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Old 12-13-2010, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth Texas
12,482 posts, read 8,518,573 times
Reputation: 2525

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TruthBTold2U View Post
But then the Tea Party was hijacked by Dick Armey, Koch corporations, Sarah Palin and of course Glenn Beck.
I disagree with that. however if you do believe that it still does not change how it was started. It was not started by Beck. it was started by grass roots unhappiness
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Old 12-13-2010, 11:06 AM
 
7,022 posts, read 5,779,962 times
Reputation: 6963
LOL, for being such an "insignificant and irrelevant group" the Tea Party sure has got the liberals green with jealously by their continued political success. First they try to copy them with the Coffee Party (arriving DOA, lol) and now this.
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Old 12-13-2010, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Northeast
1,377 posts, read 849,704 times
Reputation: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
I disagree with that. however if you do believe that it still does not change how it was started. It was not started by Beck. it was started by grass roots unhappiness
Well many of the original Tea Party members left after Freedom Works and the others got involved. Most IMO were Ron Paul supporters in the beginning.
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Old 12-13-2010, 11:19 AM
 
Location: Northeast
1,377 posts, read 849,704 times
Reputation: 406
Hyper-partisanship is one of the greatest domestic challenges our nation faces. It divides America and derails our ability to solve our shared challenges. Rather than focusing on solving problems, hyper-partisans use labels to demonize their opponents, enforce orthodoxy within their own ranks, and marginalize sensible compromises.
Putting aside our labels can offer a hopeful alternative, grounded in an approach that brings people together to develop practical solutions to common problems. That doesn't mean that we forget about our differences. It does mean that we regard those with whom we disagree as legitimate voices in the dialogue of democracy, as citizens who might have a piece of the answer to tough questions.
In this spirit, No Labels will bring together leading thinkers from the left, right, and all points in between. We will work to break down false divisions and lift up the common ground on which we can build solutions. Real differences of principle will remain, of course. But we believe that as Americans, more unites us than divides us. Simply put, we all love our country and seek to better it. The examples below offer illustrations of the policy thinking we support – highlighting the problem, identifying the dysfunction we seek to correct, and then presenting the No Labels approach to finding solutions.

Approach | No Labels
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Old 12-13-2010, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Plattsburgh NY
1,791 posts, read 1,512,076 times
Reputation: 2208
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
I think what you're seeing right now is a movement towards that. In 2008 Obama and the Democrats didn't gain control of the WH, House and Senate all at once because people liked their policies. They gained control because people were pissed at the Republicans, now in 2010 we saw a massive swing because everyone is pissed at the Democrats. Voters are voting against candidates instead of for them.

The Republicans have one last shot at getting it right, if they don't 2012 is going to be very interesting to say the least because I don't forsee people willing to vote for either side. A third party will certainly have a very good chance of making some dramatic gains.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruthBTold2U View Post
I believe this would be the best thing to happen to this country in a very long time. As we see year after year no one cares about the American people. If we could just vote in someone from the outside of the two parties it would send shock waves to those who just lie to get into office and then go back to BAU.
Agreed.
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Old 12-13-2010, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Tucson
7 posts, read 8,852 times
Reputation: 14
What you have here folks is an ignorant electorate who is too mentally lazy to watch C-SPAN and legitimate news sources, who still have some journalistic integrity, and interpret events for themselves so they have no clue who their enemy is. You can still find the truth you just have to seek it out diligently and the future of our great nation is at stake.

The problem is greatly due to corporate/big money controlled media who have their own agenda and are great accomplices for the robber barons who have raped and pillaged our country and left it bleeding in the alley with the willing assistance of the GOP. Just look at who is giving us all of this 'information'...Ted Turner, Rupert Murdoch, etc. Do those guys have a clue what life is like for most of us? I think not. And what do you think their agenda is? You can bet they want the wealthy to rule because they're in that segment of society.

Our forefathers wrote free press protection into the constitution because they knew a free and ethhical press were crucial to the survival of a free nation. After all, how can the country truly be run adequately by the people if they can't get the truth? What happened to ethical reporters who would dig and even risk their lives, the way Woodward and Bernstein did, to give people the truth?

The 'news' for most people has become drama and entertainment much the same way Jerry Springer fascinates people even though somewhere in their minds they know that doesn't represent the American people and how they live and think. However, because they put 'news' in the name people watch lies and drama 24/7 and convince themselves it's fact. The GOP and the Tea Party have used this technological phenomenon to their advantage and to the destriment of the country.

There's a reason the FCC forbids foreign ownership of TV and radio...because words are dangerous...propaganda is dangerous. Hitler was only able to do what he did because of propaganda and we see the same thing here. However, instead of the Jews who are being demonized it's the poor, the disabled, the enderly, the sick, the unions and basically anybody who isn't part of the wealthy ruling class.

I can't believe how many Christian people are allowing themselves to be sucked into this every-man-for-himself dog-eat-dog mentality when none of that has anything to do with being a Christian. They've been convinced that eveyone who is struggling is lazy and stupid or just isn't right with God so they can justify supporting this whole mindset. If they were reading their bibles they would have read about Lazarus and Job and know that is a lie and not scriptural in any sense of the word. If the settlers hadn't stood together and helped each other this country would never have even gotten started and they were fleeing the kind of rich ruling class that has become the order of the day now. There is nothing American about that.

Rupert Murdoch owns Fox News and a massive amount of other media sources. Rupert Murdoch was an Aussie of British decent who had a huge media empire in Australia. He branched into Great Britain and then set his eyes on the money here. He had a little problem with his plan because of the FCC regulations so he became an American citizen in 1985 so he could build a media empire here and loo what's happened to the 'news'. What do you think he cares about the U. S. and our people? Nothing...he cares about nothing but getting richer. After all, if this country goes down the drain those wealthy people can move to the Caymans or Switzerland and keep their money company. The rest of us have nothing else and no place to go and this country is everything to us.

