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Old 03-20-2011, 01:20 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,431,767 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LookinForMayberry View Post
At this point in time, I don't think either party are thinking about the people at all, but I do believe that the GOP does more harm than the Dems.
They can't. Neither party can so long as lobbyists and campaign finance are permitted to wield inordinate amounts of sway over public policy. Arms dealers decide if America goes to war, not our elected officials. Surround our elected officials with enough BS agenda, it's like revising the content of every reference book in a library to cause the greatest intellectual clout we've got to march in like minded affinity.

Whatever criticism anyone can level at Obama or McCain, no matter the chair they sit in or the ideology they believe, they're surrounded by charlatans hawking wares. The truth being a needle in a haystack would be too simplified. Each industry lobbyist, each think tank, is a full time hay maker paid obscene amounts of money to obscure/ obfuscate the truth. Our very government has been under assault by corporations without allegiance to this nation. It's been a relentless hostile takeover. Checks and balances that preserved America and spared us the fate of USSR have been breached.

Far beyond the lesser of evils plan, we need to craft legislation from the bottom up reforming the way DC does business.
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Old 03-20-2011, 01:48 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,431,767 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by carolac View Post
I could be wrong, but somehow, despite the means through which it was received--be it hard work, inheritance or even winning the lottery--I wonder if those herein advocating wealth redistribution would be singing a different tune if they were sitting on $5 + million (one of the figures I saw in a message as being the limit someone could have). I have a feeling they wouldn't even be bothering to participate in this forum. They'd be traveling, sailing, whatever.

I also wonder, if they had $10 million for example, they'd happily hand over the other $5 million to the Government, again using the cap I saw in one of the messages. Let's be intellectually honest with each other now.
Yes, how about that intellectual honesty. If the basis for that wealth came from customers you hold in contempt, from employees you abused, from a nation who graciously provided that basis only to get a knife in her back, why should We take a word out of your mouth seriously beyond the printing of deportation papers? Why should we allow a foreign policy that rewards you at the expense of legitimate commerce that isn't "too big to fail" and pays it's own way? Why should we have a foreign policy that promotes corporate piracy, abusing those in 3rd world destitution, and promote slavery by surreptitious legal baffling means?

Why is America considered evil abroad???? Because transnational corporations flying an American flag feed Dubai slavery. Because transnational corporations being lent credibility by our government profit from Mariana Island abuses of cheap labor.
TomPaine.com - Sex, Greed And Forced Abortions
THIS is what's being done in our name via transnational corporations. So ask yourself, does THIS represent America, or does it represent all we despise?

China: Factory Explosion, Toxic Spills as Disasters Rise - TIME
This is the face of unmitigated avarice, and still you demand more. It will be America blamed for the cancer their children get and the arable land destroyed. It will be America blamed for the managerial abuses they endure. Profiteers of strife play both sides like chumps and retire in the Cayman Islands while the world is set on fire.
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Old 03-20-2011, 01:48 PM
 
183 posts, read 392,080 times
Reputation: 74
Neither of the major political parties do.
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Old 03-20-2011, 02:14 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,431,767 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carolac View Post
Using your example, for example, if you took Oprah Winfrey's money away from her, and allowed her to maintain only $5 million, she would not have been able to build the girl's school in Africa. Also, JC Penney lived on 10% of his income, and gave the other 90% away to charity. As much as I disagree with Rosie O'Donnell, she gives to and is involved with many, many charities, one of which benefits my own child. Donald Trump, and, yes, Bill Gates, Sandra Bullock--many choose the charities to which to donate their time and money. Why would we want to give that choice to the Government to decide what's best.
Completely bipartsan. It shouldn't matter who it is and that figure was arbitrary. Pick another figure that represents a healthy economic eco-system. It shouldn't matter their personal ideology or tree worshiping habits. No one can be trusted to have enormous concentrations of wealth without it becoming a temptation to oppress others in service to it's own preservation. That was the scenario our founders went to pains to avoid. That's the nightmare all recorded history has seen time and time again. It's alive and well in 3rd world and nations destroyed/ abused by depots for hundreds of years. Be an earnest student of Haiti. Nothing real is permitted to freely grow there unless they're biding time to steal it. The ubber class won't allow anyone to stand in their own shoes. It's revolting.

