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Status:
"It Can't Rain All The Time"
(set 29 days ago)
Location: North Pacific
15,754 posts, read 7,593,334 times
Reputation: 2576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight
The government already has the power to control subsidizing people who have children. Welfare, tax breaks and food stamps, many of the 50% who do not pay taxes are a family of four. Would you be in favor of removing government interference in what are personal matters?
Seems like government control of childbirth is one way street at the moment.
We have this little thing in this country called votes. We can vote for the people to represent us that share the same ideals as we do. So, if you do not like welfare, tax breaks and food stamps, do not vote for those who do like them.
Yes, I am in favor of removing government interference in what are personal matters. My post was in response to ZPG. And this has what to do with the solving for the reduction in poverty how?
If our communities believe that all poor people are stupid people and are undeserving of help, where is help going to come from for those who are in need of assistance. How well do we like to watch all of those around us suffer? How much do we not care?
When was the last time any one went out into their own community and took a really good look around? When was the last time any one cared enough to inquire of their neighbor and really cared to help them, if they had a problem?
The people who have my vote are the ones that have compassion for their fellow man. If that means government subsidies stay in, then so be it. Sometimes government has to step in and bring sanity to the insane. When the people of America stopped caring for the people in their neighborhoods and their own families, that is what we get in return, bigger government, coming from the nation of those who still do care.
Don't like it, have a heart, start caring. No heart? I'm sorry.
We have this little thing in this country called votes. We can vote for the people to represent us that share the same ideals as we do. So, if you do not like welfare, tax breaks and food stamps, do not vote for those who do like them.
Yes, I am in favor of removing government interference in what are personal matters. My post was in response to ZPG. And this has what to do with the solving for the reduction in poverty how?
If our communities believe that all poor people are stupid people and are undeserving of help, where is help going to come from for those who are in need of assistance. How well do we like to watch all of those around us suffer? How much do we not care?
When was the last time any one went out into their own community and took a really good look around? When was the last time any one cared enough to inquire of their neighbor and really cared to help them, if they had a problem?
The people who have my vote are the ones that have compassion for their fellow man. If that means government subsidies stay in, then so be it. Sometimes government has to step in and bring sanity to the insane. When the people of America stopped caring for the people in their neighborhoods and their own families, that is what we get in return, bigger government, coming from the nation of those who still do care.
Don't like it, have a heart, start caring. No heart? I'm sorry.
I think you are confusing what government thinks we should do by taxation and charity.
If you removed welfare, you would be pleasantly surprised by how many Charitable Americans we really have.
At the present time, because there is a federal/state handout, is there is a reason to pitch in. If you have food stamps (food) health care (medicaid) subsidized housing (Section 8) what else do you need from us
I think our present day welfare system has had more to do with isolating fellow Americans from each other, more than anything else.
The federal government should get out of the personal lives of it's citizens. Give Americans the opportunity to
show their compassion - really, it abounds
And you know what, it would show the true American
spirit - don't you think. Or is all that just bull****
things politicians say to get your vote
Are you really breeding the worker class to support those few of us who chose a different route? Really?
You and your kids are not special. They take more than they give, as do all of us.
I chose a different life.
Look, for the last time: you're obviously free to choose whatever life you want, but I'm sure as hell not buying the notion that you are somehow fundamentally "different" from the rest of us in your dependency on modern society. The mere fact that you choose to use computers and internet suggests to me that you're not self sufficient, no matter how small your "carbon footprint" is. It also suggests that your own comfort and convenience factor into the calculation of how far you're willing to go in your sacrifices for the environment - not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that. We all do it to varying degrees.
You probably consume a lot of services provided by other people, even with all of your sacrifices for your carbon foot print. And when you get old, I'm guessing you'll still want to have some food, clothing, shelter, mobility, and access to health care and emergency services. Who will provide your food? Who will produce the energy to power your domicile and enable you to get on the internet, like you apparently do today? Who will provide emergency services when you call for them? Who will provide your health care when you need it? Who will maintain the infrastructure so that you can get from point A to point B when you need to? My kids and others' kids will absolutely be providing those services to you.
