One Grandview where are you? (Pittsburgh: homes, purchase, landlords)

[gg]

Originally Posted by MathmanMathman

Half-a-million? And people complain about populations moving out of the city for the more-bang-for-the-buck burbs.

Figure out the taxes on one of those in the city! Oh my! Can't be done in our region.

[Jrn14]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

If you're talking about the Vista Grande condos at 501 Grandview Avenue then be advised that not everyone has an extra half-million dollars lying around to buy a condo during this recession.

501 Grandview Avenue #1001, Pittsburgh PA - Trulia

They don't?


Ooops yes... those are the ones and I ment Condos....

Apparently they are using one to film "One Shot"

[UKyank]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

If you're talking about the Vista Grande condos at 501 Grandview Avenue then be advised that not everyone has an extra half-million dollars lying around to buy a condo during this recession.

501 Grandview Avenue #1001, Pittsburgh PA - Trulia

The pics in that link don't even look that nice - well it's nice, but definitely not half-million dollars nice. I think those will sit empty for awhile.

Oh, and the property tax bill alone would only be $11,600

[gg]

Originally Posted by UKyank

The pics in that link don't even look that nice - well it's nice, but definitely not half-million dollars nice. I think those will sit empty for awhile.

Oh, and the property tax bill alone would only be $11,600

Yeah what was I thinking? Only a grand a month. Peanuts. Just another example why it is almost impossible to build new in Allegheny County. We are in a bad situation with low values/verse huge tax millage rates. Just make our region so hard to grow. Allegheny County will no doubt continue to lose population as the tax burden just keeps going and going. We keep putting bandaids on all these problems by making all of us pay these crazy tax rates. What a shame.

[ML North]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Yeah what was I thinking? Only a grand a month. Peanuts. Just another example why it is almost impossible to build new in Allegheny County. We are in a bad situation with low values/verse huge tax millage rates. Just make our region so hard to grow. Allegheny County will no doubt continue to lose population as the tax burden just keeps going and going. We keep putting bandaids on all these problems by making all of us pay these crazy tax rates. What a shame.

It doesn't make sense to take these things out of context. People generally spend about 2 times their annual income on housing. So someone buying a $500k house is likely earning around $250k annually, or about $21k per month. Someone raking in $21k per month can likely afford a $1000 monthly property tax bill.

And actually we already knew this, due to the significant population of $500k+ homes in Shadyside, Squirrel Hill, Fox Chapel, and elsewhere in Allegheny County.

[gg]

Originally Posted by ML North

It doesn't make sense to take these things out of context. People generally spend about 2 times their annual income on housing. So someone buying a $500k house is likely earning around $250k annually, or about $21k per month. Someone raking in $21k per month can likely afford a $1000 monthly property tax bill.

And actually we already knew this, due to the significant population of $500k+ homes in Shadyside, Squirrel Hill, Fox Chapel, and elsewhere in Allegheny County.

You have to be kidding. Right? You can justify a tax burden all you like, but take it from someone in the real estate business, taxes kill our area. You CAN'T build super cheap housing unless you are talking about shared walls and a host of other shortcuts. If you are building a free standing brick home, it is going to cost over $300K and that is if it is small. Add that to land costs you are over $400K. They are VERY hard to sell and when they sell, they often are resold for less money because of the crazy taxes.

Out of context? It is spot on context! I have been selling for decades. The tax bill is a huge consideration on purchases and growth. You are not going to convince me you are somehow correct, so we might as well just agree to disagree on this matter. I wouldn't even know where to begin with anyone that wants to justify our millage rates.

[gg]

Taxes are reoccurring bills that you don't get back. Your home should be your largest investment. Yes, it is an investment as well as a place you live. These taxes kill any appreciation you should be getting. You need the appreciation to keep up with inflation and also, what happens if that rainy day hits you when you are older and are too old to work. You can downsize or maybe get something back out of your hard work. I just don't understand how anyone can justify these tax increases that seem to be never-ending. We already have some of the highest taxes in the country. Ranking right up there with NJ!

[ML North]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

You have to be kidding. Right?

I'm not.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

You can justify a tax burden all you like,

I'm not justifying the magnitude at all. Rather, I'm arguing that a person purchasing a $500k house can likely afford the taxes that come with it. Whether they'll chose to purchase elsewhere to avoid that tax bill is another discussion.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

You CAN'T build super cheap housing unless you are talking about shared walls and a host of other shortcuts. If you are building a free standing brick home, it is going to cost over $300K and that is if it is small. Add that to land costs you are over $400K.

I don't see how any of this is relevant to the specific issue that we're discussing. We're talking about $500k condos and whether they are affordable, including taxes. I think that for some people, they certainly could be. For some reason that you have yet to mention, you seem to disagree with this.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Out of context? It is spot on context!

Nope. A $1000 monthly tax bill is affordable for someone earning $250k and is not affordable for someone earning $40k. Originally, you were arguing that $1000 tax bill is not affordable. I believe you said "impossible in our region," or something to that effect. Well, there are certainly people in the area earning $250k or more annually that could afford that tax bill. And in fact many people in your own neighborhood fit into that category.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

I have been selling for decades.

And I can multiply, add, divide, and subtract.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

The tax bill is a huge consideration on purchases and growth.

Yes, certainly. I agree with and haven't disputed this in any way.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

You are not going to convince me you are somehow correct,

Well my argument is simply that there are some people in Pittsburgh who can easily afford a $500k condo and the taxes that come with it. That's all. If you're disputing this fact, then you are simply wrong, because there are many people that can and do. Many of them are living in your own neighborhood. There's also a large group of them living Downtown in Piatt Place.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

so we might as well just agree to disagree on this matter.

Well, that's fine with me. Let's just make sure that we're actually arguing the same point.

Originally Posted by h_curtis

I wouldn't even know where to begin with anyone that wants to justify our millage rates.

I don't know? But I don't see why you'd need to, because that's not at all the point that I made.

[gg]

Originally Posted by ML North

Well my argument is simply that there are some people in Pittsburgh who can easily afford a $500k condo and the taxes that come with it. That's all. If you're disputing this fact, then you are simply wrong, because there are many people that can and do. Many of them are living in your own neighborhood. There's also a large group of them living Downtown in Piatt Place.

When looking at real estate picture a pyramid and the top little point are the big buyers that can afford a million and it gets much wider as you move down the scale. When I restore a home I a make sure I am not in that top part of the pyramid, because once you exhaust those few, you are waiting for an out of town buyer. In the mean time my investments has taxes attached to it that kills my profit if any. The point is the buyers are few at the higher end. I have a feeling many would splurge a lot more on a home in our region if it wasn't for the crazy tax problems in our area. We just get eaten alive with these taxes and it will not change.

[gallacus]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

When looking at real estate picture a pyramid and the top little point are the big buyers that can afford a million and it gets much wider as you move down the scale. When I restore a home I a make sure I am not in that top part of the pyramid, because once you exhaust those few, you are waiting for an out of town buyer. In the mean time my investments has taxes attached to it that kills my profit if any. The point is the buyers are few at the higher end. I have a feeling many would splurge a lot more on a home in our region if it wasn't for the crazy tax problems in our area. We just get eaten alive with these taxes and it will not change.

I've always thought that, while it would be nice if property taxes were lower here, complaining about them is a little like concentrating on a tree instead of taking a look at the whole forest. If you take a step back and look at the overall tax burden of living in Pittsburgh, we're pretty average. I've looked this up several times, and we're consistently ranked right in the middle. Here's just one quick example.