We're only promoting a different brand of despot via the overly liberal policies regarding transnational corporations/ globalization. Ross Perot was correct about NAFTA. An election having 2 candidates offering you a choice between NAFTA or NAFTA (a republican running on democrat ticket) is a rigged election. Rigged from the inside via k street tendrils pulling strings. Rigged by 70's and beyond think tanks corrupting the national agenda. America is not in service to the (actual) greater good or it's own constitution as a result.
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Old 03-20-2011, 02:36 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,431,767 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtimer2 View Post
I have no problem with a business being large, unless it is a monopoly in fact, or in practice... so long as their conduct is legal and does not unfairly destroy or interfere with competition.
I disagree. That largess (scale= too big to fail) is a huge liability that cannot help but find it's resources abused or middle managers revising corporate mission statements to suit their personal ambitions. I've seen decent fortune 500, and I've seen trash. Once the means of getting around ethical standards is established, it only eggs them on to utter debauchery justified by 'my competitor isn't playing fair'. Policing themselves is gibberish.

Monopolies are currently operating under the guise of corporations splitting from one another for appearance sake yet retaining controlling interest of each other mutually. Imagine you and the wife, for financial reasons, decided to divorce one another for a public show but remained married for all intents and purposes. Some corporations are created for the sole purpose of doing all the dirty work, counting on the law to be slow to shut them down and heck if anyone can follow the money trail once it's been laundered or leaves jurisdictions electronically. The profits were made up front and there's a job waiting for the black hat henchmen in the true parent corporation (beneficiary). Pirates are afoot and by advanced application of PT Barnum abuses, are permitted to mingle as equals in commerce community. The drama was there for public consumption believing justice ever had a chance to be served. It's not respectable business practice. It's organized crime.
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Old 03-20-2011, 02:51 PM
 
72 posts, read 172,226 times
Reputation: 60
Democrats and Independents would support the middle class. Repubs and conservatives try to destroy it, just look at the Reagan years and then bush putting us into this depression that we are finally coming out of. I never understood why lower income or the middle class would support a republican. Their answer is they think their taxes will be lower, come now. The housing crisis started in the Bush years and my taxes went the highest they ever were. Please get a grip.
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Old 03-20-2011, 02:53 PM
 
Location: 22 months till retirement and I can leave the hell hole of New Yakistan
23,187 posts, read 12,998,602 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littlelamb3 View Post
Democrats and Independents would support the middle class. Repubs and conservatives try to destroy it, just look at the Reagan years and then bush putting us into this depression that we are finally coming out of. I never understood why lower income or the middle class would support a republican. Their answer is they think their taxes will be lower, come now. The housing crisis started in the Bush years and my taxes went the highest they ever were. Please get a grip.
uhm

the housing crisus started in 1995 when clinton changed the standards fro mortgages

the liberals and their policies have destroyed the middleclass
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Old 03-20-2011, 03:02 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,431,767 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HC475 View Post
The Rich got rich by draining the Middle class...
BINGO! Gates passed the bill for his BS onto the backs of consumers/ small businesses stuck with a pig in a poke. There was only one correct thing to do with my former windows operating system-- throw it out the window. CAD programs have been notoriously hobbled by bass ackward code. It's an echo of a larger reality that's dominated this nation like an invisible plague for decades.

The middle class has steadily devolved into the lesser class. It didn't matter how hard they worked, how honest they were, how much value they brought to the table. The table was rigged to ensure there would only be one winner. Not the win- win economic solutions America was world renowned. Cannibals rule the roost and the reputation of American business is disgraced by overly permissive deregulation.
Catching Corporate Crooks - BusinessWeek
Nobel Prize Winner Joseph Stiglitz Calls for Jail Time for Corporate Crooks - DailyFinance
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/16/opinion/16horn.html
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Old 03-20-2011, 03:16 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,431,767 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
nope

the misddleclas was drained by the liberal welfare state policies
You haven't a clue what built the very ground you stand upon. Here's where your mentality, temporarily distracted targeting liberals as the bane of your existence, is headed...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-DrHEB7trY
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Old 03-20-2011, 03:32 PM
 
10,713 posts, read 11,410,906 times
Reputation: 4751
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffington View Post
Delusion 100% You bought their facade hook, line, sinker, bait, rod, reel and all. Need Pepto??
Oh yeah, it's the dems bankrolling the snot out of the rich, trying to destroy unions, and don't give a damn about the working man
It's unbelievable how delusional some people are, I guess that's why they vote republican
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