So unless you plan on moving to a forest and eating tree bark or rolling your saved dollar bills up into a tasty paper sandwich - and more power if you do - you're still really in the same boat as the rest of us. Don't consume those services you will depend on while simultaneously cursing those who will provide them to you as wasteful by virtue of their existence. Without those people there to help you, you would die - and I suspect you wouldn't really want that, given that you've still chosen to enjoy your life despite your philosophy which says that the world would be best served by the elimination of mankind.
Last edited by Green Irish Eyes; 10-15-2010 at 06:57 AM..
Reason: Please discuss the topic, not each other.
Status:
"It Can't Rain All The Time"
(set 29 days ago)
Location: North Pacific
15,754 posts, read 7,593,334 times
Reputation: 2576
Quote:
Originally Posted by pollyrobin
I think you are confusing what government thinks we should do by taxation and charity.
If you removed welfare, you would be pleasantly surprised by how many Charitable Americans we really have.
At the present time, because there is a federal/state handout, is there is a reason to pitch in. If you have food stamps (food) health care (medicaid) subsidized housing (Section 8) what else do you need from us
I think our present day welfare system has had more to do with isolating fellow Americans from each other, more than anything else.
The federal government should get out of the personal lives of it's citizens. Give Americans the opportunity to
show their compassion - really, it abounds
And you know what, it would show the true American
spirit - don't you think. Or is all that just bull****
things politicians say to get your vote
I'm out of time at the moment to give to this a proper response. Please accept my apologies, as I do need to be on my way to work...but...google research just for fun, or if you have the time... bottom up poverty reduction.
I did and came up with this:
scan read it and it looks to be informative. There was much more info.
What more is needed? For the people to be given their self-respect back from those who look at them within their communities with disdain in their eyes. Not every one living in poverty qualifies for assistance from the government.
Americans isolate from each other, the government does not interfere with social class structures.
For the last time - who will provide your food? Who will produce the energy to power your domicile and allow you to go post these ridiculous comments on the internet? Who will provide emergency services when you call for them? Who will provide your health care when you need it? Who will maintain the infrastructure so that you can get from point A to point B when you need to?
There are more than enough people on this planet NOW. If everyone stopped breeding immediately, there would still be enough resources to keep me for the 10-20 years I have left. How would what I believe should happen have any bearing on the currently living humans?
Unless you plan on moving to a forest and eating tree bark (which would be more consistent with your philosophy) or rolling your saved dollar bills up into a tasty paper sandwich, my kids and others' kids absolutely will be providing those services to you. And I'll bet you will consume those services while simultaneously cursing them for being such horrible, wasteful people by virtue of existing. The mere fact that you obviously choose to use computers and internet suggests that you are not self sufficient, no matter how small your "carbon footprint" is.
Again, are you saying that there are not enough people NOW to do this? I'm confused about what you're saying. Are you saying that my opinion that people shouldn't breed would include killing those alive now? Otherwise, your logic is very faulty.
You can choose whatever life you want, but to think that you're somehow "different" from the rest of us with respect to your dependency on modern society is simply delusional.
No, you're saying that I'm different from you, and I'm sure in some ways that I am. I actually GAVE CONSIDERABLE THOUGHT about my decision not to breed. Most breeders never do.
So if you really believe that, then just why are you sticking around? Your philosophy is paradoxically - and hypocritically - at odds with your own existence.
So, are you proposing that I commit suicide?
Or are you interested in murdering me?
I'm not hypocritical at all.
I will be leaving no resource suckers when I go. I have no need to have a mini-me running around. My ego doesn't require it.
So, are you proposing that I commit suicide?
Or are you interested in murdering me?
More the former if your argument is that the rapid absence of mankind from the planet would be a worthy goal. I'm not genuinely personally interested in your death or anyone else's, but isn't it a rational conclusion aligned with the fundamental principles of your argument? I'm also not interested in murdering anyone, and I don't regard the elimination of humans from the planet as a worthy goal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl
I'm not hypocritical at all.
