of NJ to be in the same zone as places farther south.

It's really interesting to consider the climate change effect on what we can plant. I still think the warming has a bigger effect on other things, like weather. How long of a time period are you considering between this change? I don't see how a decade or two would be enough to change much about which plants could thrive. The last 50 or 60 years? Perhaps, although it seems odd to me.

You never really know with plants. We have some things in pots that are considered annual in this zone. And not just marginal, these are like annual unless zone 8 or 9. Some of them will overwinter just fine in the garage. There are some windows in the garage doors, but it faces north, heh, and no other windows because the side and back are mostly underground. So it doesn't get much light, I try to give them a bit of water now and then, and we have some plants that are on their third, maybe fourth season for some. And some different ones don't typically make it and we get something else.

Good points.

[HillsHollow]

Originally Posted by Caladium

I'll bet there's probably some palms around Pittsburgh. They might look a little out of place, but actually some of the palms are very hardy and can live in Canada. I don't know about catci, though--it's probably too soggy there.

Very true.

Though I wonder if the warming trend is accounting for the rise of all these new PA Wineries?

[stevo6]

Originally Posted by Caladium

I'll bet there's probably some palms around Pittsburgh. They might look a little out of place, but actually some of the palms are very hardy and can live in Canada. I don't know about catci, though--it's probably too soggy there.

I think there are some palms (or palmettos?) along Penn Ave. in the strip.

[stevo6]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

What I always find interesting when people talk about global warming, is that so many people don't believe in it. I mean, how much evidence is really needed? Polar ice caps melting and pictures from space showing it, isn't enough? Water temperatures warming isn't enough? Graphs showing the the average temperature is increasing? Then some goofball will say, last year was cold and NASA doesn't know what they are talking about? There is a warming trend. Many feel man is a part cause. It seems logical, but it is hard to prove to most people. Personally, I think it is a natural occurrence with man being part to blame on top of the natural warming process. Therefore, we are in a double whammy situation. It just seems to be happening too fast for it to only be nature at work. Hard to say though. I just figure if man is causing some of it, we probably should at least try and change our ways a little. What if man is the main cause and we do nothing at all? Seems to be a pretty selfish existence, but we all have to live with ourselves.

This is a good post. I would only suggest that it is hard to prove to all people- not just the doubters.
Conservation and efficient use of resources is always a good idea, crisis or not. I think some of the things in the debate that give people (usually conservatives) heartburn are:
1. There have been so many (false) doomsday predictions over the years that people become irritated by them. Remember the coming ice-age? (Back in the 70s science told us the earth was cooling.) Remember how Carter told us we only have a 50 year supply of oil left? Also false.
2. Its hard to know when an advocate is truely concerned, or just trying to control us for other purposes. When Gore says we must do X,Y, and Z- is it because we must, or is he trying to promote new products/industries, such as electric cars and solar panels? His credibility certainly has been damaged by not only his lifestyle, but also the promotion of false information (the hockey stick graph etc.)
3. The left has always been at odds with corporations and industry and some view global warming as just another way to "stick it to 'em". Add a dash of guilt-ing to achieve extreme irritation.

[SteelCityRising]

I just wanted to take this opportunity to thank the OP for a very enlightening and intriguing thread! I, too, believe that "global warming" (or perhaps "global climate change" to be more precise) is a real phenomenon that we ought to be concerned about. I also concur with h_curtis that it's a shame that there are so many amongst us who would rather stick their heads in the proverbial sand than alter their lifestyles to be more "green".

I moved into the city after a lifetime of living in suburbia so I'd be driving less. Guess what? Pretty much the only place I drive to is work (a 5-mile round-trip commute in a fuel-efficient vehicle) and otherwise I walk everywhere. I use my lights sparingly and rely upon the glow from my PC monitor for light when I'm in my bedroom. I don't use my bathroom light at night, as I instead just keep the door open and have just enough light to function. In lieu of buying an air conditioner I just keep my windows open and hop into the shower now and then to take 2-minute "cool-offs". I try to always keep my freezer fully-stocked so that it will use less energy.

There's just different segments in our society. Some realize that global climate change won't kill them in THEIR lifetimes, so they just don't give a darn. Others don't want to see their great-granchildren or great-great-grandchildren suffering, so they ARE taking corrective measures NOW to try to stave off their demise.

[h_curtis]

Originally Posted by rhondee

Its sad, but some people are like that.

Some? To be quite honest, it is most people. Just look around, most could care less and say it can't be us. Even if there is a 10% chance it is us, would cause me to at least make a little change. It isn't like I am giving up some my whole existence by driving a good car that seats 4 that on my last tank got 35+MPG! Oh and it is turbo charged and fun to drive.

[Caladium]

I'm not yet convinced global warming exists or not, but in either case I don't really think it matters whether or not you drive a mile or so to work.

I like to encourage people to walk because I think it's good for your health, and it increases social awareness when you're out walking in a neighborhood--but I don't think you'll change the weather by making a change in driving habits. If that was the case then you would have seen a dramatic weather shift in Pittsburgh in the 70s when the factories shut down.

[h_curtis]

Originally Posted by stevo6

1. There have been so many (false) doomsday predictions over the years that people become irritated by them.

I don't feel it is a doomsday situation. People will adapt most likely one way or the other. Worse case many of the weak may die if all heck breaks loose, but I never was much into the doomsday crap. I just think it would be most logical to conserve on all levels. Too much fighting and just so much wrong with our habit of using mass energy all the time. So much destruction to get energy as well. Why not cut back a little? Just seem logical. Look at the Gulf of Mexico. What a mess that was and maybe still is? Oil sands? Oh my. Saudi Arabia with total control over our economy? Seriously, I don't care if you think global warming is some joke and the pictures of the ice caps melting are a photoshop. People just need to have a look at what is going on a little and should at least cut back a tiny bit.

[stevo6]

Originally Posted by Caladium

I'm not yet convinced global warming exists or not, but in either case I don't really think it matters whether or not you drive a mile or so to work.

I like to encourage people to walk because I think it's good for your health, and it increases social awareness when you're out walking in a neighborhood--but I don't think you'll change the weather by making a change in driving habits. If that was the case then you would have seen a dramatic weather shift in Pittsburgh in the 70s when the factories shut down.

Your thinking too locally there. The change in Pittsburgh's habits of driving (or manufacturing) by itself would have very little effect on the Global Climate or the local climate. But if you take the sum of all changes in cities across the globe, and analyze them over time- say 25 years- you will presumably see an effect. And that is where the debate lies, because no-one yet has been able to quantify this change in carbon production, or pollutant production, and relate it to the rate of warming of the planet.