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Old 05-09-2013, 04:43 PM
 
Location: The Flagship City and Vacation in the Paris of Appalachia
2,773 posts, read 3,839,348 times
Reputation: 2066

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sealie View Post
You can't do real stats without Calc, of course you have to take Calc in an actuarial science program, but this is nit-picking.

Hey, if someone can get into Penn and get an actuarial science degree, good on 'em. Hopefully they can get adequate aid from any Ivy with a halfway-decent endowment, but if not, it's their money. I was responding to the list of things that are worth going $100k into debt for. I feel pretty bad for these kids starting off their career with that kind of albatross wrapped around their necks. Although you can make a good living off of the OP's planned major as well - also six figures after a few years, although I don't know what the average is. A major that probably also requires Calculus, come to think of it.
I think we can both agree that most college degrees are not currently worth $100K and I do feel bad for the recent crop of college graduates. Student loan debt is definitely a major issue influencing the economy nationally and because Pittsburgh has such as highly educated workforce and high cost public colleges, I think the effect may be even more profound. To the OP, I think you have the right idea and the key is making sure you get the ROI you need on your degree and you can complete it as fast as possible. Higher education is currently an interesting world and I have seen students want to stay longer because they have athletic or academic scholarships and I have also seen the students taking out huge loans and trying to graduate as fast as possible. Interestingly enough, my most successful friend has a masters in medieval studies.
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Old 05-09-2013, 04:46 PM
 
Location: The Flagship City and Vacation in the Paris of Appalachia
2,773 posts, read 3,839,348 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kippy View Post
One benefit of getting into an Ivy is that you will never go 100k in debt. In recent years, they have decided to use their huge endowments to reduce the effective cost of tuition. They each have their own tuition policies, but most families won't ever need to pay more than 10% of their annual income to send their kid to an Ivy, with lower/middle-class families not needing to pay a dime.
Yes this is a great point and applies to most private colleges in the U.S. that often discount tuition significantly based on income. Sure there are full payers, but these are the people who can afford it anyway and I have seen many students go to private schools and pay much less than a comparable public school.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:00 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,317 posts, read 12,928,657 times
Reputation: 6165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strelok View Post
LOL at bachelors in business. It's a worthless degree now.
Yep, those Whartonites are all jobless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by track2514 View Post
Actuarial science is actually called actuarial mathematics at Pitt and it is offered through the math departments at most schools. In other words it is a math degree with a a few economics and business courses interspersed. As I mentioned previously, a math degree from an Ivy or even Pitt for that matter may be worth $100K, but there are not many other undergraduate degrees worth that kind of cash.
Right, it's applied mathematics, which is different from a traditional math major.

Quote:
Originally Posted by track2514 View Post
Yes this is a great point and applies to most private colleges in the U.S. that often discount tuition significantly based on income. Sure there are full payers, but these are the people who can afford it anyway and I have seen many students go to private schools and pay much less than a comparable public school.
I wouldn't be so sure about that. A family with a combined income of $250k might be able to afford full sticker at a prestigious private university for one child. Two or three? Forget about it. Not to mention the fact that's money far better spent somewhere else (e.g., grad school, helping a child buy their first house, etc. etc.).
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:31 PM
 
Location: The Flagship City and Vacation in the Paris of Appalachia
2,773 posts, read 3,839,348 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavenWood View Post
I wouldn't be so sure about that. A family with a combined income of $250k might be able to afford full sticker at a prestigious private university for one child. Two or three? Forget about it. Not to mention the fact that's money far better spent somewhere else (e.g., grad school, helping a child buy their first house, etc. etc.).
I have worked in both the public and private university setting and I have seen families in the situation you just mentioned pay less for the private school. For instance, family income of $250K and private school tuition cost of $30K per year and a comparable public school costs $15K. The parents/student fill out the FAFSA and receive no financial aid so public school cost = $15K. The average discount rate in 2011 for private colleges was 38.1% and the average unfunded university gift aid was also pretty high. When you combine these two factors many students attending expensive private schools are getting discounts of 70% or higher. In the case of the 250K earner the private college may or may not ask them to pay full price, it depends highly on enrollment and I have seen cases where very high earners like you mentioned have been offered significant discounts off of their tuition and the cost is still less than the state school. It is really a misnomer that private schools are much more expensive than public schools. It really comes down to a case by case basis and income is not the only factor involved. Here is an interesting report about tuition discounting at private colleges:
https://www.noellevitz.com/papers-re...ounting-report
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Frederick, MD
147 posts, read 291,809 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarqCider View Post
i'll definitely be bummed if i can't go. let's put it this way: life hasn't been too great for me and i solely focused on moving to PA. it has been what keeps me going. read the northern va sub-forums of virginia and you'll see why i hate this area.

