Family of 5 moving to Pittsburgh soon (Mount Lebanon, Lebanon: real estate, how much, townhouse)

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by alex83

The first priority for us is a good public school (we need both ES and HS). Second one is a good family-oriented neighborhood (with other kidds, playgrounds etc). For sure commute is important but not crucial, I can sucrifice it (currently my usual commute is around 45 mins).
Is FCA district a right option with this in mind?

NA, FC, hampton, would be top choices and are borderline top 5 in the area. no reason for anywhere else really if schools are the top priority.

FC is more "diverse" with extremely high income (although some of these kids might go to private school) and lower income as well. not as much in the middle. not gonna be as many traditional "neighborhoods" though.

hampton is generally mostly upper middle class and a small district. should be some newer ryan style developments and neighborhoods built witihin the last 30 years.

NA is huge and ranges from upper middle middle class (some parts of mccandless) to upper middle class as you move north in the district. known for attracting upper class indian families and other asian families that will live in the apartment complexes in the district. mostly neighborhood style.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by alex83

The first priority for us is a good public school (we need both ES and HS). Second one is a good family-oriented neighborhood (with other kidds, playgrounds etc). For sure commute is important but not crucial, I can sucrifice it (currently my usual commute is around 45 mins).
Is FCA district a right option with this in mind?

IMHO "top" public schools are overrated. Not that you should send your kids to an underperforming or dangerous school, but there's really no evidence to suggest that you in any way increase your kids chance for success in college or the working world by going to a top school. If your kids are smart, they will be smart anywhere. If they're average, they'll be average anywhere. It's best to pick a neighborhood you love where you fit in well, and roll with it.

That said, if you're going by conventional public school quality, there's really nowhere bad in the North Hills. Fox Chapel Area, North Allegheny, Hampton, and Pine-Richland are all very highly rated. Shaler and North Hills are more average-ish, but also fine. But since Fox Chapel is literally one of the highest regarded districts in the state, and you're working right there, I don't know why you would choose a longer commute.

You comment about Fox Chapel Area looking "sparse" confuses me a bit. Does it seem to be too suburban for you?

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by eschaton

IMHO "top" public schools are overrated. Not that you should send your kids to an underperforming or dangerous school, but there's really no evidence to suggest that you in any way increase your kids chance for success in college or the working world by going to a top school. If your kids are smart, they will be smart anywhere. If they're average, they'll be average anywhere. It's best to pick a neighborhood you love where you fit in well, and roll with it.

That said, if you're going by conventional public school quality, there's really nowhere bad in the North Hills. Fox Chapel Area, North Allegheny, Hampton, and Pine-Richland are all very highly rated. Shaler and North Hills are more average-ish, but also fine. But since Fox Chapel is literally one of the highest regarded districts in the state, and you're working right there, I don't know why you would choose a longer commute.

You comment about Fox Chapel Area looking "sparse" confuses me a bit. Does it seem to be too suburban for you?

i agree for sure about outcome not really mattering for schools, for the most part. but i think environment does play a role and self selection is a factor in both ways.

not trying to argue here either, but just getting facts together. north hills is a borderline top school and is well above shaler if we are talking rankings.

i agree with them on fox chapel looking sparse though. i would say most looks more rural than suburban, except the areas near the river. there is a noticeable difference in density even when comparing to somewhere like glenshaw. take a loot at google maps.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Paul2421

i agree with them on fox chapel looking sparse though. i would say most looks more rural than suburban, except the areas near the river. there is a noticeable difference in density even when comparing to somewhere like glenshaw. take a loot at google maps.

Well yeah, that's true for Fox Chapel proper, where most of the land is zoned for multi-acre estates. But the areas where they'd be able to find a rental house like Aspinwall, Blawnox, or O'Hara down by the water aren't sparse at all.

I'm also not sure what the practical difference is between living in a closely packed suburban neighborhood or a sparse semi-rural one. Either way there's no business district to walk to.

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Well yeah, that's true for Fox Chapel proper, where most of the land is zoned for multi-acre estates. But the areas where they'd be able to find a rental house like Aspinwall, Blawnox, or O'Hara down by the water aren't sparse at all.

I'm also not sure what the practical difference is between living in a closely packed suburban neighborhood or a sparse semi-rural one. Either way there's no business district to walk to.

