Fracking...is it safe? I know very little and would like to know what you all think about it! (York: homes, to buy)

[South Range Family]

*Update II* Further Review of the Data in Dimock Shows Room for EPA Error - Energy In Depth - Northeast Marcellus Initiative | Energy In Depth – Northeast Marcellus Initiative

Dimock the Full Story | Energy In Depth – Northeast Marcellus Initiative


I remember when my Dad built our house in 1969. The neighbors made a big show of setting their water on fire. My Dad was impressed enough to have our well driller go beyond the neighbor's 120 feet. We hit another aquafir at 300 feet. That well still has great water today. We had oil seeping up in our back yard, and the neighbors set their water on fire. The only problem is that it was long before they ever drilled any gas wells by us. A few years later they punched 3 gas wells pretty close to us. That's when the oil stopped seeping, and the neighbors were no longer able to light their water.

Hopes, were those farm ponds a real attention getting blue, and green? This is what most farmers use. I don't like the looks, so I use a herbicide in my pond. Aquashade Blue Pond Dye - Lake Restoration

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by South Range Family

*Update II* Further Review of the Data in Dimock Shows Room for EPA Error - Energy In Depth - Northeast Marcellus Initiative | Energy In Depth – Northeast Marcellus Initiative

Dimock the Full Story | Energy In Depth – Northeast Marcellus Initiative

I remember when my Dad built our house in 1969. The neighbors made a big show of setting their water on fire. My Dad was impressed enough to have our well driller go beyond the neighbor's 120 feet. We hit another aquafir at 300 feet. That well still has great water today. We had oil seeping up in our back yard, and the neighbors set their water on fire. The only problem is that it was long before they ever drilled any gas wells by us. A few years later they punched 3 gas wells pretty close to us. That's when the oil stopped seeping, and the neighbors were no longer able to light their water.

That sounds like the area had an old oil well.

Originally Posted by South Range Family

Hopes, were those farm ponds a real attention getting blue, and green? This is what most farmers use. I don't like the looks, so I use a herbicide in my pond. Aquashade Blue Pond Dye - Lake Restoration

Thanks. Never heard of that. I doubt the Amish would do that to their ponds. I did a google search of images with pond dye, and the ponds didn't look like that. Definitely not the blue. It was green but not like the green for the pond dye pictures I found.

It was a green like when salt water gets into a pond like the picture below that's from a website that has nothing to do with drilling.



From a trail called 'Life': Tlingit Adventure

Which is similar to this picture of brine contamination:



We didn't even make the connection until after the course of the day. On the drive up, we were just casually commenting, "Those ponds are a funny color." Then we started noticing all of the wells. On the way home, the massive gas leak was in the exact same stretch of road.

[rugerjitsu]

Originally Posted by Tiger Beer

This one deals with some of those PA towns and fracking:


Fracked Off - USA - YouTube

Probably one of the more memorable parts is when he lights the water from the faucet on fire. That's a lot of chemicals into the drinking water supply.

it's called methane, and if you lived in the NE area of Pennsylvania, you would be well aware that it's in your water.

here's a video of actual residents of Dimock, one of them sets the record straight on lighting their water on fire!


Cabot and Clean Water in Dimock, PA - YouTube

[Bobzooka]

I work as an engineer in the marcellus shale industry and, to be honest, I would vote "don't know enough to say." Overall, the short-term effects of fracking have been highly propagandized and sensationalized while the long-term effects have even yet to be studied. It's hard to tell. My gut feeling based on what I know is that when a company does things properly, safely, and compliantly, the dangers, both short and long term, are minimal. It's when companies, be it large or small, start circumventing procedures, not reporting to the DEP properly, etc. that you can run into issues. This makes me believe issues lay more in regulation that the intrinsic process. This certainly echos exactly what a lot of people have already said in this thread.

I try to remain objective about things, but I understand if you're not going to necessarily trust some of my opinions. Anyway, let's see what I can conjure up here.

Originally Posted by Goodnight

The injection of chemicals into the ground can contaminate the groundwater in some areas, also the disposal of chemicals used in fracking.

Check out this recent study: Gas drilling isn't harming reservoir water, IUP tests show - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review

The wells that are being drilled and fracked around the Beaver Run Reservoir have shown no signs thus far of harming the water. Again, I would agree with you that IMPROPER injection or disposal of chemicals can lead to major issues, but the fact that wells are being drilled right next to a reservoir and are producing no measurable negative effects is a testament to how safe the process is when done correctly.

Originally Posted by rugerjitsu

it's called methane, and if you lived in the NE area of Pennsylvania, you would be well aware that it's in your water.

here's a video of actual residents of Dimock, one of them sets the record straight on lighting their water on fire!


Cabot and Clean Water in Dimock, PA - YouTube

Lighting water/tap water on fire is one of those highly sensationalized things I was talking about. I'm having trouble finding the study right now, but the bottom line is that methane and other contaminants can and will leak into the water without any provocation whatsoever. There has been no proof linking fracking to an increase in methane propagation or anything of the sort.

It's important to note that when we are drilling wells, there's one thing we want in our well: natural gas. We also only want it at one time: when we're ready to produce it. During the entire drilling process, it is extremely important to keep gas pockets and other things OUT of the wellbore. The good hole will act independently of anything in the formation around it until it is being fracked and ready to produce. A proper drilling procedure will involve calculating pressures within the wellbore in order to prevent the pressure from the surrounding formations from coming in. It's also important to note that the first 2000-3000 feet are cased and cemented prior to drilling any deeper. This isolates the well from the water table for the rest of the process.

