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Old 08-25-2015, 01:41 PM
 
12 posts, read 15,677 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merge View Post
I don't know about attacking FCSD for this issue... to me what's snobbish is the original poster basing his/her purchase decision on the elementary school the kids would attend in Fox Chapel. That's pretty over-the-top.
Not sure what you're referring to, but quality of individual schools and school district have a huge influence on where people choose to live.

The desire for a great school in a humble community seems very reasonable to me.
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Old 08-25-2015, 01:50 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh's North Side
1,701 posts, read 1,587,274 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duplo View Post
Not sure what you're referring to, but quality of individual schools and school district have a huge influence on where people choose to live.

The desire for a great school in a humble community seems very reasonable to me.
I don't know, but I think that they are referring to the fact that the whole FC district is considered quite strong, so worrying about the relative value of the schools in the district seems excessive when they are all good. Keep in mind that Fox Chapel is not a place most of us consider "humble" by any means.
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Old 08-25-2015, 01:54 PM
 
1,653 posts, read 1,576,000 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duplo View Post
Not sure what you're referring to, but quality of individual schools and school district have a huge influence on where people choose to live.

The desire for a great school in a humble community seems very reasonable to me.
But you're basing your decisions on a few percentage points of test scores. The way you get those percentage points up, in many cases, is that you keep some people from taking the test, or you keep some people out of the school district, or you obsess over the test. What those percentage points are measuring is not even what defines a "great school", I'm not even sure how you quantify that. The "great school district" is going to draw snobs and people who are obsessed over a number that doesn't even measure what it's supposed to measure, and can't measure it reliably anyway.

If you want your child to embrace learning, to be engaged, to be bilingual, to read above grade level, to be taking Calculus by high school, to get into a big-name college or go to medical school, then that's what you look for, but the score isn't going to show you that. What are you looking for when you're comparing scores?
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Old 08-25-2015, 02:05 PM
 
12 posts, read 15,677 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sealie View Post
But you're basing your decisions on a few percentage points of test scores.
A few percentage points in this case is actually a 25% difference (looking at 2014 scores as an example):
Ohara 84.65 (better than 93.2% of elementary schools) http://www.schooldigger.com/go/PA/sc...61/school.aspx
Kerr 67.1 (better than 61.4% of elementary schools) http://www.schooldigger.com/go/PA/sc...53/school.aspx


Agreed that it's difficult (impossible?) to measure qualities of a "great school" but in lieu of that it seems like you'd at least want to find a school with high scores (which unfortunately is one of the few semi-objective measurements of achievement).
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Old 08-25-2015, 02:27 PM
 
Location: O'Hara Twp.
4,359 posts, read 7,482,638 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duplo View Post
A few percentage points in this case is actually a 25% difference (looking at 2014 scores as an example):
Ohara 84.65 (better than 93.2% of elementary schools) Ohara Elementary School in Pittsburgh PA - SchoolDigger.com
Kerr 67.1 (better than 61.4% of elementary schools) Kerr Elementary School in Pittsburgh PA - SchoolDigger.com


Agreed that it's difficult (impossible?) to measure qualities of a "great school" but in lieu of that it seems like you'd at least want to find a school with high scores (which unfortunately is one of the few semi-objective measurements of achievement).
There is a difference. Whether it is real or perceived is up for debate. Most of my friends when they bought their houses did not even consider houses that fed to Kerr. Alternatively, I know plenty of people that specifically bought houses that fed to O'Hara even though Fairview is considered the better school.
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Old 08-25-2015, 03:17 PM
 
2,218 posts, read 1,932,086 times
Reputation: 1909
Quote:
Originally Posted by duplo View Post
A few percentage points in this case is actually a 25% difference (looking at 2014 scores as an example):
Ohara 84.65 (better than 93.2% of elementary schools) Ohara Elementary School in Pittsburgh PA - SchoolDigger.com
Kerr 67.1 (better than 61.4% of elementary schools) Kerr Elementary School in Pittsburgh PA - SchoolDigger.com