I was taught to always consider the source when you're processing information but the American people have either forgotten how to do that or just don't care enough to bother. They seem to have become a bunch of drama queens living in an alternate reality with Glenn Beck.

Rupert Murdoch denies that Fox News supports any one party even though they called it the 'Fox News Tea Party' so we know he's a big liar. Glenn Beck is a freak show looking for a place to happen and Bill O'Reilly is a traitor who slandered and insulted American troops who were the victims of one of the worst war crimes of WWII. IMHO Rupert Murdoch, Glenn Beck and Bill O'Reilly should be tried as traitors, stripped of their citizenship and either deported or shot...I really couldn't care less which when I see what they're doing to our country with their lies. Our forefathers knew what to do with a traitor and these people are destroying our country as surely as any traitor ever could. This misinformation campaign they're using against us is more dangerous to our stability and future as a nation and a people than Bin Ladin could ever be. And we're going to let them tell us what 'the truth' is? Lord help us if people don't wake up and start to use their God-given brain for something besides a hat rack.
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Old 12-13-2010, 12:05 PM
 
Location: Tucson
7 posts, read 8,852 times
Reputation: 14
I can't believe anyone who has lived through the Reagan, Bush, Clinton/Gore and Bush again administrations could be so dense. I never could figure out why people though Reagan was a hero when the country started to go downhill beginning with him. Doesn't anybody remember when he shot interest rates up and whole industries were crippled and shut down because they couldn't survive? Remember whole subdivisions full of houses sitting empty because those hard-working men no longer had a job? He wasn't really president anyway, he just played one on TV and of course he sounded good he was an actor for heavens sake!

Unions...I'm so sick of hearing people parrot the idea the out-sourcing of jobs is because of unions. Unions would have prevented this mess because the working class and the middle class knew who their enemy was. Unions were about more than wages, benefits and worker protection. They were about giving the working class a say in government and it kept the government honest and accountable to the majority of the people instead of being completely controlled by whoever could give the most money to a campaign because nobody got elected without the union vote no matter how much money they had in their war chest.

Think about this. When our products were made by union labor "Made in America" meant something. It meant the best in the world and we always had markets for our products because the whole world wanted what we made.

Then Reagan dealt a death blow to unions by taking away their only bargaining chip rendering the working class helpless to big money greed. Then Wall Street guys decided Japanese management principles were the way to go because it would make them more money. So they charged ahead with Japanese management principles and greed was the order of the day.

Now what have the Japanese always been known for? Making junk. They could make it cheap but it was junk. So when American companies started doing business the same way, robbing their employees and their customers, losing the loyalty of both, that's what they started making...junk. Now we can't compete with Japan's junk, China's junk, Taiwan's junk, etc. because the whole world makes junk and we no longer have anything better to offer.

I remember when tennis shoes were made by union labor and you could buy them two pair for a dollar. Now they sell us tennis shoes made in Japan or wherever for $100 a pair and they fall apart. All so some Wall Street guy could get a higher dividend for his stockholders and now look where we are.
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Old 12-13-2010, 12:54 PM
 
Location: OCEAN BREEZES AND VIEWS SAN CLEMENTE
19,899 posts, read 15,304,644 times
Reputation: 6451
There will always be a label on something, even if someone else does not agree. Somone or a majority will always put a label on something. Even some of us right or wrong, we all do it.
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Old 12-13-2010, 01:11 PM
 
1,461 posts, read 1,230,691 times
Reputation: 790
The Tea folks have no focus. They want less govt. yet they love their social security and medicare. They want less govt. but are very much in tune with the Christian right when it comes to govt. involvement in abortion, gay rights and other social issues. Follow the money - their leaders are up to their necks with corporate America and GOP right wing causes.
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Old 12-13-2010, 01:22 PM
 
Location: OH->FL->NJ
7,806 posts, read 7,279,408 times
Reputation: 3107
>Doesn't anybody remember when he shot interest rates up and whole industries were crippled and shut down because they couldn't survive?<
WRONG with the first paragraph. Look up the term "volker recession"

>I'm so sick of hearing people parrot the idea the out-sourcing of jobs is because of unions.<

Much abuse should be sent their way not just because of the wages themselves, but rather old style work rules and benefits and their insistence on holding onto them. Pensions are a thing of the past. Free health care for the retired by the company, again past. 0 deductible health insurance, again the past. These benefits were given out when they cost a pittance. This is no longer true. Reality sucks.

Maybe a simple tax rule: Benefits not equal for all FT employees from pres down to janitor are not deductible as an expense for tax purposes. Work rules: You dont need an electrician to come in to fix a light bulb. The company I worked for did a trade show. They got a bill for 8 hours of work for putting 4 stickers on machines! (10 mins if you include how long it took him to walk from the worker room. What an idiotic work rule!) I happen to be a fan of union wages (This puts me at odds with the wingnuts of this board), just not union benefits and work rules (puts me at odds with the moonbats). I guess everyone hates me

>Then Wall Street guys decided Japanese management principles were the way to go because it would make them more money. So they charged ahead with Japanese management principles and greed was the order of the day<
Sheesh the record is 0 for 3 now. US management looks very little like Japanese management. While the US did adopt many Japanese statistical quality methods, overall management in the US is less cooperative, more competitive, and far higher paid. The Japanese mostly do not make junk and largely have not since 1975. That would be before Reagan wouldnt it?

You pay $100 for tennis shoes?!?!!! No wonder all the fallacies.
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