Why Pittsburgh's schools aren't that bad... (Oliver: public schools, codes, stats)

[steindle]

You seriously can't even present objective facts about Pittsburgh Public Schools on here without people smearing them. Impressive consistency.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Herodotus

The one issue that kills the city schools, and which is difficult to measure, is the effect that disruptive students have on academic performance. I believe disruptive behavior in the schools causes just as many parents to move out of the city, as poor academic performance does.

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

Not only are disruptive students and issue, but drugs and violence as well. Nobody is going to care about their high school education when some dude and his boys are looking to jump him.

It bears mentioning again that this isn't really a tremendous issue with the magnet programs in the city.

For students entering kindergarten, magnets are essentially a random lottery, meaning the only selection is based upon the parents who care enough to apply. But after that, there are all sorts of entrance requirements and weights, which typically weed out a high proportion of dummies and slackers.

Also, it's pretty easy to get kicked out of the magnet system and be sent back to your neighborhood school. Starting in 6th grade, if you miss more than 10% of the school year, or are suspended more than six days, you can be kicked out. Starting in high school, you're kicked out if you have less than a 2.0 GPA. So bullies ought to be sent back to their neighborhood schools pretty quickly.

[steindle]

Originally Posted by eschaton

It bears mentioning again that this isn't really a tremendous issue with the magnet programs in the city.

E.g., I was at CAPA for three years and didn't witness a single physical altercation.

[Herodotus]

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

Not only are disruptive students and issue, but drugs and violence as well. Nobody is going to care about their high school education when some dude and his boys are looking to jump him.

When I say disruptive students, that basically covers all of that. Students who behave badly make it difficult for the other kids to learn, and also sap the joy out much of the staff, leading to jaded teachers who are just collecting a check.

[h_curtis]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

That depends on the suburb--here in Wilkinsburg, for example, people would be interested in a lot more than just CAPA. I think Obama and SciTech may also emerge as desirable for some suburban kids due to their specialization.

It is unlikely because the cost. CAPA has something different to offer and is geared towards the arts/music. Wilkinsburg school is horrible, but I still don't think anyone is going to pony up the money for a PPS. Better off paying for a private school or get really good at football and get a scholarship from Central. Oh yeah, not a scholarship have someone "sponsor" you to go there for free.

[scrapp]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Anyway, thoughts?

Matches my observations from K-8 too, thought I'll be interested in seeing your compiled numbers for those grades too.

SciTech has been adding a grade a year... next year is the first year they'll have a 12th grade, so I'd expect numbers to start coming in on that front as they'll start graduating kids.

[speagles84]

Originally Posted by eschaton

FWIW, here's the black 11th grade enrollment in every public/charter school in the county:

PENN HILLS - 199
WOODLAND HILLS - 155
MCKEESPORT AREA - 112
ALLDERDICE - 107
BRASHEAR - 101
PERRY TRADITIONAL ACAD, PITTSBURGH UNIVERSITY PREP - 93
CITY CHS, INTL BACCALAUREATE - 72
OLIVER - 68
PEABODY - 67
GATEWAY - 61
CARRICK, WESTINGHOUSE - 56
WILKINSBURG - 55
LANGLEY - 50
STEEL VALLEY - 44
ACADEMY CHARTER SCHOOL - 42
PITTSBURGH CAPA, WEST MIFFLIN - 38
NORTHSIDE URBAN PATHWAYS - 37
CAREER CONNECTIONS, STO-ROX - 36
CLAIRTON - 33
PROPEL - HOMESTEAD - 32
EAST ALLEGHENY - 25
MOON - 19
BALDWIN , CARLYNTON - 16
CORNELL -15
QUAKER VALLEY -14
CHARTIERS VALLEY, HIGHLANDS, NORTHGATE - 12
PLUM - 11
NORTH HILLS - 10
MONTOUR - 9
ELIZABETH FORWARD, FOX CHAPEL AREA, NORTH ALLEGHENY, WEST ALLEGHENY - 8
SOUTH PARK - 7
BETHEL PARK, UPPER SAINT CLAIR - 6
SHALER AREA, THOMAS JEFFERSON - 5
KEYSTONE OAKS, PA DISTANCE LEARNING, SOUTH ALLEGHENY - 4
RIVERVIEW, SOUTH FAYETTE TWP - 3
SPRINGDALE, AVONWORTH, HAMPTON, MT LEBANON, PA LEARNERS ONLINE, PINE-RICHLAND - 2
BRENTWOOD, DEER LAKES - 1

I'm not saying you are wrong, but your site must be wrong. I graduated from South Park only a few years ago, and there are definetly more than 7 african americans per grade there. My class had approximately 20 to 25 out of 200.

Also does anyone know about the percentage and averages of White students versus Asian-Americans or Hispanics? I do know there are significantly less Asians and Hispanics than White or Black students in the Pittsburgh Metro school districts.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by speagles84

I'm not saying you are wrong, but your site must be wrong. I graduated from South Park only a few years ago, and there are definetly more than 7 african americans per grade there. My class had approximately 20 to 25 out of 200.

These are based upon the number of students who take the PSSA test, which from my understanding is essentially mandatory. Frequently the numbers between the reading and math section are different by 1 or 2 however, so it's possible there's some slight undercounting. You also might be confused because multiracial are marked separately on the test, and some of your "black" classmates might have had one white parent and decided to check that.

Originally Posted by speagles84

Also does anyone know about the percentage and averages of White students versus Asian-Americans or Hispanics? I do know there are significantly less Asians and Hispanics than White or Black students in the Pittsburgh Metro school districts.

Pittsburgh publishes this on their city website. As to the PSSA results, they'll list the numbers of Hispanics and Asians in a school, but unless there's more than 10 in a grade, they don't release the test score averages, as with a sample size that small it doesn't say much.

[Sideblinded]

Eschaton,

Where are you getting your data? PPS published different numbers. The math PSSA scores at Dice are 67% , no science scores are posted either. Pittsburgh Allderdice High School | General Information

Obama has very cluttered data, it lists only 8th grade then combines grades 8 & 11 which is quite strange. (no science again)

Pittsburgh Obama 6-12 | General Information

[speagles84]

Originally Posted by eschaton

These are based upon the number of students who take the PSSA test, which from my understanding is essentially mandatory. Frequently the numbers between the reading and math section are different by 1 or 2 however, so it's possible there's some slight undercounting. You also might be confused because multiracial are marked separately on the test, and some of your "black" classmates might have had one white parent and decided to check that.



Pittsburgh publishes this on their city website. As to the PSSA results, they'll list the numbers of Hispanics and Asians in a school, but unless there's more than 10 in a grade, they don't release the test score averages, as with a sample size that small it doesn't say much.

Oh okay. It has to be quite a few then, it seemed to me when I graduated the class sizes overall were growing, mainly adding more african american and asian students.