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by Bobzooka

I work as an engineer in the marcellus shale industry and, to be honest, I would vote "don't know enough to say." Overall, the short-term effects of fracking have been highly propagandized and sensationalized while the long-term effects have even yet to be studied. It's hard to tell. My gut feeling based on what I know is that when a company does things properly, safely, and compliantly, the dangers, both short and long term, are minimal. It's when companies, be it large or small, start circumventing procedures, not reporting to the DEP properly, etc. that you can run into issues. This makes me believe issues lay more in regulation that the intrinsic process. This certainly echos exactly what a lot of people have already said in this thread.

I try to remain objective about things, but I understand if you're not going to necessarily trust some of my opinions. Anyway, let's see what I can conjure up here.




Check out this recent study: Gas drilling isn't harming reservoir water, IUP tests show - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review

The wells that are being drilled and fracked around the Beaver Run Reservoir have shown no signs thus far of harming the water. Again, I would agree with you that IMPROPER injection or disposal of chemicals can lead to major issues, but the fact that wells are being drilled right next to a reservoir and are producing no measurable negative effects is a testament to how safe the process is when done correctly.




Lighting water/tap water on fire is one of those highly sensationalized things I was talking about. I'm having trouble finding the study right now, but the bottom line is that methane and other contaminants can and will leak into the water without any provocation whatsoever. There has been no proof linking fracking to an increase in methane propagation or anything of the sort.

It's important to note that when we are drilling wells, there's one thing we want in our well: natural gas. We also only want it at one time: when we're ready to produce it. During the entire drilling process, it is extremely important to keep gas pockets and other things OUT of the wellbore. The good hole will act independently of anything in the formation around it until it is being fracked and ready to produce. A proper drilling procedure will involve calculating pressures within the wellbore in order to prevent the pressure from the surrounding formations from coming in. It's also important to note that the first 2000-3000 feet are cased and cemented prior to drilling any deeper. This isolates the well from the water table for the rest of the process.

Good post.

[gg]

Originally Posted by Bobzooka

I work as an engineer in the marcellus shale industry and, to be honest, I would vote "don't know enough to say....

Good post. I still wonder about earthquakes and Marcellus. As crazy as it sounds, there does seem to be a disruption in the earth surface and it can create movement. Sure is an odd process and I do think we are all living in a guinea pig situation. Some might say, oh that is bs about water or bs about earthquakes, but in reality I don't think anyone knows. Money makes us do crazy things and we are just all living in a chance type situation. It is poor judgement and we all know it, but we are taking a risk in hopes there is a benefit.

Ah well, time will tell. There will no doubt be shortcuts taken and some big problems at some point. No way to regulate all this activity all the time. Money is too big of a motivator to people's greed.

[Aqua Teen Carl]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Some might say, oh that is bs about water or bs about earthquakes, but in reality I don't think anyone knows.

The earthquakes in Ohio were actually confirmed to be caused by fracking:

Confirmed: Fracking Caused Ohio Earthquakes | ThinkProgress

So it's no longer unknown: man's own actions caused earthquakes in OHIO.

[gg]

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

The earthquakes in Ohio were actually confirmed to be caused by fracking:

Confirmed: Fracking Caused Ohio Earthquakes | ThinkProgress

So it's no longer unknown: man's own actions caused earthquakes in OHIO.

Hmm, well I need more than that, but to be honest, I do feel fracking can have an effect with earth movement. Can we live with the earth moving under our feet for the money? How bad will the earth move? Who knows? I just hope my homes foundation stays solid will all this crap going on around us for the money. I agree with the consensus that the oil/gas industry is taking advantage of these economic times. Most will look the other way for the money that is involved. Like I said, time will tell. This industry might come and go very fast if people are starting to live in fear of their home being shaken. There are limits to greed and earthquakes might fall in the limit category. Maybe Shell and others are waiting to see the real effects. Big energy companies like Shell/BP/XOM don't need to move fast into an industry. They will wait and see, then enter to monopolize.

[Aqua Teen Carl]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Hmm, well I need more than that, but to be honest,

There are dozens of sources that confirm that, I just picked one.

[gg]

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

There are dozens of sources that confirm that, I just picked one.

You remind me of myself years ago. At my age I have to really look close at agendas. Green people want fracking to stop NOW! The other side want it to be the next gold rush and make hoards of money and retire in the French Riviera. The pawns, like all of us are hoping people know what they are doing. The question is, how safe is fracking? The answer seems to be, no one knows, BUT the earth has moved under my own feet in Pittsburgh. Heck there is an engineer in the industry posting on here that doesn't know. I have been here since the '60s and never felt the earth move before, so I start thinking about greed and what are people doing? I have a feeling the quakes have a relationship with fracking, but have no direct proof from anyone without an agenda. Interesting puzzle, but if we feel quakes year after year, the puzzle will be solved and I don't think people will be okay with it, no matter how much money is involved. Earthquakes are a bit over the top. I can hear booth sides now. One side saying, we told you to stop. The other side, oh those little tiny tremors are insignificant. How much pain will we endure for the greed? Hard to say now. Depends on how much money and how much pain.