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Old 08-05-2010, 06:15 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,505 posts, read 51,238,770 times
Reputation: 24606

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The assertion that hard work will always be rewarded is fundamental to the right wing universe. Too bad it is very rarely true. Hard work is most likely to be exploited by the people you are working for and to never lead to more pay or power for you. Working as hard as you have to for someone else's profit is a far better than working as hard as you can. Only work as hard as you can when all the profit is yours.
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Old 08-05-2010, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
20,339 posts, read 13,833,043 times
Reputation: 5220
Quote:
Originally Posted by carribean joe View Post
Liberals try to make themselves sound complicated and erudite. They don't stand alone very well in forthright competition they seem more comfortable as a collective. Thanks God there are still enough individuals around that believe in the basic tenants of conservatism and the concept of personal sacrifice to achieve gain versus collective pandering.
Well said.

Modern liberalism is very simple, they use the full power of government to force people to bend to their will.

The end game for liberalism is to control every aspect of our lives, nothing we eat, purchase, sell, do or say should be left to our own discretion.

Liberals believe they and only they should decide what we can eat or drink, what cars we can drive, what light bulbs we can buy, what health insurance we can purchase, what electrical power we can use, how much money we should be allowed to earn and how much of that money they can take away from us.

Liberals do not want to simply ensure that the food we eat or manufacturing of it is safe, they want to decide which foods or ingredients are considered healthy by their standards, and ban all else.

Liberals do not want to simply ensure that the production of energy is safe, or the cars we drive are safe, they want to decide which forms of energy and which types of cars they will allow us to use.

Liberals would love to redefine what is free political speech, either on the radio, the TV, the internet, and even on the streets of America.

The end game is a centralized, all powerful government, which owns all industry, energy and food production, education and finance, run by liberal elites, making decisions on the when, where and why, of how we live our lives.
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Old 08-05-2010, 09:49 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
20,339 posts, read 13,833,043 times
Reputation: 5220
That Green Police video is funny, except that this is what the statests would like to see; a government agency monitoring what we consume, and punishing those they think are wasting energy.


YouTube - ‪Audi Superbowl ad Green Police‬‎
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:22 AM
 
4,047 posts, read 4,475,336 times
Reputation: 1326
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
Well said.

Modern liberalism is very simple, they use the full power of government to force people to bend to their will.
This statement of yours is very ironic, although too common a fallacy in the conservative mindset. The problem is, you think it's either capitalism or socialism. Wrong. This is black-and-white thinking. It is the conservatives who are simplistic in their views. For example:

Quote:
The end game for liberalism is to control every aspect of our lives, nothing we eat, purchase, sell, do or say should be left to our own discretion. Liberals believe they and only they should decide what we can eat or drink, what cars we can drive, what light bulbs we can buy, what health insurance we can purchase, what electrical power we can use, how much money we should be allowed to earn and how much of that money they can take away from us.

Liberals do not want to simply ensure that the food we eat or manufacturing of it is safe, they want to decide which foods or ingredients are considered healthy by their standards, and ban all else.

Liberals do not want to simply ensure that the production of energy is safe, or the cars we drive are safe, they want to decide which forms of energy and which types of cars they will allow us to use.

Liberals would love to redefine what is free political speech, either on the radio, the TV, the internet, and even on the streets of America.

The end game is a centralized, all powerful government, which owns all industry, energy and food production, education and finance, run by liberal elites, making decisions on the when, where and why, of how we live our lives.
Who do you know that actually believes this? I'm guessing it's the boogey-libs that Glenn Beck whispered in your ear about. No wonder you are against "liberals". Misinformed simplicity at its best.
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Idaho
209 posts, read 208,517 times
Reputation: 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
Well said.

Modern liberalism is very simple, they use the full power of government to force people to bend to their will.

The end game for liberalism is to control every aspect of our lives, nothing we eat, purchase, sell, do or say should be left to our own discretion.

Liberals believe they and only they should decide what we can eat or drink, what cars we can drive, what light bulbs we can buy, what health insurance we can purchase, what electrical power we can use, how much money we should be allowed to earn and how much of that money they can take away from us.

Liberals do not want to simply ensure that the food we eat or manufacturing of it is safe, they want to decide which foods or ingredients are considered healthy by their standards, and ban all else.

Liberals do not want to simply ensure that the production of energy is safe, or the cars we drive are safe, they want to decide which forms of energy and which types of cars they will allow us to use.

Liberals would love to redefine what is free political speech, either on the radio, the TV, the internet, and even on the streets of America.

The end game is a centralized, all powerful government, which owns all industry, energy and food production, education and finance, run by liberal elites, making decisions on the when, where and why, of how we live our lives.
Yes! Well stated. I agree this is the plan (complete and total collectivism) of the far left, Nancy Pelosi type, liberals. And the end game of of the far right Dick Chenney type neocons is complete and total facism. Both spell distaster for the American people, the Constitution, and our sovereignty.

