Would this "California" guy like Pittsburgh?

[blockzilla]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I do have to say while I think you'll love it here, you might have a hard time finding everything you want in one place.

As I see it, you listed three things in terms of a house.

1. A nice old house in a walkable neighborhood fairly close to the city.
2. A "good" school district.
3. Not much more than $200,000.

Getting all three is difficult, because most of the older beautiful neighborhoods which are more affordable are in city neighborhoods or suburbs which do not have good traditional public schooling options.

I'd suggest to you looking at Aspenwall, Oakmont, and parts of Mount Lebanon. Don't discount the City as well, as portions of it have quite good public schooling options. The most prime areas are probably outside of your price range, but you could get a nice old house in Squirrel Hill South which would have good access to two major city parks.

Thanks to all for the great advice so far! Seems like it would be a good fit for me. We actually just returned from a trip to PA, it was a last minute trip so there was minimal time to look at Pittsburgh neighborhoods but I really liked the looks of Aspinwall.

#1 and #2 above are accurate, but we can definitely go up from $200K if needed. That would be the cash buying price we could afford but I'm certainly not opposed to taking on some mortgage to get the neighborhood we want. I'd say about $350-$400K would be as high as we'd want to go.

I was able to find a solid federal job lead that would be working right downtown. After living in SoCal a top priority of ours is to minimize commutes and/or utilize public transportation if it exists. So 3 neighborhood questions:
Would Aspinwall/Oakmont have traffic issues coming into the city for a commute?
I've read that Mount Lebanon would have a legitimate public transportation option to downtown?
Squirrel Hill looks like a breeze of a commute to downtown, are the schools good, and do the neigbhorhoods have a fair amount of small children?

[robrobrob]

Originally Posted by blockzilla

I say "California" guy because I grew up in a small town in Michigan (800 people), college in Michigan then to Southern California upon graduation. 10 years here and I still don't feel as if I've ever really "fit" in as far as connecting to people and building lasting friendships. Wife is from central PA, went to school in Pittsburgh and the desire to move back closer to our families now that we have 2 children has us considering Pittsburgh for the family aspect and convenience of having several good friends of my wife already there.

Sounds like it would be a great place for me? Pros and cons from my opinions based on reading this board:

Pros:
Cost of living - obviously a big one, we have two 6 figure incomes and both commute almost an hour to reasonable school districts and nice neighborhood, and still had to pay $650K for a house
Commute - Seems like even if you work in the city you don't have to drive an hour out of it to find someplace with a family friendly feel and solid schools
Housing - Love the older housing stock, walkability of front porch neighborhoods that seem to be plentiful in the "close in" semi-burbs.
Family - Obviously a huge one
People - A big one for me personally. The husbands of my wife's college friends in Pittsburgh and I usually seem to be instant buddies. In fact I feel closer to some of the people there after one weekend of hanging out than anyone in SoCal after 10 years belive it or not. I just seem to "connect" better with those in the midwest/northeast for whatever reason.
City - Love the blue collar identity, history, sports fanaticism
Bonus - I love Pittsburghese, the European ethnic element in some of the neighborhoods, old school type mentality about sense of community, etc. that sounds like it exists.

Cons:
Jobs: Although it seems my wife could snag a fairly comparable 6 figure medical job (UPMC), my career as an engineer for Dept of Defense communications systems doesn't seem to translate well to the local economy. The plus side seems to be that we could almost buy a house outright with the equity we have (~$200K), so the single 6 figure income could actually do quite nicely in Pittsburgh even if I just had the luxury of getting to take care of the kids at home instead of putting them in full time daycare.
Weather: Doesn't bother me, but a bigger deal for the wife. I like the seasons, but she REALLY doesn't want to scrape windows, drive in the snow, get kids ready to always go out in snow/rain/etc. So I think living close to work would be key.
Outdoor activities: This is the one thing I do love about CA, specifically the mountains. Perhaps it is not too big of a con though, I think I could still take every bit of enjoyment from Appalachia as I do from the Sierra, while perhaps not having as much of a crowd every time. Just the wilderness experience itself is enough for me, camping, hiking, backpacking, etc. I keep hearing that the outdoor activities that Pittsburgh has access to are underrated.

So what do you think? When I put it down on paper it seems like a no brainer, but who knows?

Before you even look into where to live you really need to figure out if your wife's six figure job is really a six figure job here. A friend who is an attorney took a 40% pay cut to move back. He lived in DC and works at a nice firm here.

