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Any long drawn out explanation as to why I as an openly gay man, should not be allowed to marry the man I want is based on a bias of hate, bigotry and ignorance.
It has been my experience in life that the longer it takes to explain something the more watered-down the validity of the idea becomes.
I hope your wishes come true. I have a few other friends that I am pulling for also.
You have valid points. But, your views on bloodlines, procreation are from a place in previous centuries, when we were a rural society. The traditions and subservient roles of the 1800's, is as an example. It gave way to the women suffrage movement around the world during the industrial
revolution. Things change. Equality is good. Discrimination is bad.
Times change, yes... I understand your position. That is not an argument though. Its an excuse to demand subservience. Times have not changed as you might suggest, as the majority has spoken in California. This is not an issue of "times change", this is an issue of "forced change" but a minority that thinks its opinion can dictate to the masses.
There is no discrimination, there is only ignorance driving emotional issues.
Any long drawn out explanation as to why I as an openly gay man, should not be allowed to marry the man I want is based on a bias of hate, bigotry and ignorance.
any dismissal in the face of an explanation given without attention to the explanation is nothing more than emotionally driven stupidity.
A gay man should be able to enter a contract with another to obtain the level of observance of the law which it exists. A gay man can not "marry' because a gay man does not produce, he is simply a civil contract with another using sexual preference as its driving factor.
But then you knew this already and were being obtuse to serve your emotional position. /acts surprised
Times change, yes... I understand your position. That is not an argument though. Its an excuse to demand subservience. Times have not changed as you might suggest, as the majority has spoken in California. This is not an issue of "times change", this is an issue of "forced change" but a minority that thinks its opinion can dictate to the masses.
There is no discrimination, there is only ignorance driving emotional issues.
Oh yes, the old mob rule argument...that alone is discrimination.
I do agree that there is ignorance, however it is not on the side of those who approve of gay marriage...
A gay man can not "marry' because a gay man does not produce,
... Still waiting for you to prove that "produce" has ever been a requirement of marriage in this country.
C'mon, you must have SOME documentation to back this up. Shouldn't take more than a second or two of your time to post it... clearly you have a few minutes, you're posting away... so c'mon... just one bit of evidence, documentation, showing that procreation was at any time a requirement of marriage in this country.
any dismissal in the face of an explanation given without attention to the explanation is nothing more than emotionally driven stupidity.
A gay man should be able to enter a contract with another to obtain the level of observance of the law which it exists. A gay man can not "marry' because a gay man does not produce, he is simply a civil contract with another using sexual preference as its driving factor.
But then you knew this already and were being obtuse to serve your emotional position. /acts surprised
Your explanations mean nothing to me...you explain things as if they were fact...as if you somehow are the supreme judge of what is...and what is not correct.
Face it, your side is the loosing side in this argument against gay marriage. It may not happen tomorrow, or next week...but it will happen, and when it does watch me "marry" the man of my choice.
Oh goodie, another person who takes what they like and dismisses the rest.
So, please Professor Intelligent, explain to us in the context of that posters comment how "times change" is a relevant objection at the same time my response is not?
Go ahead, I have the popcorn ready. Looks like you walked yourself into another "opps, didn't realize my argument was invalid" position.
Go ahead, try to defend that post and yours at the same time.
/giggle
Go ahead.
Look, you have crossed a line now with your attitude.
Your explanations mean nothing to me...you explain things as if they were fact...as if you somehow are the supreme judge of what is...and what is not correct.
Face it, your side is the loosing side in this argument against gay marriage. It may not happen tomorrow, or next week...but it will happen, and when it does watch me "marry" the man of my choice.
It's coming... and everyone knows it... that's why they're so scared. That's also why we're going to see an upswing in bigotry and ignorance and hatred for a while... like Voyageur said... fear.
I feel sorry for people like that, and I don't mean in a condescending or "pity-filled" way. I mean genuinely, truly, in the same way I feel sorry for one of my children when they've hurt themselves or some girl has broken their heart. Sorry because I KNOW they are hurting, I KNOW there is pain, I KNOW there is fear... and only time is going to heal that.
This is terrifying to so many... it's such a deep and fundamental challenge to their most deeply held beliefs. It goes against everything they have been taught to believe is true, taught by people and institutions they've placed their trust in. It's a scary time for them, and I think it's worth keeping that in mind as best we can.
Fear causes people to lash out... it doesn't make them bad people. Their world-view is being rocked or even torn down. They need something to hold onto, something to help them feel it isn't all falling down around them. I think a little tolerance for and understanding of how scary that is for them goes a long way... it's hypocritical of us to expect their tolerance and understanding if we're incapable of offering the same in return.
It's coming... and everyone knows it... that's why they're so scared. That's also why we're going to see an upswing in bigotry and ignorance and hatred for a while... like Voyageur said... fear.
I feel sorry for people like that, and I don't mean in a condescending or "pity-filled" way. I mean genuinely, truly, in the same way I feel sorry for one of my children when they've hurt themselves or some girl has broken their heart. Sorry because I KNOW they are hurting, I KNOW there is pain, I KNOW there is fear... and only time is going to heal that.
This is terrifying to so many... it's such a deep and fundamental challenge to their most deeply held beliefs. It goes against everything they have been taught to believe is true, taught by people and institutions they've placed their trust in. It's a scary time for them, and I think it's worth keeping that in mind as best we can.
Fear causes people to lash out... it doesn't make them bad people. Their world-view is being rocked or even torn down. They need something to hold onto, something to help them feel it isn't all falling down around them. I think a little tolerance for and understanding of how scary that is for them goes a long way... it's hypocritical of us to expect their tolerance and understanding if we're incapable of offering the same in return.
We all need to try. Both sides. All sides.
Wish I could rep you again. Don't ever lose that Big Heart.
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