Agreed that it's difficult (impossible?) to measure qualities of a "great school" but in lieu of that it seems like you'd at least want to find a school with high scores (which unfortunately is one of the few semi-objective measurements of achievement).
That differential reflects primarily the differences in the socioeconomic status of the families of the students in those respective schools. Still, all schools in FC will be operated with the same institutional priorities, focus, policies, etc. The teachers in all of those schools go through the same hiring process and are subject to the same administration. There's not going to be much difference (if any) in the instruction. Your kid's performance in any elementary school in FC is much more likely to be affected by his/her situation at home as well as your values as the parent. If your kid is exceptional, he/she will be placed in accelerated learning, regardless of what elementary school he/she attends. They all have access to the same resources.
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Old 08-25-2015, 03:57 PM
 
Location: A coal patch in Pennsyltucky
10,268 posts, read 10,505,282 times
Reputation: 12560
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merge View Post
That differential reflects primarily the differences in the socioeconomic status of the families of the students in those respective schools. Still, all schools in FC will be operated with the same institutional priorities, focus, policies, etc. The teachers in all of those schools go through the same hiring process and are subject to the same administration. There's not going to be much difference (if any) in the instruction. Your kid's performance in any elementary school in FC is much more likely to be affected by his/her situation at home as well as your values as the parent. If your kid is exceptional, he/she will be placed in accelerated learning, regardless of what elementary school he/she attends. They all have access to the same resources.
Where have you found that elementary students are placed in accelerated learning? The only thing that I have seen is a program that some schools offer called "enrichment." This is where they pull intelligent kids out of the classroom and provide them with a supposedly "enriched" learning experience. It sounds like a good idea, but we pulled our son out when his enrichment class was to write about a shoe that the teacher put on a table. The idea was to do write creatively about where the shoe had been, who had worn it, etc.

He didn't like the enrichment lessons and didn't like being pulled out of his regular class where he would have to make up the work he missed.

Elementary schools group all kids together. They don't do any type of tracking where the kids who are struggling with math or reading are placed in a lower class to get more attention. Because of federal special education laws, a child with an IEP is placed in a regular classroom. This applies to all public schools. The child with an IEP might have an aide who works with several students in a particular class. They will sometimes pull those kids out of class to work with them individually.

The difference between the schools with low scores and the schools with high scores is a combination of of more students with IEPs and lower average IQs in the lower performing schools. A very bright student may be held back from the education they might experience in a class with all bright students. It won't make much difference for average students if the pace of education is somewhat slower. I think most kids benefit when the teacher has to explain things many times.
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Old 08-25-2015, 08:46 PM
gg
 
Location: Pittsburgh
26,137 posts, read 25,777,749 times
Reputation: 17378
Quote:
Originally Posted by robrobrob View Post
There is a difference. Whether it is real or perceived is up for debate. Most of my friends when they bought their houses did not even consider houses that fed to Kerr. Alternatively, I know plenty of people that specifically bought houses that fed to O'Hara even though Fairview is considered the better school.
This is how the long term locals feel for the most part, but lots of people really like O'Hara as well.
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Old 08-26-2015, 05:24 AM
 
398 posts, read 698,944 times
Reputation: 251
Quote:
Originally Posted by duplo View Post
A few percentage points in this case is actually a 25% difference (looking at 2014 scores as an example):
Ohara 84.65 (better than 93.2% of elementary schools) Ohara Elementary School in Pittsburgh PA - SchoolDigger.com
Kerr 67.1 (better than 61.4% of elementary schools) Kerr Elementary School in Pittsburgh PA - SchoolDigger.com


Agreed that it's difficult (impossible?) to measure qualities of a "great school" but in lieu of that it seems like you'd at least want to find a school with high scores (which unfortunately is one of the few semi-objective measurements of achievement).
Except for O'Hara, all the schools have been hemorrhaging families with young kids over the past 10 years unfortunately, but nonetheless Kerr, Fairview, and Hartwood are all good schools where you don't have to worry about your children getting a good education.
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Old 08-26-2015, 08:43 AM
 
2,218 posts, read 1,932,086 times
Reputation: 1909
Quote:
Originally Posted by caroline2 View Post
Except for O'Hara, all the schools have been hemorrhaging families with young kids over the past 10 years unfortunately, but nonetheless Kerr, Fairview, and Hartwood are all good schools where you don't have to worry about your children getting a good education.
^this
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