As I have said before, I see both parties as two wings of the same bird, meaning they ultimately are cooperating by playing the good cop/bad cop game with the American people and that their combined endgame will result in some unholy hybrid of collectivism and facism. Our Founders tirelessly warned of the threat both of those political extremes pose to our republic. What is going on right now certainly doesn't fit neatly into any definition, category, or box. I can only hope that the American people have, with the all that has gone on over the last several years (patriot act, banker bailout, healthcare bill, Katrina debachle, warrantless wiretapping, pursuit of a North American Union, countless signing statements, more czars, endless war, refusal to defend the border, cap and trade, ad nauseum), become politically savy enough to recognize this "hybrid" when they see it.
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Europe
2,735 posts, read 2,147,834 times
Reputation: 638
Quote:
Originally Posted by LogicIsYourFriend View Post
This statement of yours is very ironic, although too common a fallacy in the conservative mindset. The problem is, you think it's either capitalism or socialism. Wrong. This is black-and-white thinking. It is the conservatives who are simplistic in their views. For example:

Who do you know that actually believes this? I'm guessing it's the boogey-libs that Glenn Beck whispered in your ear about. No wonder you are against "liberals". Misinformed simplicity at its best.
Black-and-white thinking does not exercise the brain. It is easier to believe simplistic "truths" than to educate oneself.

For example, some here believe that

a) Europe is socialistic and
b) Socialism leads to lazyness
but they cannot explain
c) that countries like Germany (big population, lots of migrants etc; yeah "Socialism" does not only work in small, homogenous countries) and countries such as the Scandinavian countries have a thriving economy and high GDP numbers

Then who does work in these countries? Why are people in Germany innovative? Why is Germany the second largest export nation after China?
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Europe
2,735 posts, read 2,147,834 times
Reputation: 638
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sights_Set View Post
Yes! Well stated. I agree this is the plan (complete and total collectivism) of the far left, Nancy Pelosi type, liberals. And the end game of of the far right Dick Chenney type neocons is complete and total facism. Both spell distaster for the American people, the Constitution, and our sovereignty.

As I have said before, I see both parties as two wings of the same bird, meaning they ultimately are cooperating by playing the good cop/bad cop game with the American people and that their combined endgame will result in some unholy hybrid of collectivism and facism. Our Founders tirelessly warned of the threat both of those political extremes pose to our republic. What is going on right now certainly doesn't fit neatly into any definition, category, or box. I can only hope that the American people have, with the all that has gone on over the last several years (patriot act, banker bailout, healthcare bill, Katrina debachle, warrantless wiretapping, pursuit of a North American Union, countless signing statements, more czars, endless war, refusal to defend the border, cap and trade, ad nauseum), become politically savy enough to recognize this "hybrid" when they see it.
What you want is Libertarism as I sense but they have no supporters in the US media or public.
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Idaho
209 posts, read 208,517 times
Reputation: 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pamky View Post
What you want is Libertarism as I sense but they have no supporters in the US media or public.
Yes, you got me. I know there is no magic bullet and it will take a lot of time to climb out of the hole we have dug ourselves, but the back to basics, common sense appeal of the libertarian platform (most of it) is irresistible to me. I agree there is no support in the media, in fact there is out right suppression IMO but I don't think that is necessarily true that the public doesn't support the libertarian party or at least their ideals. For example, Ron Paul is basically libertarian but is pragmatic enough to run as a republican and he has remarkable support. I think the public is simply making the same pragmatic decision to vote for one of the two parties the logic being,right or wrong, that voting third party is like throwing away a vote. People know that the Dems and Rep parties blatantly box out all third parties. I know I feel that same pressure in the voting booth.
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:07 AM
 
31 posts, read 12,799 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
The assertion that hard work will always be rewarded is fundamental to the right wing universe. Too bad it is very rarely true. Hard work is most likely to be exploited by the people you are working for and to never lead to more pay or power for you. Working as hard as you have to for someone else's profit is a far better than working as hard as you can. Only work as hard as you can when all the profit is yours.
A man's greatest personal liability can be cynicism. Not in short supply here. Again, a part of the woe is me, self inflicted defeatism and entitlement syndrome. Why do some feel the need to split the profits withthe guy that initiates the work, takes the risk and in the long run contributes the most. Never understanding the behind the scenes contributions, the risk factor etc.

If commmunism socialism should prevail in this country the equality many seek will be the equality of the lowest common denominator. Remove the reward potential I am not likely to try to better myself or work harder for greater reward. I am not envious that my boss makes more than me. I am one of those that think I am better qualified at half the pay. That does happen, but I think it is not the norm. I still don't envy those that make more.
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Europe
2,735 posts, read 2,147,834 times
Reputation: 638
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sights_Set View Post
Yes, you got me. I know there is no magic bullet and it will take a lot of time to climb out of the hole we have dug ourselves, but the back to basics, common sense appeal of the libertarian platform (most of it) is irresistible to me. I agree there is no support in the media, in fact there is out right suppression IMO but I don't think that is necessarily true that the public doesn't support the libertarian party or at least their ideals. For example, Ron Paul is basically libertarian but is pragmatic enough to run as a republican and he has remarkable support. I think the public is simply making the same pragmatic decision to vote for one of the two parties the logic being,right or wrong, that voting third party is like throwing away a vote. People know that the Dems and Rep parties blatantly box out all third parties. I know I feel that same pressure in the voting booth.
The two party system you guys have is a joke. Sorry. Might have worked 200 years ago but the political views are all so diverse that two parties cannot cover them. Germany has 5 parties in the parlament now. They all represent different views and have voting power.
I think that would work in the US as well, but Rep/Dem are not gonna give up their power.
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