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Old 11-21-2012, 02:35 PM
 
1,445 posts, read 1,963,077 times
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The article talks about the past failed attempts and the current funding:
Quote:
Over the years, there have been plans, ill-fated in retrospect, to turn the East Liberty YMCA into residential housing, as evidenced by a giant advertisement on top of the old building that reads “YLOFTS.com.”
Quote:
All involved in getting the $20 million to pay for the East Liberty Ace admit that it’s been a challenge. Ace might be a name in the national hotel game, but with the closest one nearly 400 miles away, it doesn’t have much reputation among Pittsburgh funders. And at a mere 65 or so rooms, compared to the more than 250 at Ace New York, it hasn’t proven to be of the scale that would get outside investors excited.

So Ace had to get creative. Its pledge to preserve many of the building’s old spaces — the gym, the staircase, the ballroom — means the project is eligible for historic tax credits, and its location in East Liberty puts it up for new market tax credits, too. When all that comes through, it should total about $11 million. They’ve lined up about $2 million from individual local investors and another $2 million from grants, and are in the process of getting their hands on $5 million from a local financial institution that manages funds for families, unions and foundations. It’s a complicated pile of funding, joined by a legal structure that, given the role of ELDI, Ciccone’s firm, Ace and others, “looks like a cobweb,” says Ciccone.
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Old 11-21-2012, 04:31 PM
CFP
 
475 posts, read 621,779 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronPGH View Post
I'm pretty sure none of this press would be happening if the project weren't well on it's way. Ace Hotel is no hack developer.
Did you miss the fact that I included links to press for the two previous failed attempts to develop the space?
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:52 AM
 
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Obviously nothing is guaranteed in this industry, but of course there are many examples of properties that were subject to several false starts before a project finally advanced to actual construction. In fact, there is a great example right nearby in East Liberty in the Highland Building, which similarly had several false starts before the Walnut project got fully funded and started construction.

By the way, here is another free excerpt:

By the Numbers: Pittsburgh on the Upswing – Next American City
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:00 AM
CFP
 
475 posts, read 621,779 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTH View Post
Obviously nothing is guaranteed in this industry, but of course there are many examples of properties that were subject to several false starts before a project finally advanced to actual construction. In fact, there is a great example right nearby in East Liberty in the Highland Building, which similarly had several false starts before the Walnut project got fully funded and started construction.
Comparing a state funded Walnut Capital project to the Ace project is like comparing an aircraft carrier to a jet ski.
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:31 AM
 
20,273 posts, read 32,877,652 times
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Originally Posted by CFP View Post
Comparing a state funded Walnut Capital project to the Ace project is like comparing an aircraft carrier to a jet ski.
My point was that the false starts--which you were previously highlighting--don't necessarily mean anything. And by shifting to an entirely different argument, I think you have effectively conceded that point.

As for Ace's funding mix, it is indeed different from the Highland/Wallace funding mix, but there are a gazillion different variations on how a project like this can get funded, and it is a more modest project anyway, so that doesn't really mean anything either.

Of course you can do pretty well just reflexively betting against any particular development proposal in the earlier stages, since there are a lot of different ways a project can fall apart before, or even after, it begins construction. But you have given us no real reason to believe the odds are worse than usual for this project.
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Old 11-23-2012, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Leesburg
799 posts, read 1,284,247 times
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Bottom line, there is a lot of interest in developing this patch of real estate.
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:07 PM
CFP
 
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I hope it does happen. The building is a treasure (I've been on every floor and on the roof many times), and if they resurrect the tile pool in the basement its original glory will have been fully restored.

My skepticism is purely based on the past history of announcements followed by no action.

This project makes a lot more sense than the Hotel Nevergo, I mean Indigo, that's for sure.
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Old 11-23-2012, 05:20 PM
 
Location: 15206
1,860 posts, read 2,564,755 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFP View Post
I hope it does happen. The building is a treasure (I've been on every floor and on the roof many times), and if they resurrect the tile pool in the basement its original glory will have been fully restored.

My skepticism is purely based on the past history of announcements followed by no action.

This project makes a lot more sense than the Hotel Nevergo, I mean Indigo, that's for sure.
There's actually construction (or demolition) happening still at Indigo. That's very very slow still though.

I think the biggest missed point about failed attempts on both of these projects in the past is that they were trying to do this in 2005-2007 and in 2008 the economy crashed and trying to finance any sort of development was impossible. Even if you had cash investors instead of banks, they likely lost a huge chunk of their money market cash and/or equity in real estate. Even if they didn't lose money, they lost their ability to access it. Even people who had the money to do big projects weren't willing to take the chances and stepped back for a bit.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:32 AM
 
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Some interesting thoughts here, connecting this project to broader migration themes:

Burgh Diaspora - Economic Development From Geographic Mobility
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:37 AM
CFP
 
475 posts, read 621,779 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTH View Post
Some interesting thoughts here
Why in the world would a developer ever say "the fact that we’re developing an Ace Hotel is kinda insane"?

Doesn't he realize there have already been two completely failed attempts to develop the property after PR blitzes like the one he is currently engaged in?

You know why he said it? Because the unconscious mind refuses to lie and reveals the truth no matter what.
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