in response to charges that workers can't make ends meet, upmc opens employee food pantry (Mars: buy, income)

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by UKyank

I would just like to know what this 'living wage' term that keeps being thrown around translates to in an actual starting pay that a company should pay someone in an entry level, low skill position since living wage is wholly dependent on an individuals specific life situation.

I guess the idea is that most people start entry level positions when they are young, prior to having children.

This living wage concept isn't a United States thing. It's a global concept that has been around since the middle ages. It's a hot issue in the UK too.

The biggest problem is that the US hasn't raised it's poverty level since 1969 whereas Britain, Canada and Australia have made adjustments to their poverty levels.

Other countries base living wages on the assumption of one worker in a household. For example, Australia's living wage is based on one worker for a household of five.

Nobody is saying that companies should take the size of individual families into consideration to determine pay.

Proponents of the liviing wage simply want the minimum wages to be raised so working families can live above the poverty line, instead of just single individuals.

If you're going to strongly oppose something, it would be wise to study the issue. You might surprise yourself.

I'll bet you haven't read any link I've provided, but I'll include this paper on the history of the living wage anyway.

The History and Theory of the Living Wage Concept

[gg]

Wonder if UPMC could pay their employees with UPMC dollars that are good at their food bank and they could open up a general store, that way the employees could spend the UPMC dollars in house. Maybe UPMC could offer a 2 or 3% discount for employees using their special currency.

$4000 for an MRI! Goodness what a place.

[CaptainPittsburgh]

Saint Peter, don't you call me 'cause I can't goooooooooo...

[Goodjules]

Originally Posted by hnsq

We aren't missing that fact. If the hundreds of people who feel they are underpaid quit UPMC, then UPMC will have to raise wages to attract people back to it. The fact that people are willing to work for that wage for years without looking for another job is an indicator to me that it might actually be a fair wage.

Even if you have to change careers, nine years is more than enough time to learn a few new skills.

Changing careers isn't all that easy especially if you have a family to support, more so if you're a single parent as it usually entails going back to school. If other employers for similar jobs pay similar wages then changing jobs isn't necessarily a good option because it might mean you'd lose benefits that come with seniority.

I worked for a company for many years that paid less than other companies in the industry. Because I had been there for a long time I had excellent benefits. But the company had relocated us and I had a long commute and didn't particularly like the position I had. I realized I would need to earn about 30% more to compensate for the benefits I would be losing. It took me a year to find another job that paid enough. Remember that I'm a skilled college grad as opposed to lower skilled workers who have fewer options than I would. Anyway, I got a shorter commute and a higher paying job but I went from four weeks paid vacation to two and two months paid maternity leave to six weeks unpaid, among other things. I was pregnant at the time.

I'm just saying that changing jobs isn't a solution if employers in the region all pay crappy wages for the type of work you do. Benefits matter. And if the economy is bad people will stay put no matter what their salary is. Changing careers takes a long time and isn't always feasible for people who work odd hours or have young children. Even if a career change will mean better wages, you often have to take a pay cut initially because you will be starting at an entry level position.

[hnsq]

Originally Posted by juliegt

Changing careers isn't all that easy especially if you have a family to support, more so if you're a single parent as it usually entails going back to school. If other employers for similar jobs pay similar wages then changing jobs isn't necessarily a good option because it might mean you'd lose benefits that come with seniority.

I worked for a company for many years that paid less than other companies in the industry. Because I had been there for a long time I had excellent benefits. But the company had relocated us and I had a long commute and didn't particularly like the position I had. I realized I would need to earn about 30% more to compensate for the benefits I would be losing. It took me a year to find another job that paid enough. Remember that I'm a skilled college grad as opposed to lower skilled workers who have fewer options than I would. Anyway, I got a shorter commute and a higher paying job but I went from four weeks paid vacation to two and two months paid maternity leave to six weeks unpaid, among other things. I was pregnant at the time.

I'm just saying that changing jobs isn't a solution if employers in the region all pay crappy wages for the type of work you do. Benefits matter. And if the economy is bad people will stay put no matter what their salary is. Changing careers takes a long time and isn't always feasible for people who work odd hours or have young children. Even if a career change will mean better wages, you often have to take a pay cut initially because you will be starting at an entry level position.

What does how easy it is to change careers have anything to do with this? Life is tough, deal with it. Nothing worth doing is easy.

[UKyank]

Re: Australia minimum wage http://www.foxbusiness.com/on-air/st...imum-wage-myth
(Which is not by the way the salary to support a household of 5)

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by UKyank

Re: Australia minimum wage The Australian Minimum Wage Myth | Stossel's Take Blog
(Which is not by the way the salary to support a household of 5)

That article reports that Australia's relatively high minimum wage has resulted in high levels of unemployment for 15 to 19 year-olds. From the article, they have an unemployment rate of 16.5%. Apparently, their high minimum wage has resulted in a ruinous level of unemployment for young people. Of course, that article doesn't mention that the U.S. unemployment rate for 16 to 19 year-olds is much higher despite our low minimum wage (23%).

A-13. Employment status of the civilian noninstitutional population by age, sex, and race

[UKyank]

The point is when you say living wage you need to attach a real dollar amount to what you mean which is missing from the discussion as what is a living wage in real dollars differs from person to person.

I mean should a starting no skill job wage be what it equals to support a family of 3 or 4 or 5? I'm not going to knock what ones belief of what a minimum should be but just give out real $ figures rather then fairly meaningless terms.

[villageidiot1]

Originally Posted by hnsq

We aren't missing that fact. If the hundreds of people who feel they are underpaid quit UPMC, then UPMC will have to raise wages to attract people back to it. The fact that people are willing to work for that wage for years without looking for another job is an indicator to me that it might actually be a fair wage.

Even if you have to change careers, nine years is more than enough time to learn a few new skills.

UPMC would not have to raise wages. They would have thousands of job applications in a few days to fill those spots. Jeffrey Romoff knows how much he can get by with paying the lowly workers to keep profits up and justify his $6M compensation. Oh, I forgot that UPMC is non-profit.

[SammyKhalifa]

Originally Posted by villageidiot1

Oh, I forgot that UPMC is non-profit.

Yeah, that's the key for me too. I was under the mistaken impression that their whole reason for existing was to benefit the community.