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My Wife is a doctor...trust me....opt out now before President TunaTongue locks you into it.
This doctor would probably concur:
(note to mods: I took this photo - no copyright issues)
I hear/read/see doctor after doctor after doctor saying that this health insurance law will NOT do anything to improve the quality or quantity of care in this country, and both doctors and economists are saying that it will increase costs, not save money.
I'm still trying to figure out why the hell this atrocity was passed! Was it just a power play by the Democrats, "because they could?" That's the only thing I can come up with, because the bill/law is a complete piece of crap (unless you're in a union, of course).
(note to mods: I took this photo - no copyright issues)
I hear/read/see doctor after doctor after doctor saying that this health insurance law will NOT do anything to improve the quality or quantity of care in this country, and both doctors and economists are saying that it will increase costs, not save money.
I'm still trying to figure out why the hell this atrocity was passed! Was it just a power play by the Democrats, "because they could?" That's the only thing I can come up with, because the bill/law is a complete piece of crap (unless you're in a union, of course).
Remember, we were told that it would have to pass first so we could read it.
(note to mods: I took this photo - no copyright issues)
I hear/read/see doctor after doctor after doctor saying that this health insurance law will NOT do anything to improve the quality or quantity of care in this country, and both doctors and economists are saying that it will increase costs, not save money.
I'm still trying to figure out why the hell this atrocity was passed! Was it just a power play by the Democrats, "because they could?" That's the only thing I can come up with, because the bill/law is a complete piece of crap (unless you're in a union, of course).
I work with five doctors and all they say is, "We'll just have to learn to play by different rules". The insurance companies have their own little rules and hoops to jump through, too. That doc looks very young; she may not even be through residency. She'll learn the insurance companies are not her friends.
Do you have some pre-existing conditions or something that would place you at a high risk?
Depending on state, the prices can be fairly reasonable if you tailor your plan (don't shop bulk plans from used car salesmen) yourself and imagine if they opened them up across state lines? Even in California where the extensive regulations have driven up prices, you can still find some reasonable plans if you shop earnestly.
My wife worked for Blue Shield of California for over 6 years before we moved, you can shop a reasonable plan, but it takes some effort and some extensive educating in the topic.
Those who have "problem issues" such as preexisting conditions or specialized treatment requirements will cost a lot more (but then can you really be upset about this? I mean, you are asking a business that functions on risk of your health to simply start paying out right off the bat.)
I think you need to look a bit more in-depth and if it isn't an issue of that and simply your state, then that is your problem right there. That is, the issue isn't health insurance at the private level, but some functionary at the government level that is forcing private level costs up.
In the end, you can tailor plans to meet your needs by dumping a lot of the garbage coverage. Pay out of pocket on things you don't need very often or is not relevant (such as if your family has no problems with eye sight, then dump the vision plan and pay for checkups out of pocket as need).
I see that number a lot though, the 800 dollars and the like. There was another poster here that used to complain in these topics constantly, turns out there weren't upfront with issues. That is, they were on a COBRA plan (seriously, this is the worst type of insurance you can get and pure government bloat in action) and she had children with special needs and issues. The point is, they were a special case and not representative of the issue.
I think another poster here did some shopping and posted their findings on it. They actually found some reasonable plans for their state, but the thread devolved into a whine fest and dismissal of their findings. That is, people made excuses.
No existing conditions.
Two healthy adults - no kids.
You seem to have a lot of experience. Where does one start looking for these plans? What are the basic pitfalls to look for? There are sites that claim to quote multiple plans. Are these legit? Basically, how did you do it?
to other posters:
Yes, I can be upset over paying $800/mo for very basic care for two basically healthy adults. That's 1/3 of the average family income here. That's ludicrous. And if other countries can do it for less (per person), why can't we? Does it relate to why drug companies make so much money here? They have actually MORE government reg's than we do, or even a single payer!
And if other countries can do it for less (per person), why can't we? Does it relate to why drug companies make so much money here? They have actually MORE government reg's than we do, or even a single payer!
They did for years and now they are facing severe budget cuts which will impact all those benefits as debt grew quicker than revenue.
No existing conditions.
Two healthy adults - no kids.
You seem to have a lot of experience.
Where does one start looking for these plans?
