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Old 02-17-2011, 07:56 PM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
8,182 posts, read 9,213,174 times
Reputation: 3632

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Quote:
Originally Posted by newonecoming2 View Post
You are correct it will only raise the cost of things. And that includes houses. The bad debt from those houses is going to be a drag on the economy for a very long time. Our banking system is in deep trouble.

Ben is trying. He can’t do it with out raising the minimum wage.


$7trillion was printed over the last 10 years. That was printed by foreign central banks and used to buy US personal and corporate debt. That is what financed the trade deficit for so long. Printed money. Our money is already worthless.
I don't think the banks really want inflation since it will make THEIR assets (our loans & debt) much less valuable. Deflation will cause the value of their assets to rise, so as long as they can keep someone (the debtor or government) servicing that debt, they profit.
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Old 02-17-2011, 09:01 PM
 
Location: Tower of Heaven
4,023 posts, read 7,372,847 times
Reputation: 1450
Want to be rich ? How :



LOVE IT
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Old 02-18-2011, 08:41 AM
 
2,514 posts, read 1,987,005 times
Reputation: 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by hilgi View Post
I don't think the banks really want inflation since it will make THEIR assets (our loans & debt) much less valuable. Deflation will cause the value of their assets to rise, so as long as they can keep someone (the debtor or government) servicing that debt, they profit.
The reality is that their assets (our debts are worthless because we collectively don't have the ability to repay them. Now getting them to admit that they are wrong and have loaned out more money than can be repaid, ever, that is the trick. If they do this then we can start talking about what to do about the problem. Reinstating Glass Stegal that is a good place to start.
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Old 02-18-2011, 09:30 AM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
8,182 posts, read 9,213,174 times
Reputation: 3632
Quote:
Originally Posted by newonecoming2 View Post
The reality is that their assets (our debts are worthless because we collectively don't have the ability to repay them. Now getting them to admit that they are wrong and have loaned out more money than can be repaid, ever, that is the trick. If they do this then we can start talking about what to do about the problem. Reinstating Glass Stegal that is a good place to start.
Most debts are still being serviced and banks are moditying and adjusting payments. Even if they don't the loss on a debt is a write off. No mater what they can continue to make the books look good enough for them to get their bonuses.

G S is ok; I prefer going back to corporate charter reform. Regulations are just compromises written by lawyers, a charter sets out the rules from the beginning. We need to bring back simple corporate charters and take away or charge a fee for a corporation to have limited liability. If a corporation can only take on risk that is high enough for them to cover, fine but they should not be able to take more risk than they can cover, or in some extreme cases, pay a large fee (tax) for the government to cover the excess risk.

Their needs to be people liable for their actions, not just regulations.
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Old 02-18-2011, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Texas
38,859 posts, read 25,538,911 times
Reputation: 24780
Default Tax the Rich!

There's far too much whining from the wealthy.

After paying his taxes, a millionaire is still a millionaire.
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Old 02-18-2011, 10:19 AM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
8,182 posts, read 9,213,174 times
Reputation: 3632
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
There's far too much whining from the wealthy.

After paying his taxes, a millionaire is still a millionaire.
That should be the debate. Not "high" income wage earners making $250,000 some years. They are not the "millionaires and billionaires" buying yachts and planes. The problem is they need to use the imagery of a Trump to get to where the majority of taxable income is (the $250-$500K wage earners)

Don't be conned.
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Old 02-18-2011, 10:19 AM
 
1,432 posts, read 1,091,898 times
Reputation: 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
There's far too much whining from the wealthy.

After paying his taxes, a millionaire is still a millionaire.
And those 40% who pay no income taxes are still free loaders....
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Old 02-18-2011, 11:24 AM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
8,182 posts, read 9,213,174 times
Reputation: 3632
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secchamps98 View Post
And those 40% who pay no income taxes are still free loaders....
That is just as wrong as what Gringo said; both are stereotypes and serve no purpose. When talking about the bottom 40% are we talking about AGI, Taxable income, wage earners, or people with low taxable non-wage income?

If you look at the bottom 40% by AGI they earned $689 Billion, of that $533 billion was salaries and wages. This cohort paid very little in Federal income tax but they paid $41 billion in SS and Medicare tax, plus the same amount was paid by their employer. There are also people who generate income that is much higher than those in the bottom 40% yet they pay much less in TOTAL tax than someone making $40,000 in wages.

Here is an example: Standard deductions both cases.

Couple A: Earns $35,000, pays only $830 in FIT but they pay $$2,677 in SS and Medi. If they live in CA they also pay another $282. For a TOTAL tax bill of $3,789.

Retired Couple B: $20,000 in Pension income, $25,000 in social security, $10,000 in Municipal bond interest, $15,000 in stock dividends for a total of $70,000 in spendable income. Their TOTAL tax bill?

Wait for it.....
Spoiler
$1,742

Now who are the free loaders?

The system is screwed because of the way we try and tax people, we need to tax natural monopolies, not incomes.
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Old 02-18-2011, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Northeast
1,377 posts, read 1,053,644 times
Reputation: 407
Everybody is a freeloader... unless it's you of course, because your earned it
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Old 02-18-2011, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Texas
38,859 posts, read 25,538,911 times
Reputation: 24780
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secchamps98 View Post
And those 40% who pay no income taxes are still free loaders....
They pay a lot of other taxes. Sales, property, excise, etc. If the American middle class hadn't been carved up in recent decades, we wouldn't be in this fix, would we? More people/families would be earning enough so that they wouldn't qualify for all the poverty-level breaks.

But the decision-makers have decided to dismantle America's manufacturing and build up China's, with this predictable consequence.
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