Aspinwall is great but 200,000 may not get you "enough" house. Certainly, you won't get a large house and may not get you a garage let alone a 2 car garage. Personally, I think you would have to spend at least 300,000 and closer to 400,000 if you want an older home with character that has some updates. The other thing is that most likely the house will have only 1 full bath upstairs and if there is a second full bath it is probably in the basement or on the first floor. I used to live in Aspinwall and it is more expensive than you think but it is a great town with a great commute to Oakland and downtown.

The thing that would be hard for you is that you are going to a place where the weather dictates what you can and can not do on a given day. I think it is unreasonable to expect to be outside as often here as you are in Southern California. For example, if you are a runner you will have to spend about 3 months running outside with temperatures near freezing. I used to do it all the time but if you are used to running in shorts you may not like it. Your wife seems to understand what you would be giving up.

[blockzilla]

Originally Posted by robrobrob

Before you even look into where to live you really need to figure out if your wife's six figure job is really a six figure job here. A friend who is an attorney took a 40% pay cut to move back. He lived in DC and works at a nice firm here.

Aspinwall is great but 200,000 may not get you "enough" house. Certainly, you won't get a large house and may not get you a garage let alone a 2 car garage. Personally, I think you would have to spend at least 300,000 and closer to 400,000 if you want an older home with character that has some updates. The other thing is that most likely the house will have only 1 full bath upstairs and if there is a second full bath it is probably in the basement or on the first floor. I used to live in Aspinwall and it is more expensive than you think but it is a great town with a great commute to Oakland and downtown.

The thing that would be hard for you is that you are going to a place where the weather dictates what you can and can not do on a given day. I think it is unreasonable to expect to be outside as often here as you are in Southern California. For example, if you are a runner you will have to spend about 3 months running outside with temperatures near freezing. I used to do it all the time but if you are used to running in shorts you may not like it. Your wife seems to understand what you would be giving up.

Thanks for the feedback. Like I said I think $350-$400K would be a realistic price point for us for a house. My wife's college best friend lives in Shaler and they have a fantastic (in my opinion) home purchased recently for under $200K, so perhaps that area would be an option if we didn't want to spend $400K to get a decent house (though they just said that the schools and commute were OK, not great). The six figure salary is an estimate based on feedback from some of her professional contacts and old schoolmates working in the same field (2 for UPMC). You are correct, the barely six figures salary I'm estimating is a nearly 40% cut from her current pay.

I certainly don't expect to be outside as often on a day to day basis. The first 23 years of my life were spent in Michigan, with another year in Minnesota in there so I'm no stranger to long, cold winters, scraping windows, shoveling and plowing driveways, etc. I guess it never bothered me as much as most people who flee the northern cities for the south or west in search of better weather.

[robrobrob]

Generally speaking the Shaler Area School District isn't as good as the Fox Chapel Area School District. Shaler is still a good district. Both districts are economically diverse. The difference between Shaler and Fox Chapel in my opinion is that Fox Chapel has some very wealthy families living there which Shaler probably doesn't. Shaler's middle class may be a bit more blue collar. I think Shaler has two elementary schools. From memory, I think Rogers is the better one. Right Hopes? I would think that if you were working in Oakland that you should at least consider O'Hara, part of the Fox Chape Area School District, as well as Shaler. $350-400,000 gets you a fairly nice house in O'Hara.

A friend moved back form Arizona and doesn't mind the seasons however his brother who lives in Southern California said he could never again live in the Burgh because of the weather. It sounds as if your wife is the one that may have trouble with the potential move.

[BrianTH]

Aspinwall, Oakmont, Mt Lebanon, and Squirrel Hill all sound like potential options if your budget can go to the high-300s, and it is not unusual for people with young kids to cross-shop those specific areas.

You can search around for school discussions involving those areas--probably most controversial will be Squirrel Hill, since it is in the City of Pittsburgh, but I would personally have no problem with my kids attending the feeder schools in Squirrel Hill. The public transit commute to Downtown would be best in Squirrel Hill, with lots of bus service. Mt Lebanon has the T, which is nice but a little slow. Aspinwall and Oakmont are also potentially doable with transit, but don't have as much frequency of service. Mt Lebanon would likely be the worst driving commute, and from the other places you can seek out alternative paths to Downtown through the East End as necessary (although the upgraded 28 is likely going to be fine for Aspinwall and Oakmont).