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Old 03-06-2011, 09:11 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,840,354 times
Reputation: 9357

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Quote:
Originally Posted by triplet383 View Post
Once again, you're not reading and analyzing the table correctly. Line 7A is for 7 years experience in a prior district with a masters +30 additional credits. NO ONE IN THERE RIGHT MIND leaves a teaching job elsewhere to teach in NYC when they have already have 7 years experience and 30 credits over a masters. It's always been the reverse -- teachers start out working in NYC, then either stay or go to the suburbs with their experience.

The line that starts "5 years long" are for longevity. If you teach in NYC for 5 years, tack on $1000 to your salary. And once again, you have to work 22 years with 30+ credits over a masters to get over $100K. I certainly think a teacher deserves that.
No line 7A is not for 7 years of experience in a prior district..
AGAIN.. its for STARTING wages, for those who can receive CREDITS.. its not necessarily teaching experience..

Nor do you need a masters to get that pay scale.. You can get a teaching degree AFTER you start teaching with the proper credits..

Where on gods earth did many of you go to school that you cant read a basic chart, nor the links which verify I am correct?
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Old 03-06-2011, 09:12 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,840,354 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by triplet383 View Post
And teacher's aren't in the same position? If I was to quit and find a job now, I wouldn't be able to find an available position, much less a higher paying one. What you're saying is true for everyone today. The data that was discussed is from 2000 - 2006, at the end of the economic boom. Companies, schools, etc were all hiring.
Wait.. you JUST said, that people are moving TO GET MORE MONEY.. now you are saying the cant..

Lets not even discuss that all of this began because I said teachers were getting very good pay raises, you said I was wrong, and now you are telling me they were getting good pay raises because it was an economic "boom"
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Old 03-06-2011, 09:14 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,840,354 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray1945 View Post
You must be smoking some of the good stuff...

A teacher's benefits: salary that is often not commensurate with that of other professionals with the same credentials; and health insurance, which is a standard benefit for almost all professions.

My pension, after 37 years of teaching, was $27k/yr. I retired before being Medicare eligible and I paid my own health insurance premium of $495/mo. I am now covered by Medicare and I still pay for my own supplemental coverage.

So, tell me, in what way are my "BENEFITS AKIN TO THE GOLDEN PARACHUTES OF THE CEOs"?
I would conceed that teachers WERE not paid well in the past, and did not receive good benefits, but you need to compare the benefits you received then to what they receive today..

Growing up most of the teachers I knew had summer jobs to make ends meet, now they take vacations and travel.. (my buddy one such example).. Obviously not all of them are living great, but to pretend that many arent doing rather well is denying the truth.

and again, I'm not criticizing them for being "well paid".. People are worth what they can get.. I'm just stating facts.
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Old 03-06-2011, 09:22 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
7,215 posts, read 7,608,349 times
Reputation: 7722
Because god knows a teacher should basically be an indentured servant just making enough to get by and do OK, right?

And lots of people take vacations and travel during summer. That's a sign of a good economy.
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Old 03-06-2011, 09:39 AM
 
6,950 posts, read 5,243,427 times
Reputation: 2752
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
I would conceed that teachers WERE not paid well in the past, and did not receive good benefits, but you need to compare the benefits you received then to what they receive today..

Growing up most of the teachers I knew had summer jobs to make ends meet, now they take vacations and travel.. (my buddy one such example).. Obviously not all of them are living great, but to pretend that many arent doing rather well is denying the truth.

and again, I'm not criticizing them for being "well paid".. People are worth what they can get.. I'm just stating facts.
I retired in 2003, my husband in 2005. Our children are both teachers - I can assure you that down here in Florida, not much has changed.
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Old 03-06-2011, 09:57 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,840,354 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray1945 View Post
I retired in 2003, my husband in 2005. Our children are both teachers - I can assure you that down here in Florida, not much has changed.
Average pay for teachers in Florida is about $45K a year
http://www.fldoe.org/ARM/files/Teacher_Pay_Review.pdf (broken link)
Given there are two of you, that puts your pay in the $80-$90K a year range as a teacher, when you were working.

Are you rich? Of course not, but you clearly teachers arent hurting with the median income in the nation around $42K

An interesting story
Taxpayers Face $900 Billion Teacher Pension Deficit - Bloomberg
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Old 03-06-2011, 11:48 AM
 
6,950 posts, read 5,243,427 times
Reputation: 2752
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Average pay for teachers in Florida is about $45K a year
http://www.fldoe.org/ARM/files/Teacher_Pay_Review.pdf (broken link)
Given there are two of you, that puts your pay in the $80-$90K a year range as a teacher, when you were working.