Originally Posted by alex83

The first priority for us is a good public school (we need both ES and HS). Second one is a good family-oriented neighborhood (with other kidds, playgrounds etc). For sure commute is important but not crucial, I can sucrifice it (currently my usual commute is around 45 mins).
Is FCA district a right option with this in mind?

sparse semi-rural isn't going to give you playgrounds, other kids,etc. which it seems they value more than a business district which is irrelevant to the whole conversation. if you are familiar with some of the newer devolopments there will be 10-20 kids all of the same age due to families moving in when they are starting a family. i don't think it is that hard to see a huge practical difference between the two.

but i think the poster is probably confused in that they are looking at "fox chapel borough" or whatever it is called and not fox chapel school district, which includes the dense areas mentioned. is is probably confusing to an outsider.

[alex83]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Well yeah, that's true for Fox Chapel proper, where most of the land is zoned for multi-acre estates. But the areas where they'd be able to find a rental house like Aspinwall, Blawnox, or O'Hara down by the water aren't sparse at all.

I'm also not sure what the practical difference is between living in a closely packed suburban neighborhood or a sparse semi-rural one. Either way there's no business district to walk to.

There's a difference for us. As I said we have 3 kids, and we'd like them to play with other kids in a walkable playgrounds. Besides my wife now is a SAHM and she likes some people being around.

From this point of view FCA looks mostly like a rural on the Google Maps (excluding river parts) while NA feels more suburban and walkable.

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by alex83

There's a difference for us. As I said we have 3 kids, and we'd like them to play with other kids in a walkable playgrounds. Besides my wife now is a SAHM and she likes some people being around.

From this point of view FCA looks mostly like a rural on the Google Maps (excluding river parts) while NA feels more suburban and walkable.

https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_ren...06_rect/14_zm/

what are your thoughts on this? walkable to a pool in the NA school district.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by alex83

There's a difference for us. As I said we have 3 kids, and we'd like them to play with other kids in a walkable playgrounds. Besides my wife now is a SAHM and she likes some people being around.

We live in the city - in Morningside - which is a walkable middle-class neighborhood which is crawling with kids, has sidewalks, and a playground only a five minute walk from our house. I had high hopes that my daughter (who is now almost nine) would make "neighborhood friends" when we moved here four years ago, but she is very shy and basically refuses to interact with any other kids in the neighborhood, even when they come up to her and ask to play.

My son in contrast is very personable and gregarious - making friends almost everywhere he goes - but he's only four.

My wife and I both work full time. Neither one of us is particularly good at making new friends - we're both more like our daughter than son. We're civil with our next door neighbors, but still don't really know anyone else in our neighborhood. Honestly, I'm not even really sure how you start to develop "neighborhood friends" past just engaging in some causal conversation when you run into someone.

Originally Posted by alex83

From this point of view FCA looks mostly like a rural on the Google Maps (excluding river parts) while NA feels more suburban and walkable.

In terms of land area I think this is right. In terms of where people actually live, not so much:

Fox Chapel School district is basically as follows:

Fox Chapel: Mostly estates for millionaires, with some more modest areas mixed in.
Indiana Township: Mostly rural, but with a few newer subdivisions in the western portion.
O'Hara Township: Suburban, ranging from fairly sparse to a couple of dense townhouse projects down by the Allegheny River.
Blawnox: Old mill town. Mostly densely built housing from the early 20th century
Aspinwall: Classic streetcar suburb. Houses have very small yards. Two walkable business districts.
Sharpsburg: Very dense - more urban than much of the city of Pittsburgh. Perceived as the least desirable part of the district, but this is in large part because it's full of poor people, and thus the local elementary school lags a bit.

[norcider]

TIL, one can only see the night skies from Fox Chapel. Shenanigans.

[alex83]

Originally Posted by Paul2421

https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_ren...06_rect/14_zm/

what are your thoughts on this? walkable to a pool in the NA school district.

Thanks Paul, it looks like what we need! There's even a "Saint Alexander Nevsky Orthodox Christian Cathedral" nearby! I think there should be some playgrounds and kids around as well)

As for the thoughts that NA is a big district - we currently live in Montgomery County, MD and it has >150000 students, so indeed all Pittsburgh area school districts don't feel huge at all.