Internet, phone book, ads, ask people you know, etc... there is no one special place where you can go and it varies from state to state where you will find the best deals. Shop anywhere and everywhere, look up guides on the internet for shopping affordable insurance. You said you are paying 800 dollars a month with no kids? That's Cobra level insurance and it is a rip off. You are overpaying to the extreme.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art123
What are the basic pitfalls to look for?
Getting a plan you don't need or is bloated or getting a plan you didn't educate yourself on and later find it has a bunch of conditions to its use. There are numerous plans built for numerous needs, the biggest pit fall is not reading them, asking extensive questions concerning them, and choosing what best fits you.
Look at your lifestyle and condition. Tailor a plan that best fits it. One great way to lower costs is to pay out of pocket for standard visits. Use clinics for the average issues (flu, strep throat, etc...) and set your insurance for more specific needs. This will allow you to increase the coverage for more serious issues and remove the coverage for basic issues. Don't expect a plan that pays for everything 100%, this is not reasonable and counter to the purpose of insurance.
Insurance is for things where the costs are not tangible or affordable. For the average healthy person, this a fair risk for an insurer. You pay for the small stuff as it comes up and they take the risk that you won't need anything severe. This should lower the costs dramatically.
If you have things like acupuncture to quit smoking and numerous other fluff stuff, it will skyrocket your insurance. There are all types of things you can do, HSA's are even an option for some. Just keep in mind, the more you want them to pay for run of the mill stuff that is likely to occur often, the more you are going to pay depending on your health. An insurance company is a business, not a charity, think of it this way and negotiate the best plan for you, that still is reasonable to them.
There are so many approaches and so many things to consider I honestly can not "guide" you though it. People claim health is so important but spend little time in the process of educating themselves and obtaining it. Hard to hold the position that it is important if that is the case isn't it?
Like I said, look in your state and educate yourself not only on the plans and options, but the laws concerning them. As I said, you may find that the reason something is so expensive is because it is filled with regulations by the state which has inflated the price of coverage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art123
There are sites that claim to quote multiple plans.
Are these legit?
Find out, if you go to a site and it makes a certain claim. You can do all kinds of checks on them be it consumer reports, review of insurances by 3rd party companies or even random reviews from people who had it and dealt with it. Call them, talk to them, see what they offer, develop a list of key questions that you want answers to. Get these questions from researching the right things to ask when shopping for insurance. The power is entirely in your hands and to be honest, there is a lot of competition out there if you are willing to look for it.
I did a random quick look at insurances from bulk search sites for basic plans of 2 healthy people and it came up around 200-800+ a month. How much you set your deductible, what you choose to have covered in the plan and how will raise that cost. You can't have it all, you have to be reasonable. If you are looking for a plan that gives 100% coverage, no deductible (or little), 100% prescription, eyes, dental, special, etc... then you are going to pay out the nose for it. You don't need all of that and you would be surprised at how much you can pay out of pocket that is actually affordable. If you use it all the time, it will cost you.
Think of it like car insurance. Imagine if you constantly were heading to the insurance company to file claims. They will pay it, but your premium is going to go through the roof. They are a business, not a charity. Treat them like a business and look for the best deal that is reasonable to both you and them and you will find something that is both affordable and meets your needs.
I would have preferred a Universal Health Care plan where the private sector was eliminated form the industry and all the hospitals, doctors, pharmacists and pharmaceutical companies were owned and operated by the government. Without the private sector overhead, profit and excess salaries we would have a truly affordable health care system.
That would be because those "other countries" negotiate prices with the drug companies on a national level. If Merck, J&J, Bayer, etc. want to sell their products in Canada, they have to accept what the Canadian government will pay, or they shut out that entire nation full of potential customers. Those losses have to be made up somewhere, so they raise the prices here, where the insurance companies and government(s) will pay whatever they're charged.
The drug companies are "making up their losses" in the U.S. ?
They have one of the highest profit margins across any industry, in the ballpark of 20%. Don;t spend too much time crying for them. They are doing just fine.
Internet, phone book, ads, ask people you know, etc... there is no one special place where you can go and it varies from state to state where you will find the best deals. Shop anywhere and everywhere, look up guides on the internet for shopping affordable insurance. You said you are paying 800 dollars a month with no kids? That's Cobra level insurance and it is a rip off. You are overpaying to the extreme.
