Something to consider before you move to Pittsburgh (Philadelphia, Economy: unemployment, transfer)

[Geeo]

Just a thumbnail sketch and very general: the business climate in Pennsylvania (and the northeast and midwest in general) as a whole is not condusive to new companies coming in. The taxes are high for business, so they go to right to work states in the south and west. The government structure in Pennsylvania and the northeast is a relic of the 18th century. There is no need to have thousands of little towns with their own government structure. In the south and west, they have COUNTY school districts, and their cities annex the new suburbs that spring up, so that many cities down there have the same land area as Allegheny County.

But many of you are correct: the mindset here is that people want to keep their little town boundaries, their own little school districts, their own part-time police and volunteer fire departments instead of looking at the bigger picture. And the politicans eat that up to get elected. And it's both the republicans and democrats who do it.

In a nutshell, there is no reason for Homestead, West Homestead, and Munhall to be three different towns, and that applies to Monroeville, Plum, Trafford and Penn Hills. And any of the other 130 suburbs that ring Pittsburgh.

[guylocke]

In the south and west, they have COUNTY school districts, and their cities annex the new suburbs that spring up, so that many cities down there have the same land area as Allegheny County.

But I don't like that A lot of cities annex their suburbs and their citizens don't even have a say so.

[Katiana]

In the south and west, they have COUNTY school districts, and their cities annex the new suburbs that spring up, so that many cities down there have the same land area as Allegheny County.

Originally Posted by guylocke

But I don't like that A lot of cities annex their suburbs and their citizens don't even have a say so.

The first statement is not entirely true. Not every school district in the south and west is a county district. Here in Colorado, there are two county districts in metro Denver. Both were small, rural counties at the time the districts were formed. My county has two school districts, and school districts do not always follow county lines. The district I live in has property in three counties. The other district in this county has schools in two counties. It is also not true that every western/southern city annexes its suburbs, and it is certainly not true that this is always done without a vote. In Colorado, it is very diffucult for a city to annex land; Denver annexed virtually no land since 1976, and its boundaries are very similar to what they were 100 years ago. In fact, the voters in both the annexing city and the annexee (sp) area have to agree. So if Denver wanted to annex some land in say, Jefferson County, a majority of voters in both places would have to vote yes before the annexation could take place. I have not heard of any "hostile' annexations here (where one side does not agree).

That said, our school districts are larger in general. It is very unusual for a suburban district to have only one high school. Our district has six neighborhood high schools. There is something to be said for economy of scale.

On another topic (though in this thread), EVERYONE is into the green movement right now. It's not just Pittsburgh.

The Nebraskans that went out to Pittsburgh for the Pitt-Nebraska football game in 2004 (?) thought the Pittsburghers were very nice. They thought they were treated much better than at Penn State the year before.

[guylocke]

On another topic (though in this thread), EVERYONE is into the green movement right now. It's not just Pittsburgh.

That's true but Pittsburgh has the largest and soon tallest green building in the world, plus recently announced, the world's first green casino, and square inch for square inch, we have more certified green construction going up than any other city in America. Not to mention, CMU is also one of the greenest universities in the country.

Pittsburgh is becoming a world-leader in this movement and it's constantly recognized. Like I said, General Motors didn't chose Pittsburgh to lead its alternative energy initiative willy nilly.

[Stagger Lee]

Originally Posted by gswpa

I am just relating what other people have said. Sorry ya'll can't take it. The convention is held in a different city every year. Three cars full of people attending the convention got lost when arriving to the city (They complained about the lack of signs and one way streets). One group sat outside the Squirrel Hill tunnel for over an hour and a half. More than one complained about the homeless people peeing in the streets. And then one said "It's worse than Philly". That person HATES Philly so you can imagine how that went.

Where did these people come from? I really think you are just making this all up. How did they like our convention center. These people seem so open minded and intelligent they were probably upset about its modern design and wishing it was in a Walmart......

[Stagger Lee]

Originally Posted by guylocke

That's true but Pittsburgh has the largest and soon tallest green building in the world, plus recently announced, the world's first green casino, and square inch for square inch, we have more certified green construction going up than any other city in America. Not to mention, CMU is also one of the greenest universities in the country.

Pittsburgh is becoming a world-leader in this movement and it's constantly recognized. Like I said, General Motors didn't chose Pittsburgh to lead its alternative energy initiative willy nilly.

Pittsburgh has the most per capita. Pittsburgh leads the green building movement before other cities got into it also. CMU and Penn State are leaders in this. Penn State has one of the top of the line Architectural Engineering schools in the nation. Many firms here push LEED design. Our convention center is a model for many green buildings across the country, and blows Denver's away in green design. I know Pittnurse will say Denver has green buildings, but it is no where close to Pittsburgh. There are old houses being turned green in the slopes also. I would like to soon start my own firm that converts old buildings in Pittsburgh to green ones.

also, I heard the Arena is most likely going for LEED designation. That would be very good to have major public buildings like the Arena, convention center, and casino to be LEED certified.