Are you rich? Of course not, but you clearly teachers arent hurting with the median income in the nation around $42K

An interesting story
Taxpayers Face $900 Billion Teacher Pension Deficit - Bloomberg
The median income for college grads is $45k. Teachers in Florida have a median income of $41k. When the retirement contribution is added in, the median teacher salary is $45k. From your link it is clear that, in Florida, a the state paid retirement contribution IS part of their compensation. Perhaps you'd like to know why:
Quote:
Legislators were faced with a different set of problems in 1974, when they moved away from having employees contribute a portion of their salaries into their retirement accounts. At the time, employees contributed 4 percent of their salaries, while special-risk members (police, firefighters, prison guards) contributed 8 percent.

Under that arrangement, an employee who left the state workforce was entitled to have his pension fund contribution returned in the form of a refund. In 1974, those refunds cost the state a whopping $30 million and left a big hole in the pension plan. Since employees couldn’t take the employer’s share of the retirement fund when they left, the state agreed to pay all of the retirement benefit and cut back on employee salaries.

Read more: Major pension reform battle looms in Legislature - Issues & Ideas - MiamiHerald.com (http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/03/06/2100232_p2/major-pension-reform-battle-looms.html#ixzz1FqGT69wf - broken link)
So, for almost all of my teaching career, I worked under the agreement of lower salary in exchange for a guaranteed pension. My children are teaching under the same arrangement in 2011. If Gov. Scott wants Florida teachers to contribute to their pensions, he should also arrange for them to get an increase in salary.

I never said teachers were "hurting." I have only taken issue with those of you who have stated that teachers - all of them - have lavish salaries and benefits. That's just NOT true.
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Old 03-06-2011, 11:50 AM
 
6,950 posts, read 5,243,427 times
Reputation: 2752
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Average pay for teachers in Florida is about $45K a year
http://www.fldoe.org/ARM/files/Teacher_Pay_Review.pdf (broken link)
Given there are two of you, that puts your pay in the $80-$90K a year range as a teacher, when you were working.

Are you rich? Of course not, but you clearly teachers arent hurting with the median income in the nation around $42K

An interesting story
Taxpayers Face $900 Billion Teacher Pension Deficit - Bloomberg
An even more interesting story:
Actually, employee pensions aren’t bankrupting states - Florida - MiamiHerald.com (http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/03/06/2100243_p2/actually-employee-pensions-arent.html - broken link)
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Old 03-06-2011, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Long Island (chief in S Farmingdale)
18,784 posts, read 14,900,293 times
Reputation: 3868
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
No line 7A is not for 7 years of experience in a prior district..
AGAIN.. its for STARTING wages, for those who can receive CREDITS.. its not necessarily teaching experience..

Nor do you need a masters to get that pay scale.. You can get a teaching degree AFTER you start teaching with the proper credits..

Where on gods earth did many of you go to school that you cant read a basic chart, nor the links which verify I am correct?
The Chart 7a is for those with 6 years of prior teaching experience, or those who have 6 years strong of work experience specialized in the field they are going to teach, provided they are able to receive credit for it (the requirements are fairly strict). The vast majority of those who have a starting pay wages beyond the 1A category are those with prior teaching experience.
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Old 03-06-2011, 07:46 PM
 
11 posts, read 8,239 times
Reputation: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Wait.. you JUST said, that people are moving TO GET MORE MONEY.. now you are saying the cant..

Lets not even discuss that all of this began because I said teachers were getting very good pay raises, you said I was wrong, and now you are telling me they were getting good pay raises because it was an economic "boom"
That's not what I said. What I said was: IF a teacher in my area got a significant PAY CUT, it's very likely that one or more of the following would happen:

a) The teacher would no longer be able to pay the mortgage on his/her house
b) It would be difficult to find another teaching job in the area in order to pay said mortgage, since there are very few open teaching jobs, and those that are open wouldn't pay enough to allow someone to continue living in the area
c) The teacher would have to leave teaching and get a completely different job, possibly moving to a different part of the country to do so.

You really want to see a mass exodus of teachers leave the schools? Who will you blame then when property values plummet even further and your kid can't get into college because all the good teachers in his/her school left teaching?

As for your second paragraph from above, again, I never said "teachers got good pay raises because it was an economic boom" (remember -- this is from our discussion about the 2000 - 2006 chart, NOT talking about 2011 here). I said schools were hiring teachers with more experience, hence giving those teachers higher starting salaries.
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