i felt more welcomed and accepted in PA than i ever did here, so im hoping everything works out as i planned.
Have you looked into any private schools? I'm going to Point Park in the fall, and I'm getting a scholarship that brings the price down to just a bit over what an in-state school would cost me as a resident of Maryland. Granted, I don't know if they have a good IT program, but it's got a really cool campus downtown and has a lot of nontraditional students, adult students, etc. They have an extremely flexible transfer policy, at least in my experience, as they took all of my community college credits with no issues at all. They even have a few degree programs specifically for people with Associate's degrees already. Something to look into. Maybe call their admissions office, they've been incredibly helpful to me. I don't know if they have good scholarships for anything outside of their arts school, but it's worth looking into. Good luck. I understand the need to make the geographical change that bad. Maybe finish your Associate's if you haven't already, move to Pittsburgh and try to find a job, then work on completing school once you've moved here? Not sure what the IT job market is like with only an Associate's, but that is an option.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:35 PM
 
Location: Frederick, MD
147 posts, read 291,809 times
Reputation: 133
Looks like track2514 beat me to it with the private school suggestion. They are correct, though, that private schools can be cheaper than public schools. This is more often than not true for people going out-of-state, from what I understand.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:35 PM
 
2,369 posts, read 2,898,727 times
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speaking of ivy schools: if your parents are poor and you excell in high school, harvard is willing to give those students a full-ride.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:40 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,317 posts, read 12,928,657 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by track2514 View Post
I have worked in both the public and private university setting and I have seen families in the situation you just mentioned pay less for the private school. For instance, family income of $250K and private school tuition cost of $30K per year and a comparable public school costs $15K. The parents/student fill out the FAFSA and receive no financial aid so public school cost = $15K. The average discount rate in 2011 for private colleges was 38.1% and the average unfunded university gift aid was also pretty high. When you combine these two factors many students attending expensive private schools are getting discounts of 70% or higher. In the case of the 250K earner the private college may or may not ask them to pay full price, it depends highly on enrollment and I have seen cases where very high earners like you mentioned have been offered significant discounts off of their tuition and the cost is still less than the state school. It is really a misnomer that private schools are much more expensive than public schools. It really comes down to a case by case basis and income is not the only factor involved. Here is an interesting report about tuition discounting at private colleges:
https://www.noellevitz.com/papers-re...ounting-report
I know private schools can be cheaper than public schools, and the ones with the highest endowments often are for the majority of enrollees, but there is a cut-off point. But the ones with the highest endowments are charging almost $50k a year in tuition--not $30k, and $200k+ a child over a four-year period is quite the pretty penny, even at that level.

Obviously it makes sense to apply broadly now and compare financial aid packages later because they, just like the admissions process in general, are one giant crapshoot.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:45 PM
 
Location: The Flagship City and Vacation in the Paris of Appalachia
2,773 posts, read 3,839,348 times
Reputation: 2066
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven P. View Post
Looks like track2514 beat me to it with the private school suggestion. They are correct, though, that private schools can be cheaper than public schools. This is more often than not true for people going out-of-state, from what I understand.
Yes the out of state point is a good one because out of state tuition for many public schools in PA can be significantly higher.
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Old 05-09-2013, 05:49 PM
 
43,011 posts, read 107,716,990 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavenWood View Post
I know private schools can be cheaper than public schools, and the ones with the highest endowments often are for the majority of enrollees, but there is a cut-off point. But the ones with the highest endowments are charging almost $50k a year in tuition--not $30k, and $200k+ a child over a four-year period is quite the pretty penny, even at that level.

Obviously it makes sense to apply broadly now and compare financial aid packages later because they, just like the admissions process in general, are one giant crapshoot.
Financial aid does take multiple students into consideration. Your example was a family with four children. If four children aren't enough to offset costs, the parents can go back to school. My sister's children are older than mine, and she figured this out years prior. Both she and her husband returned to school when their children graduated high school. It makes a big difference financially, and the tax write offs are very nice. That's partly why I returned to school when my children were in college.
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