[guylocke]

These people seem so open minded and intelligent they were probably upset about its modern design and wishing it was in a Walmart......

Hilarious!!

I heard the Arena is most likely going for LEED designation. That would be very good to have major public buildings like the Arena, convention center, and casino to be LEED certified.

I think you will get your wish!! It's looking good!!

Our convention center is a model for many green buildings across the country

That is most definitely true. Like I said, my dad and I saw a whole group from Japan here just to study it. It's not just green certified, it can also either completely or can be mostly heated and cooled using the sun or lack of the sun using the huge fans of material that change positions along the ceiling to either block the sun or concentrate it. It is SO cool to watch them move along the ceiling, like giant, spider-silk thin tarps.

[guylocke]

Here is a good article from a few months ago from the Post-Gazette that outlines a little bit of the economy. They admit it's nothing to get excited about, but it's not nearly as grim as some people make it out to be. It mostly goes on by talking about how although Pittsburgh is far from catching up to national "hot spots" or even "national averages" in some regards, we appear to be better off than many of the other cities that are in the same boat with greater signs of more recovery

Analysis: Pittsburgh's economy is better than you might think

Positive signs

Given the sluggish gains in payroll employment, it is surprising -- and encouraging -- to find that the growth of personal income in the Pittsburgh area has matched or exceeded not only that reported in other manufacturing areas but in the nation as a whole. In 2005 -- the latest year for which data is available -- the per capita income in the Pittsburgh area was $36,000, slightly above the U.S. average of $35,000.



Even more impressive was the fact that in 2005, Pittsburgh ranked 54th in the nation as compared with a ranking of 60th in 1999. This performance compares very favorably with a sizable drop in the rankings of all the other major metropolitan areas in the Fourth Federal Reserve District. Cleveland, which ranked 42nd in the nation in 1999, fell to 61st place in 2005. And Columbus, Ohio, which placed 59th in the country in 1999, ranked 68th in 2005.

Solid foundation for future

The Pittsburgh market has not entirely escaped the slump in new residential construction activity as evidenced by the significant decline in the number of permits issued in both 2005 and 2006. But this downturn appears relatively insignificant when compared with the much larger declines expected in many areas of the country, including California, Florida, Arizona and Nevada.

To sum: While the forthcoming Mellon/Bank of New York merger raises a number of unsettling questions, we continue to take the position that Pittsburgh has finally shaken off the negative effects of a steadily deteriorating industrial economy. While many other regions and metropolitan areas are still struggling to cope with the decline of their once dominant manufacturing industries, Pittsburgh has completed the painful transition from an industrial economy to one increasingly based on service-related activities, including health care, information technology and financial services.

With strong and farsighted political leadership that recognizes the need for a hospitable business climate and, among other things, encourages the forces of innovation and change, Pittsburgh is now well-placed to build on what in our opinion is a much more solid economic foundation.

Seems to me a lot of ideas I hear recently from the county or state ARE pro-business, I just don't see anything being implemented. Ed Rendell is definitely not blind to the business climate in Pennsylvania and HAS done something. Hopefully more to come!

Here is a more recent article that outlines similar things only from a couple days ago. It is speculation.

Private Sector: Economic crystal ball

What are the economic implications for Pittsburgh of a national economy that in all likelihood will be less than robust? While strong gains are not expected in the Pittsburgh region, we believe that in contrast to many other areas of the country, the Pittsburgh area is not facing the economic disruptions associated with the boom-bust cycle in residential construction activity, the cutbacks in automobile related production and employment, and the closing of some large military bases.

Now that health care, professional and technical services, and scientific research have become increasingly important sources of economic growth in the Pittsburgh area, we believe that the local economy is now much less vulnerable to cyclical declines than it was when steel dominated the region.

All in all we continue to take a positive view of the Pittsburgh economy in 2008. But next year's outlook is so clouded by a multiplicity of uncertainties and imponderables that any predictions regarding next year's economy must be considered very tentative -- and subject to change.

[Katiana]

the Pittsburgh area is not facing the economic disruptions associated with the boom-bust cycle in residential construction activity, the cutbacks in automobile related production and employment, and the closing of some large military bases.

[I]The Pittsburgh market has not entirely escaped the slump in new residential construction activity as evidenced by the significant decline in the number of permits issued in both 2005 and 2006.[/i]

A significant decline is pretty much the same as a bust. If it gets better, that will be a boom. That would probably be desirable. I am not aware of any closing of large military bases recently. What/where are they referring to? And we all know that Detroit has faced the same problems with automotive employment as Pittsburgh has with steel employment.

strong and farsighted political leadership

They have got to be kidding!

[MissShona]

Originally Posted by gswpa

We can't even get family members to go to Pittsburgh when they visit now because of past experiences. They think it's a slum. Friends who came into town for a national convention held by their employer said it was the worst city where the convention has been held. We were totally embarrassed. They thought "it was difficult to get around, the city was one of dirtiest, and there were homeless people everywhere".

Have these people ever seen Philadelphia?