I will be leaving no resource suckers when I go. I have no need to have a mini-me running around. My ego doesn't require it.
You may not be leaving "resource suckers" when you go, but the point is that you are a "resource sucker" who is dependent upon "resource suckers" who have been bred by others in order for you to enjoy your life the way you want to - just like the rest of us. You seem to enjoy criticizing all of the other "resource suckers", yet you do not truly abdicate your own "resource sucker" existence in order to align with the principles you espouse - because you can't.
Your ego doesn't require a "mini-me", but your bitter tone throughout this thread frankly makes one wonder to what extent your ego requires juxtaposing yourself as a highly evolved, "enlightened" being against "most people" who you seem to enjoy negatively stereotyping as ignorant (dare I say inferior?) breeders. It would seem that there is more than just a little ego involved there, and there's some irony in that... But hey, it's your life. I think we've gone about as far as we can with this.
More the former if your argument is that the rapid absence of mankind from the planet would be a worthy goal. I'm not genuinely personally interested in your death or anyone else's, but isn't it a rational conclusion aligned with the fundamental principles of your argument? I'm also not interested in murdering anyone, and I don't regard the elimination of humans from the planet as a worthy goal.
You may not be leaving "resource suckers" when you go, but the point is that you are a "resource sucker" who is dependent upon "resource suckers" who have been bred by others in order for you to enjoy your life the way you want to - just like the rest of us. You seem to enjoy criticizing all of the other "resource suckers", yet you do not truly abdicate your own "resource sucker" existence in order to align with the principles you espouse - because you can't.
Your ego doesn't require a "mini-me", but your bitter tone throughout this thread frankly makes one wonder to what extent your ego requires juxtaposing yourself as a highly evolved, "enlightened" being against "most people" who you seem to enjoy negatively stereotyping as ignorant (dare I say inferior?) breeders. It would seem that there is more than just a little ego involved there, and there's some irony in that... But hey, it's your life. I think we've gone about as far as we can with this.
Ahhh, so you want me to kill myself? Be a man and have the balls to say it instead of skirting around your desires to see people who think like me dead at their own hand.
Personally, I'm a pacifist and vegetarian. I don't believe in killing any living creature.
But you apparently have no problem wishing that others, in this case, me, would take their lives so that what? You can feel good about your life decisions?
Read into my posts whatever you like.
After all you believe in taking no responsibility for "what the heart wants" with no consideration for others or the planet.
Yes, you did need to get your last digs in then want to run off.
I will not be placing other resource suckers on the earth, it's my choice.
If you feel "inferior" because you've been breeding with no thought to the future of the earth, don't put that on me. Own it for yourself.
You know, I do care more about the planet than many of you do.
And I thought about the planet when I made my decision to be sterilized. Breeders rarely think beyond "what the heart wants," if they even get that far in the thought process.
Therefore, I guess I am more enlightened.
I appreciate you're understanding that you are less enlightened.
That is what you're saying, isn't it?
Since I chose not to breed, I am doing my part to protect the planet.
Can you say the same?
Last edited by chielgirl; 10-14-2010 at 05:11 PM..
Its pretty simple. Bring those jobs back from China and India. I'm surprised no one stated that. Maybe also send illegals home and raise the minimum wage. I don't know why people assume most poverty is in the cities when its simply not true. Most poverty is concentrated in rural areas and Native American reservations. But for sensasionalism,people like to bring up the inner city and food stamps,yada yada yada.
Jerseygirl is right. I have seen more poverty in the rural areas than in the inner cities. They have many programs in the inner cities and not many in the rural areas. Many rural poor hide because of the extent of their poverty and do without.
In the inner cities the handouts are so continuous , the takers become entitled and think they deserve all the hand outs.
Also, If a person is so poor , how do they buy drugs? If a person is really poor, they don't have money for recreational drugs. Could it be, they are funded by the government and use it to buy their drugs. I bet so. I don't see many poor illegals either.
In the rural areas, many americans are dirt poor and ashamed of their poverty. They don't want a hand out. They want a job. Some areas are so depressed , there are NO jobs.
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