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Old 11-21-2013, 01:08 PM
 
1,010 posts, read 1,394,380 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam View Post
A lot of Pittsburgh's pier cities don't have rail. Does Toledo? Tulsa? Memphis?

A lot of the eastern cities, and really major metropolises elsewhere do, but most of the inland cities don't.
Cleveland, buffalo and detroit do.

Cincinnati will

Cincinnati streetcar project breaks ground | Railway Age
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Old 11-21-2013, 01:26 PM
 
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Do people really consider Buffalo and Detroit to be cities with rail transit?? technically, they have a system. But Pittsburgh's T is far more extensive than those.

As for that Cincy streetcar, c'mon, that looks like nothing more than a tiny whimsical tourism thing.

Last edited by _Buster; 11-21-2013 at 02:14 PM..
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Old 11-21-2013, 01:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zman63 View Post
Cleveland, buffalo and detroit do.

Cincinnati will

Cincinnati streetcar project breaks ground | Railway Age
PeopleMover does not count as rail transit.
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Old 11-21-2013, 03:30 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Buster View Post
Do people really consider Buffalo and Detroit to be cities with rail transit?? technically, they have a system. But Pittsburgh's T is far more extensive than those.

As for that Cincy streetcar, c'mon, that looks like nothing more than a tiny whimsical tourism thing.
They still have light rail equal to pittsburgh in the very least. Pittsburgh's rail system is weak. A billion dollars spent on 1.5 miles of tunnel. For that they couldve extended the t elsewhere or used those dollars to fix our bridges.
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Old 11-21-2013, 03:40 PM
 
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Detroit looks to cleveland for inspiration.

Cleveland transit system points the way for Detroit M-1 Rail project | Detroit Free Press | freep.com

Buffalos light rail connects the university to downtown.

Cleveland has the best system of all four cities. Detroit and cinci are working on theirs. What is in the works for pittsburgh?
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Old 11-21-2013, 04:24 PM
 
Location: Philly
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Cleveland, for all the grand talk on here, has weak transit ridership. of course, that might have to do with the weak downtown job market as much as the system but it's hard to say. the powers that be seem to want a $200 million brt project, that's what is in the pipeline. the only rail project, not dissimilar to the public private detoit project, is avrr but no public entity seems to care
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Old 11-21-2013, 04:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zman63 View Post
Cleveland, buffalo and detroit do.

Cincinnati will

Cincinnati streetcar project breaks ground | Railway Age
Cleveland's public transit rail was implemented like a century ago, and was heavily renovated in the 80s - around the same time our T was built out to the South Hills. The only major transit project they've done recently is the BRT, which it looks like we'll be getting soon, too. I don't know anything about Buffalo so I can't comment, but the People Mover isn't serious "rail transit." It's like if all Pittsburgh had was the five subway stops inside the Golden Triangle. The M-1 looks like it could be handy (though what's interesting about that is it's apparently being funded by a public/private partnership), as does Cincinnati's thing, but I don't consider streetcars to be that great of a leap beyond BRT.

However, the most important point I want to make to all the "But other cities are getting rail!!!" screechers - lest we forget, we just spent HALF A BILLION DOLLARS ON A 1/2 MILE SUBWAY TUNNEL. Some of you people act like this is a question of the city and regional leadership intentionally eschewing rail transit just to spite everyone.
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Old 11-21-2013, 05:00 PM
 
814 posts, read 1,150,307 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pman View Post
Cleveland, for all the grand talk on here, has weak transit ridership. of course, that might have to do with the weak downtown job market as much as the system but it's hard to say.
I don't think you can necessarily just point to Cleveland's sub-optimal ridership and use it to build a case against the efficacy and efficiency of the system itself.


Quote:
the powers that be seem to want a $200 million brt project, that's what is in the pipeline. the only rail project, not dissimilar to the public private detoit project, is avrr but no public entity seems to care
The AVRR would be several times longer than the M-1 if implemented at least as far as Oakmont, plus wouldn't it be dedicated-track rail and not an on-road streetcar as the M-1 is going to be?
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Old 11-21-2013, 05:12 PM
 
3,291 posts, read 2,772,549 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zman63 View Post
They still have light rail equal to Pittsburgh in the very least.

This is just flagrantly wrong - Buffalo and Detroit do not have light rail equal to Pittsburgh, in fact they are not even close. They have one line in each city - Buffalo has 6 miles and Detroit has 3. In fact Detroit's is not even light rail, its a people mover, like that monorail in Vegas that goes back and forth between a few casinos..

Cincinnati has no light rail at all, and are attempting to build a 3 mile streetcar, which is extremely limited to say the least.

Pittsburgh has 26 miles of light rail on two lines, including a small subway.

Last edited by _Buster; 11-21-2013 at 05:29 PM..
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Old 11-21-2013, 05:34 PM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
14,186 posts, read 22,743,952 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Buster View Post
Cincinnati has no light rail at all, and are attempting to build a 3 mile streetcar, which is extremely limited to say the least.
On top of that, the city just elected a mayor who promised to kill the streetcar project. It'll be interesting to see what happens there in the near future.
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