Quick Robinson Rant (Pittsburgh, Wilkinsburg, Oakdale: crime, homes, buying)

[PreservationPioneer]

It's not just the suburban mentality, Steelcity. It's our whole culture. The heart of America seems to beat to the tune of, "Out with the old, in with the new."

The way suburbs (I'm not talking about streetcar suburbs or urban suburbs here, but the sprawl/ parking lot/ strip mall places) turn over so rapidly exemplifies this, as I think it should, because the suburban mentality is "who cares about the city. We give up on it. We're going to live over here where everything is shiny and new." Look at Monroeville and Penn Hills, which were suburban paradise to many baby boomers, and now are being given up on as if they were Braddock or Mt. Oliver. When a suburb is no longer new, it becomes unfashionable and falls into decline. The same thing happened to many of the streetcar suburbs, and the city neighborhoods before that.

Our whole culture operates this way, unfortunately. It's not just about where we live. Everyone wants the new phone, the new car, the new girlfriend or boyfriend, the younger girlfriend or boyfriend, Lady Gaga instead of Madonna, Nicki Minaj instead of Lil Kim, etc., etc. There is a counterculture that loves antiques and vintage cars and old houses, but it's really not mainstream to like those things in our culture, at least at my age. It seems only permissible if you are very old, and are remembering the "good old days" or are simply out of the loop.

Anyway, I suppose this will be a thread of rants, and I got this one off my chest.

[PreservationPioneer]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

When that does happen how much will it cost to tear down suburbia and return it to nature?

When that does happen, you can bet that our precious historic buildings and row-houses in the city will be replaced with the architecture of Cranberry and Settler's Ridge.

Welcome to Polish Hill Plaza:

[SteelCityRising]

Originally Posted by alleghenyangel

It's not just the suburban mentality, Steelcity. It's our whole culture. The heart of America seems to beat to the tune of, "Out with the old, in with the new."

The way suburbs (I'm not talking about streetcar suburbs or urban suburbs here, but the sprawl/ parking lot/ strip mall places) turn over so rapidly exemplifies this, as I think it should, because the suburban mentality is "who cares about the city. We give up on it. We're going to live over here where everything is shiny and new." Look at Monroeville and Penn Hills, which were suburban paradise to many baby boomers, and now are being given up on as if they were Braddock or Mt. Oliver. When a suburb is no longer new, it becomes unfashionable and falls into decline. The same thing happened to many of the streetcar suburbs, and the city neighborhoods before that.

Our whole culture operates this way, unfortunately. It's not just about where we live. Everyone wants the new phone, the new car, the new girlfriend or boyfriend, the younger girlfriend or boyfriend, etc., etc. There is a counterculture that loves antiques and vintage cars and old houses, but it's really not mainstream to like those things in our culture, at least at my age. It seems only permissible if you are very old, and are remembering the "good old days" or are simply out of the loop.

Anyway, I suppose this will be a thread of rants, and I got this one off my chest.

Very well stated. These are my exact sentiments. I deliver to Penn Hills often, and while some of the community is stable and quite nice it is overall a community that seems like it is in decline. I'm sure at one point it was "the" place to be for professional families looking to flee the city, but now the abysmal public schools, rising crime, and proliferation of low-class businesses has led to those same people moving out of Penn Hills and somewhere else.

I think this might just be indicative of a larger trend of "When the going gets tough, let's just relocate instead of fighting to take back our neighborhoods".

[greg42]

Originally Posted by alleghenyangel

When that does happen, you can bet that our precious historic buildings and row-houses in the city will be replaced with the architecture of Cranberry and Settler's Ridge.

Welcome to Polish Hill Plaza:

Publix, that'll never be here.

I don't have any more energy for this tonight. Little too much sky is falling, I'd say, most likely.

[soniqV]

Most chains that cater to strip malls will not be able to survive if energy is expensive and they're not benefiting from special tax and lobby privileges.

The sky isn't falling yet. But it is deteriorating. This isn't conspiracy theory, it's basic math and classical economics. It's not an exaggeration to say we are in uncharted economic territory and the bubble extends far beyond a simple problem of real estate prices. And when it pops, when the sky actually falls, you won't have much time to react.

Call me crazy now, call me right later.

[MeinGlanzendMotorrad]

There is nothing less attractive and more in need of going away than row houses. Ugh, talk about an eyesore.

I like Robinson for the most part, I just wish slightly less people also liked it so it'd be less of a pain in the ass to get around during the day (Or more things open late, since I'm a night person.)

[greg42]

Originally Posted by soniqV

Most chains that cater to strip malls will not be able to survive if energy is expensive and they're not benefiting from special tax and lobby privileges.

The sky isn't falling yet. But it is deteriorating. This isn't conspiracy theory, it's basic math and classical economics. It's not an exaggeration to say we are in uncharted economic territory and the bubble extends far beyond a simple problem of real estate prices. And when it pops, when the sky actually falls, you won't have much time to react.

Call me crazy now, call me right later.

Your post was not what I had in mind when I wrote that, in fact, although looking back I can see why you might think because, well, yours is the sort of post someone might single out with that term. But I was referring directly to allegheny's bit that I quoted, that we would raze all the history in the city for suburban-style architecture. Not too likely. Heck, in your scenario, we won't have money to do something like that.

No, I in fact worry about scenarios like yours soniqV, not because I currently commute 20 miles to work, but because it will affect what we're all used to, no matter whether we live in the city or the suburbs. That is a much bigger issue than another urban vs suburban debate.

This thread, though, is probably not a bigger issue than another urban vs suburban debate.

[soniqV]

Whoops, sorry about that! Guess I'm just a little too used to being on the receiving end of those words.

I do think there will be lots of market-driven urban development though as long as the great "decentralization" is short and sweet and a stable currency emerges. In the digital age that shouldn't take too long. And who knows, maybe suburbanism will eventually benefit from it too. But first you have to have the crunch before you can begin to recover, and that will be the hardest part.

[PreservationPioneer]

Originally Posted by MeinGlanzendMotorrad

There is nothing less attractive and more in need of going away than row houses. Ugh, talk about an eyesore.

Move to Cleveland, then.

Eyesores?
















Okay, so a lot of our row-homes look like these in Wilkinsburg:



But they look awesome restored.

And you can't deny that the South Side, Lawrenceville, Bloomfield, Shadyside, and the North Side have many gorgeously restored row-houses.

[SlurmsMcKenzie]

Originally Posted by MeinGlanzendMotorrad

There is nothing less attractive and more in need of going away than row houses. Ugh, talk about an eyesore.

I like Robinson for the most part, I just wish slightly less people also liked it so it'd be less of a pain in the ass to get around during the day (Or more things open late, since I'm a night person.)

Me too. Its not so bad if you know the shortcuts that allow you to get in and out of the complex at various points without suffering in traffic on the main drag(s).

Robinson will be fine, I don't really see any lessening of demand there in the near future. That particular plaza seemed sandwiched in between two, more popular plazas (Walmart and Target) yet was difficult to get into and out of. It didn't really have any real big name anchor attractions, either. Every other shopping plaza within the Robinson area seems to be doing OK, other than the K-Mart Plaza which is in a lousy location.