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Old 12-14-2010, 02:47 PM
 
3,568 posts, read 3,192,366 times
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States like California, Illinois, New Jersey and New York are facing huge budgetary shortfalls that threaten to push them into insolvency. These budget problems are largely the result of the states' liabilities for pension and medical insurance costs of current and past state government employees. Instead of paying into Social Security and Medicare government employee unions, with the collusion of politicians (mostly liberal but not exclusively), created pension and medical care plans separate from Social Security that for the most part give these employees benefits way in excess of those non-governmental employees are entitled to under Social Security and Medicare. Thus the unsustainable costs to the taxpayers.

The solution is simple. Dump all these employees, past and present, unto Social Security and Medicare, and take whatever reserves the states may have for payment of retirement and medical benefits and put them into the Social Security trust fund. Incidentally we should do the same thing for presidents and Congress people, as well. That way everybody would be in the same boat and nobody would have these sweetheart retirement deals. The states would then be free of that burden, which consumes an inordinate part of the states' revenue.

The bottom line is that for years the government worker unions and politicians have ripped off the taxpayers. And it's time for us to say 'No more!.'
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Old 12-14-2010, 02:53 PM
 
31,385 posts, read 31,185,018 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimMe View Post
The bottom line is that for years the government worker unions and politicians have ripped off the taxpayers. And it's time for us to say 'No more!.'
Ah... the current crisis wasn't brought about as a result of state workers, their unions or politicians but rather the fact that state revenues and pension funds have been stripped bare by the recession.
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:11 PM
 
22,770 posts, read 25,308,934 times
Reputation: 14511
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimMe View Post
States like California, Illinois, New Jersey and New York are facing huge budgetary shortfalls that threaten to push them into insolvency. These budget problems are largely the result of the states' liabilities for pension and medical insurance costs of current and past state government employees. Instead of paying into Social Security and Medicare government employee unions, with the collusion of politicians (mostly liberal but not exclusively), created pension and medical care plans separate from Social Security that for the most part give these employees benefits way in excess of those non-governmental employees are entitled to under Social Security and Medicare. Thus the unsustainable costs to the taxpayers.

The solution is simple. Dump all these employees, past and present, unto Social Security and Medicare, and take whatever reserves the states may have for payment of retirement and medical benefits and put them into the Social Security trust fund. Incidentally we should do the same thing for presidents and Congress people, as well. That way everybody would be in the same boat and nobody would have these sweetheart retirement deals. The states would then be free of that burden, which consumes an inordinate part of the states' revenue.

The bottom line is that for years the government worker unions and politicians have ripped off the taxpayers. And it's time for us to say 'No more!.'

this is the worst idea i have heard all day. where do i begin: the unfairness of it, the illegality of it, that there are better solutions, or that there are no politicians who would touch this with a 10-foot pole? take your pick.
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:27 PM
 
37,072 posts, read 38,527,994 times
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Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
Ah... the current crisis wasn't brought about as a result of state workers, their unions or politicians but rather the fact that state revenues and pension funds have been stripped bare by the recession.
I'd have to disagree because they should have never gotten them in the first place, the only reason they were possible at the time was because of good economic times. Nobody in their right minds is going to base compensation on what you're making during a good economic time without any plans in place for a downturn....except politicians.
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:30 PM
 
3,568 posts, read 3,192,366 times
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Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
Ah... the current crisis wasn't brought about as a result of state workers, their unions or politicians but rather the fact that state revenues and pension funds have been stripped bare by the recession.
Kind of like Madoff's ponzi scheme?
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:30 PM
 
37,072 posts, read 38,527,994 times
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Originally Posted by le roi View Post
or that there are no politicians who would touch this with a 10-foot pole?
They are going to have to, I know in my area there is lot of districts having trouble now because of this and it is only the tip of the ice berg.
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:32 PM
 
22,770 posts, read 25,308,934 times
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Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
They are going to have to, I know in my area there is lot of districts having trouble now because of this and it is only the tip of the ice berg.
Well, when I said "touch this with a 10 foot pole," i meant his asinine proposal.

These states can handle tihs problem without liquidating the retirement funds of civil servants, and reneging on the promises that they are legally bound to honor.

instead of stealing the money the retirees earned over their working careers, it might be easier to just euthanize them.
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:40 PM
 
62,768 posts, read 28,074,695 times
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Who promised the pensions? Politicians and other elected officials? Have them pay for the shortfall. Problem solved.
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Central Maine
4,648 posts, read 5,361,651 times
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Originally Posted by JimMe View Post
Incidentally we should do the same thing for presidents and Congress people, as well.
You mean, like they've been for more than 20 years?
Q5: Is it true that members of Congress do not have to pay into Social Security?

A: No, it is not true. All members of Congress, the President and Vice President, Federal judges, and most political appointees, were covered under the Social Security program starting in January 1984. They pay into the system just like everyone else.
Social Security history Frequently Asked Questions
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:59 PM
 
37,072 posts, read 38,527,994 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
These states can handle tihs problem without liquidating the retirement funds of civil servants, and reneging on the promises that they are legally bound to honor.

instead of stealing the money the retirees earned over their working careers, it might be easier to just euthanize them.
I don't think you realize the magnitude of this problem, here is what Pennsylvania faces and they aren't even one of the states in the most trouble:

Quote:
Special Report: Pennsylvania's Pension Crisis - Metropolis
There are three problem areas:

- The State Employees Retirement System (SERS), which now covers some 107,000 retired state workers, currently costs state taxpayers about $226 million a year. This is due to rise sevenfold -- to $1.7 billion -- by fiscal 2012-13.

- The Public School Employees Retirement Fund (PSERS), which covers about 168,000 retired teachers, now costs state and local taxpayers a combined $616 million. This obligation will increase to $3 billion -- nearly five times as much --by fiscal 2012-13.

- There are more than 3,000 municipal pension programs, ranging from Philadelphia and Pittsburgh to any rural borough with more than three employees. They cover retired police, firemen and non-uniformed workers (no one really knows how many) and they are already behind in their current obligations by at least $5 billion. That is not a typo. They are behind by $5 billion.
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