Apple seeks to expand its presence in Pittsburgh (Liberty, Oakland: university, salary)

[Aqua Teen Carl]

Originally Posted by doo dah

Maybe you lack qualifications.

Maybe I do a little headhunting work on the side and I have experience with this...

There are so many people who would LOVE the type of job market that is detailed in this thread. A "pick and choose" type of life style for any person in tech who doesn't have a mega specialized niche just isn't real life. Even if you are a really talented developer you will never get that sort of amazing freedom in 2014 America.

I will have to send this thread to some colleagues, they will get a laugh.

[UKyank]

Originally Posted by Moby Hick

No. I think ferraris is right with 10 to 15%. That group may not always at every minute have multiple job offers they can pick from or be able to get at the employer they want to be right away, but somebody with a few years experience and good skills and patience is certainly not going to have to be a rare genius in order to not have to put up with a job they really don't like.

Maybe this is true with lower level employers but I cannot believe it is even remotely true with the top ones (apple for example as the topic of the thread is discussing).

[Moby Hick]

I don't see what's so hard to believe about it. It's not a great job market, but Pittsburgh (the MSA) is below the national average unemployment by quite a bit (5.8% vs 6.5%). And the unemployment rates for those with higher degrees are fairly low across the whole nation (2.2% for those with Ph.D.s and 3.4% for those with Masters).

Earnings and unemployment rates by educational attainment

And unemployment in the information sectors and health/education sectors is dropping. In the first, it went from 6.6% in 8/2013 to 4.5% last month. In the second, it went from 5.4% to 4.8%.

Table A-14. Unemployed persons by industry and class of worker, not seasonally adjusted

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by UKyank

Maybe this is true with lower level employers but I cannot believe it is even remotely true with the top ones (apple for example as the topic of the thread is discussing).

I have no idea who Apple hires. I don't even own an iPhone. But I know people who got on with Google since it has moved it. The point wasn't that everybody in Pittsburgh can work for Apple. Certainly, if you do, you should probably not live in Pittsburgh as it's a very small portion of Apple's workforce here. The point was that it isn't the case that most people with technical skills have no choice about where to work. The fact Apple and Google and other cutting edge firms are putting their offices in and near Oakland is evidence that these employers think they have to go near where their potential employees are.

[sealie]

It was already conceded that top tier shops like Apple and Google are exceptional as far as what they will do to attract employees so this argument seems rather redundant.

[RogersParkTransplant]

It's more than just the current employees, isn't it? I'm no expert on Apple, but I can imagine that part of the appeal for them to come here in the first place would be to "network" with CMU -- you know, finding interns, collaborating with faculty, and recruiting the best talent. The cream of the CMU crop can go where it pleases, so I'd think Apple would want to be reasonably close to by so they could actually build a meaningful relationship with the campus and attract the most promising future programmers very early on, not just so their regular senior staff wouldn't have to commute on a daily basis.

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by sealie

It was already conceded that top tier shops like Apple and Google are exceptional as far as what they will do to attract employees so this argument seems rather redundant.

The difference between the top .1% and the top 10% is big enough to hide the entire world in which I spend my life.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by ferraris

For most companies that's true, but don't you think Apple might be an exception?

Taxes matter, but so does the pool of talent. A Downtown Pittsburgh location gives the widest range of talent to draw from. That is more important for some companies than others.

Taking these two together-Apple is located in Mountain View, CA, a suburb, and building a huge new HQ there. It's 5 1/2 miles to the nearest big U, Stanford. I don't think being within walking distance of Pitt/CMU is a high priority for them. I think they know how to deal with the "distance".

Originally Posted by wyoh

I agree with GeneW, people in the IT community know that they have a choice of employers. It's not "who will hire me" but more "where do I want to work?". IT folks get to dictate their working conditions in a lot of ways because they're in such high demand.

As someone whose spouse, a PhD physicist, has worked in IT/telecom these last 35 years, let me say that is untrue (being charitable). Would it be that it were true!

Originally Posted by Moby Hick

It depends on what you mean by "IT." It is certainly not just Apple and Google that need people with relatively rare combinations of skill and ability. But they, the universities, UPMC, and other firms are hiring nationally and internationally. Pretty much by definition if you are bringing somebody in from outside the region, you're dealing with somebody with some ability to decide where they want to work.

But "where they want to work" includes more than the location being downtown, uptown, suburban, rural, whatever. BTW, very few of these jobs are in rural areas or small towns. It includes the city, the part of the country, etc.

[ferraris]

Apple and the other Silicon Valley big shots aren't a typical suburban or exurban office park. They're more like a campus in design and have things like a gym, cafeteria, coffee shop, etc. They even have ritzy wifi-enabled private buses that transport their employees to and from San Francisco.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by ferraris

Apple and the other Silicon Valley big shots aren't a typical suburban or exurban office park. They're more like a campus in design and have things like a gym, cafeteria, coffee shop, etc. They even have ritzy wifi-enabled private buses that transport their employees to and from San Francisco.

Yes, but Apple is not right down the street from a major university.