Pittsburgh has an inferiority complex (York, Washington: rent, home, to live)

[Heit]

Originally Posted by Katiana

I disagree. To get back to what Awesomo.2000 said, the prevailing attitude in many cities is "this is a great place". You see that in Chicago and Minneapolis, as well as Denver. And the defensiveness that comes with the ciriticism doesn't help, either.

I don't buy into any of this. You/we can not make "blanket statements" about ANY city. What we are all stating here is simply "our" opinion, what we "perceive", no more, no less. Now, just because we express "our" opinion, from our experiences, regarding a city, does not equate to a given city being that way. One person will love a place and the other will hate it. It's human nature.

Bye the way..............in most cases with criticism comes a defensive response.

[Katiana]

Originally Posted by Heit

I don't buy into any of this. You/we can not make "blanket statements" about ANY city. What we are all stating here is simply "our" opinion, what we "perceive", no more, no less. Now, just because we express "our" opinion, from our experiences, regarding a city, does not equate to a given city being that way. One person will love a place and the other will hate it. It's human nature.

Bye the way..............in most cases with criticism comes a defensive response.

Good grief, I just said I disagreed, and talked about "prevailing attitude". That is not a 'blanket statement'. Go to Chicago, talk to a few Chicagoans. They're full of civic pride, and they don't express it by saying, "Chicago blows", or "why did you move here?", as if that were the dumbest thing anyone could do.

[Mugatu]

Originally Posted by Katiana

Good grief, I just said I disagreed, and talked about "prevailing attitude". That is not a 'blanket statement'. Go to Chicago, talk to a few Chicagoans. They're full of civic pride, and they don't express it by saying, "Chicago blows", or "why did you move here?", as if that were the dumbest thing anyone could do.

Agreed. When I meet new people, and it gets to the point in the conversation where I tell people I recently relocated here, like clockwork I will get the "eww, why did you move here?" response. Seriously, they say this just about every damn time. I'd say if I met 10 new people today, 9 of them would say that. That response says a great deal of what Pittsburghers think of their own city. How could this be construed as "humility" or "civic pride" and not negativity?

[AaronClark]

I've got to back up the original poster as well. I've been traveling to Denver just about every other month for the past three years because my partner is out there (argh!). There is a huge difference in attitudes between the two cities. In Denver, EVERYTHING is the best there is to those people. It actually drives me insane to a point. They are overwhelmingly positive about everything...even when it's unwarranted. I think this has gotten them far in changing the perceptions the country had about Denver, but it can almost be so intense that it's a turnoff at times.

Pittsburgh, when I moved here 6 years ago, was the complete opposite. Everything here was the worst to everyone I talked to. I would get a verbal beatdown any time I tried to say anything positive about the city. I DO think this has shifted now though...or is at least beginning to. I know that amongst most of my friends it has. I very rarely hear anyone bad mouth this city anymore – only hear love for it. Maybe people here are finally realizing what they've got?

I just hope we find a nice middle ground...because the attitude of "it's perfect here, everything here is the best" doesn't really help either.

[ditchdigger]

And I'll expound on my statement, and hopefully clarify a little bit...

All I'm saying is that negative statements might not necessarily be indicative of a negative outlook. Some folks are in the habit of blowing their own horns, loudly, and others are in the habit of purposely downplaying things in order to not feel like they're making a big deal of themselves. In terms of our professional atheletes, the latter have always become more beloved than the former, haven't they? Might not the same thing be true of the everyday people in the street? Has it been part of our upbringing?

(And I'm not saying I'm right either, but I do think it's worthy of some thought...)

[BrianTH]

ditchdigger,

I think there is definitely something to what you are saying--it is something Midwesterners do too sometimes. That said, I also think there are some real elements of negativity mixed in. It's complicated.

[Katiana]

I think most people can tell the difference between humility and a negative attitude. In re: pro athletes, virtually all of them have pretty big egos. Some of them have just learned how to channel their egos a little better.

[Blackbeauty212]

One Biggie in your guys Analysis -

Both Dever and Chicago are FAR MORE Transiant then Pittsburgh, meaning they have higher Populations of Non-Natives....If you speak to Non-Natives of Pittsburgh they too have a much more positive/optimistic view of Pittsburgh....

Counter that - If you find NATIVE Chicagolanders and Denverners they will probably have more of the pessimissic/bored attitude, especially if their natives that never been anywhere else. Pittsburgh has to be at the top of the list of Native population charts. Pittsburgh is far from Transiant...

I lived in Both Philly ( like Pittsburgh NON-Transiant, outside of relocating NY'ers) and NYC, and while to someone who's never lived in either of these places both may seem like the best places on earth....and with NY being the MOST Tranisant City this helps alot for it. But for Natives of both Philly and NYC who have never left their hometowns they for the most part carry the same pessmistic/bored attitudes.

As the Older population of Pittsburgh continues to die off, and Pittsburgh begins to reposition itself and becomes more Transiant, the pessimistic additudes will begin to change.

I've always said - Its takes for someone to have lived somewhere other then their hometowns to truely put things into presepective....I was pretty bored on Pittsburgh myself before leaving for Philly and NYC....But now that I've been away for 9/10 years, I've become homesick so much that I have to make trips back to the Burgh atleast twice a yr, and I like what I'm seeing.

[Heit]

Originally Posted by Katiana

Good grief, I just said I disagreed, and talked about "prevailing attitude". That is not a 'blanket statement'. Go to Chicago, talk to a few Chicagoans. They're full of civic pride, and they don't express it by saying, "Chicago blows", or "why did you move here?", as if that were the dumbest thing anyone could do.

Easy. I did not mean to upset you. I should have responded without quoting you, my bad. I am referring to the thread as a whole, not specifically yours.

I stand by this...........we each have different opinions that we come to based upon our given experience.(in this case a city) One person's opinion may or may not be accurate. There have been blanket statements made here. The reality is it's one person's opinion.

[Katiana]

Both Dever and Chicago are FAR MORE Transiant then Pittsburgh,

Denver, yes, Chicago, not so much:
Chicago:
Place of birth for U.S.-born residents:

This state: 1671466 (58%)
Northeast: 64908 (22%)
Midwest: 142294 (5%)
South: 287843 (10)%
West: 39669 (1.3%)

58% of Chicago residents lived in the same house 5 years ago.
Out of people who lived in different houses, 81% lived in this county.
Out of people who lived in different counties, 26% lived in Illinois.
21.7% foreign-born

Denver:
Place of birth for U.S.-born residents:

This state: 222531 (37%)
Northeast: 33351 (5.6%)
Midwest: 89984 (15%)
South: 56085 (~10%)
West: 50167 ~8%)

46% of Denver residents lived in the same house 5 years ago.
Out of people who lived in different houses, 48% lived in this county.
Out of people who lived in different counties, 47% lived in Colorado.

Foreign-born: 17.4%

Pittsburgh:
Place of birth for U.S.-born residents:

This state: 261318 (83%)
Northeast: 13428 (4.3%)
Midwest: 13593 (4.3%)
South: 20546 (6.6%)
West: 4682 (1.5%)

58% of Pittsburgh residents lived in the same house 5 years ago.
Out of people who lived in different houses, 68% lived in this county.
Out of people who lived in different counties, 46% lived in Pennsylvania.
5.6% foreign-born

Numbers do not add up to 100% due to rounding and foreign-born residents
(From CD)

The "pro-Chicago" people that I knew when I lived in Ill were all Ill/Chicago natives.