Getting a plan you don't need or is bloated or getting a plan you didn't educate yourself on and later find it has a bunch of conditions to its use. There are numerous plans built for numerous needs, the biggest pit fall is not reading them, asking extensive questions concerning them, and choosing what best fits you.
Look at your lifestyle and condition. Tailor a plan that best fits it. One great way to lower costs is to pay out of pocket for standard visits. Use clinics for the average issues (flu, strep throat, etc...) and set your insurance for more specific needs. This will allow you to increase the coverage for more serious issues and remove the coverage for basic issues. Don't expect a plan that pays for everything 100%, this is not reasonable and counter to the purpose of insurance.
Insurance is for things where the costs are not tangible or affordable. For the average healthy person, this a fair risk for an insurer. You pay for the small stuff as it comes up and they take the risk that you won't need anything severe. This should lower the costs dramatically.
If you have things like acupuncture to quit smoking and numerous other fluff stuff, it will skyrocket your insurance. There are all types of things you can do, HSA's are even an option for some. Just keep in mind, the more you want them to pay for run of the mill stuff that is likely to occur often, the more you are going to pay depending on your health. An insurance company is a business, not a charity, think of it this way and negotiate the best plan for you, that still is reasonable to them.
There are so many approaches and so many things to consider I honestly can not "guide" you though it. People claim health is so important but spend little time in the process of educating themselves and obtaining it. Hard to hold the position that it is important if that is the case isn't it?
Like I said, look in your state and educate yourself not only on the plans and options, but the laws concerning them. As I said, you may find that the reason something is so expensive is because it is filled with regulations by the state which has inflated the price of coverage.
Find out, if you go to a site and it makes a certain claim. You can do all kinds of checks on them be it consumer reports, review of insurances by 3rd party companies or even random reviews from people who had it and dealt with it. Call them, talk to them, see what they offer, develop a list of key questions that you want answers to. Get these questions from researching the right things to ask when shopping for insurance. The power is entirely in your hands and to be honest, there is a lot of competition out there if you are willing to look for it.
I did a random quick look at insurances from bulk search sites for basic plans of 2 healthy people and it came up around 200-800+ a month. How much you set your deductible, what you choose to have covered in the plan and how will raise that cost. You can't have it all, you have to be reasonable. If you are looking for a plan that gives 100% coverage, no deductible (or little), 100% prescription, eyes, dental, special, etc... then you are going to pay out the nose for it. You don't need all of that and you would be surprised at how much you can pay out of pocket that is actually affordable. If you use it all the time, it will cost you.
Think of it like car insurance. Imagine if you constantly were heading to the insurance company to file claims. They will pay it, but your premium is going to go through the roof. They are a business, not a charity. Treat them like a business and look for the best deal that is reasonable to both you and them and you will find something that is both affordable and meets your needs.
Thank you very much for your time and explanations. To be clear, we are paying so much because of three prescriptions we have recently started. Mine is temporary, but my wife's may be long-term. We pay pretty low premiums (<$200/mo - her employer is paying for most of hers, so the insurer is getting more like $400), but since drugs aren't covered on our plan until we reach $4000, we are now paying $800/month. One drug is over $220/month - for a pill - that millions of people are taking. That's ridiculous.
My wife's company offers two plans. One is geared for people who know they need a lot of care. The other is less expensive, but covers much less - which is why we are now paying out the nose.
The problem I have with your basic strategy is that we can't predict the future, and having to gamble with your health coverage is, well, morally wrong, imho.
We have been in great health. One thing pops up for my wife (which, btw, millions of Americans are being treated for), and we are out $400/month for 2 drugs (one is generic the other has no generic yet). Your car insurance analogy doesn't hold a lot of water for me either, as I have used my car insurance 2x in 20 years. I KNOW I will encounter health issues as I age. Everybody does. And if my car gets totaled, well they make other cars. They don't make any more of my wife - she's an original, one-of-a-kind model that I can never replace.
We don't make reasonable decisions when it comes to our family's health. I think it is a moral tragedy that we use a Free Market health care system in this country. Basic health care should not be dependent on your income. And that's what we are talking about here - basic health care that a good chunk of the American population can not afford.
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