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Old 03-17-2011, 07:38 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,804,560 times
Reputation: 12341

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Secession was perfectly legal under the constitution.

I didn't say that, the Supreme court said that. Lincoln broke federal law first by deploying troops into what was then foreign territory.
Not quite.

Powers of Congress:
To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions

Powers Prohibited of States:
No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay.

The south also engaged in aggression against federal authorities (and remember, this was BEFORE Lincoln took office).
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,375,785 times
Reputation: 8672
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Not quite.

Powers of Congress:
To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions

Powers Prohibited of States:
No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay.

The south also engaged in aggression against federal authorities (and remember, this was BEFORE Lincoln took office).
Before and during the war, the chief justice of the supreme court said that the south had the right to leave the union, legally.

Lincoln disagreed.

Texas vs. White in 1869 was after the 14th amendment was passed (one of its main reasons for adoption), and it stated that under the constitution of that time it was illegal to leave the union.

But the constitution before the 14th amendment counted states as sovereign and free. That meant that they had the right to leave the union.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:52 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,804,560 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Before and during the war, the chief justice of the supreme court said that the south had the right to leave the union, legally.

Lincoln disagreed.
The south started its aggression BEFORE Lincoln took the office. It took only his election as the next President for the southern government(s) to get their panties twisted in a knot.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:54 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,375,785 times
Reputation: 8672
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
The south started its aggression BEFORE Lincoln took the office. It took only his election as the next President for the southern government(s) to get their panties twisted in a knot.
No, the south seceded from the union before Lincoln took office, as was their right under the writing of the Constitution in 1860 and 1861.

Lincoln sent troops to the south, which was a sovereign country at the time, thus invading a sovereign country with no declaration of war, and he broke the law. Not to mention the other things he did during the war that weren't in his power to do.

Secession is not equal to aggression. If the south had invaded the north, that would have been aggression. They didn't do that until they had been invaded first.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,804,560 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
No, the south seceded from the union before Lincoln took office, as was their right under the writing of the Constitution in 1860 and 1861.
I would like to see that part in the constitution.

Quote:
Lincoln sent troops to the south, which was a sovereign country at the time, thus invading a sovereign country with no declaration of war, and he broke the law. Not to mention the other things he did during the war that weren't in his power to do.
A sovereign country? Even if it were, the "sovereign country" was formed using unconstitutional means AND it showed aggression against the Union. It was well within the powers of Lincoln and the Congress to address the issue at hand, and did either way.
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