Let's go Bucs!!! (Morton, Howard: ceiling, white, conservative)

[erieguy]

Originally Posted by sskink

Not extending Walker was a sound baseball move. Would've been nice to get more than Niese, but it's a pretty fair deal from a value standpoint.

Not tendering Pedro... I was hoping his defense would improve and make this an easy call. He didn't. I'd still rather have him than not.

Not paying Happ an extra $2 mil AAV was stupid. That might be the single-most maddening move the Bucs have done in Huntington's reign. If you say you've been looking at a guy for 3 years because you like his potential, then you sign him and he's freaking brilliant, why in hell do you let him walk? If you trust Searage, you keep him. And then you say you're looking at Kazmir, who's had more breakdowns and will more expensive? Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.

Bucs still have a competitive team, but w/o much power. Makes it hard to come back late in games with no long ball threats.

Still, if they can stay healthy, they can win 88-90 games. The Cubs' moves don't guarantee anything. Just look at the Nats. Arizona might be a bigger threat. Their OF is at least as good at the Bucs', plus they've got Goldschmidt and now some pitching.

All that considered, it's an odd year. Which means Giants win it all.

It's a typical money dump. Should've kept Walker another year and no doubt signed Happ. Pedro's been renting a place in the burbs right next to my buddy for awhile now. He and everyone else knew they weren't keeping him. Hopefully he goes somewhere and shines. Kazmir was NEVER an option. Just the typical "almost but didn't". Melancon is next.

"Rebuilding, rebuilding, rebuilding...Prospects, Prospects, Prospects".

88-90 wins? I'm sure by the time the season starts I'll take the bet against that.

[sskink]

Originally Posted by erieguy

"Rebuilding, rebuilding, rebuilding...Prospects, Prospects, Prospects".

Other than the Snider trade, have the Pirates moved anyone for prospects recently? Nope.

Rebuilding? I don't see rebuilding. Rebuilding would be trading Cutch for prospects, dumping Liriano, etc. etc. See Braves, Atlanta. Like the moves or not, they're mostly sound.

Except Happ. For which I blame Huntington's ego more than Nutting. I think Huntington thinks he's Billy Beane in Moneyball right now. I get the feeling he actually expected gratitude from Happ in the way of taking the Bucs' first offer. Thus his comment, "Pitchers should pay us for fixing them," after Toronto signed Happ.

Originally Posted by erieguy

88-90 wins? I'm sure by the time the season starts I'll take the bet against that.

I've got my caveat in there. "If they stay healthy." There's still not great depth at middle IF or 1b. I do think Harrison will have a much better year, although not the 5 WAR he put up in 2014. Also think Polanco will provide more offense.

They still have one of the two best OFs in MLB. They still have Cole & Liriano, Kang & Cervelli. Couple of studs coming in summer. It's a sound team, provided no injuries to any of the above.

Melancon pretty much has to go this offseason or get traded mid-season. If Bucs keep him, the QO next year will be pushing $18 million - which nobody will pay for Melancon. Thus no comp pick, so Bucs get zip. That would be dumb. I don't believe Melancon is the difference between getting to a WS or not.

[erieguy]

Dont worry. You're going to hear all about Bucs prospects coming up or being ready mid-season, next season, etc..., and all about how good they're going to be in the future. They didn't want to pay Happ for 3 years but they'll say Taillon or Kingham will be ready, yet that's a longshot. They control Niese after next season so if he's a bust he's gone and if the prospects are ready or not they'll get rid of him rather than pay him even if he pitches well.

They have the same outfield and the same lousy pitchers in Locke and probably Morton. Niese is a number 5, maybe a number 4, but will be a 3. The only infield they'll still have is Jhay, Mercer, and Morse who with Serpico are lucky to be in the league, and Bell is supposedly not ready anytime soon. Kang, hopefully, will be back strong but no guarantee. Hopefully Cervelli plays like last year.

Bullpen is going to change. Melancon is a $$$ dump for sure.

Greg Brown and the extension of the Bucs PR dept. will be touting the "future and prospects", guaranteed.

Even healthy, 88-90 wins is a huge stretch. I wouldn't bet 1 cent on it. They just lost 40+ homeruns between Walker and Pedro.

Bucs will never win a WS under current ownership. They're not going to win the division and haven't an ace to win a WC which has been shown the last 2 years. Even getting to a WS isn't in the future, especially when Cutch is gone.

[safak]

Well they better do something. We went into the offseason thinking we had an ok rotation,
Hoping to pick up a better 4th or 5th and drop Locke.

Gave up Happ, Burnett of course is gone, Morton supposedly was trying to be given away for some scrub First Basemen from Texas (word is that fell through because Rangers wouldn't pay any of Morelands salary).
Morton as of now is our 3rd starter, and Locke has been cloned and is now our 4th AND 5th starter, calling his alter-ego Niese.


This offseason so far, as much as I hate to say it, seems all about saving money and treading water while the 3 severly underpaid goofballs who signed terrible contracts(cutch, marte, liriano) keep us afloat with the young guys who can't leave yet.

This Niese deal screams of 'reclamation' hopeful who, if he doesn't get better isn't worth the club option and won't be picked up..If he does get better, well hey he will be significant trade bate to build future equity.


Burnett tanked at the end of last year, but he kept us in it in the first half with Cole and Liriano. This year, we have Cole every 5th night. Lirian 2 out of every 15 nights. and.....not much.

With the starting pitching the Pirates have right now, they will be out of it by the all star break and selling nieses, i mean pieces.

[erieguy]

Don't be afraid to say it's all about the money because it is...and don't forget to go to Piratefest and get those tix packages and Holdzkom autograph.

After all, they set another attendance record, won't adopt the 50% total revenue rule, and will again be in the bottom of the league in payroll...but Go Bucs and those 1979 highlights!!!

And don't forget the best Bob Walk line of last season. "If the Clemente wall wasn't 21 feet high, that would've been a homerun".

Gotta say, after 30+ years, it's getting real tough to be a Bucs fan. Gotta love the heart of the players, but the front office/ownership is making it near impossible.

[Copanut]

Originally Posted by erieguy

Don't be afraid to say it's all about the money because it is...and don't forget to go to Piratefest and get those tix packages and Holdzkom autograph.

After all, they set another attendance record, won't adopt the 50% total revenue rule, and will again be in the bottom of the league in payroll...but Go Bucs and those 1979 highlights!!!

And don't forget the best Bob Walk line of last season. "If the Clemente wall wasn't 21 feet high, that would've been a homerun".

Gotta say, after 30+ years, it's getting real tough to be a Bucs fan. Gotta love the heart of the players, but the front office/ownership is making it near impossible.

I thought it was Steve Blass who said Don't you wish Roberto wore number 14 when Cutch's hit bounced off the wall ending his chance for the cycle.

[UKyank]

They're going to have to dump more salary if 7 Springs doesn't get some snow soon

[Copanut]

Originally Posted by UKyank

They're going to have to dump more salary if 7 Springs doesn't get some snow soon

[safak]

So now Locke is our #3 and #4 starter after giving up Morton for (insert spin on salary dump here).

Huntington better have a plan..

[erieguy]

Originally Posted by Copanut

I thought it was Steve Blass who said Don't you wish Roberto wore number 14 when Cutch's hit bounced off the wall ending his chance for the cycle.

He could've said that, also...but Walk definitely commented on the height of the Clemente wall.