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No one has disputed that as a fact. What's disputed is the degree of intellectual honesty displayed in posting that fact as being dispositive with respect to the condition of the poor during the Reagan administration. Given all else that went on during that administration, that degree of intellectual honesty can be fairly characterized as next to nil. The data you again refer to above are a deliberately cherry-picked misrepresentation of the facts of those years.
Fact (no cherry-picking)... the change in real family income for the lowest wage earners (the poor) went up (6%), not down during the Reagan era.
This from the Bureau of the Census.
Fact (no cherry-picking)... the change in real family income for the lowest wage earners (the poor) went up (6%), not down during the Reagan era. This from the Bureau of the Census.
Average income (US$2002) -- Lowest quintile of households by income...
Source: CBO, 6133 Series, Historical Table 1C -- Number of Households, Average Income and Income Shares, and Income Category Minimums for All Households, by Household Income Category
Source: CBO, 6133 Series, Historical Table 1C -- Number of Households, Average Income and Income Shares, and Income Category Minimums for All Households, by Household Income Category
A link to the site where this info is listed, please. A link I can click.
I’ll tell you what really happened from Carter to Regan, because I lived it.
During Carter I couldn’t afford new car because the interest rate was so high. For most people a home purchase was as out of the question. An 18% interest rate was considered a great rate. Inflation was out of control. It was a miserable time.
By the middle of Regans first term not only did I have a new car, but I was able to purchase a new condo. My pay wasn’t going up much, but with inflation under control and interest rates coming down I was able to have a life again.
I’ll tell you what really happened from Carter to Regan, because I lived it.
During Carter I couldn’t afford new car because the interest rate was so high. For most people a home purchase was as out of the question. An 18% interest rate was considered a great rate. Inflation was out of control. It was a miserable time.
By the middle of Regans first term not only did I have a new car, but I was able to purchase a new condo. My pay wasn’t going up much, but with inflation under control and interest rates coming down I was able to have a life again.
No question about it... people in general were much better off under Reagan in practically every aspect than they were under Carter.
I’ll tell you what really happened from Carter to Regan, because I lived it. During Carter I couldn’t afford new car because the interest rate was so high. For most people a home purchase was as out of the question. An 18% interest rate was considered a great rate.
Peculiar. As it happens, I bought a house just around the mid-point of Carter's term in office. The interest rate was about half that. Of course, things did get worse from there, especially once the Reagan Depression set in. In 1982, for example, the average commitment rate for all fixed-rate first mortgages was 16.08%. Pretty steep.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNC
By the middle of Regans first term not only did I have a new car, but I was able to purchase a new condo. My pay wasn’t going up much, but with inflation under control and interest rates coming down I was able to have a life again.
The middle of Reagan's first term might have been the glorious year of 1983. By then, the average commitment rate for all fixed-rate first mortgages had tumbled all the way to 13.23%. You got a real bargain alright.
Peculiar. As it happens, I bought a house just around the mid-point of Carter's term in office. The interest rate was about half that. Of course, things did get worse from there, especially once the Reagan Depression set in. In 1982, for example, the average commitment rate for all fixed-rate first mortgages was 16.08%. Pretty steep.
Actually, the prime rate peaked at 21.5% on Dec. 8, 1980. Last time I checked, Carter was still president.
Quote:
The middle of Reagan's first term might have been the glorious year of 1983. By then, the average commitment rate for all fixed-rate first mortgages had tumbled all the way to 13.23%. You got a real bargain alright.
Actually, the prime in 1983 averaged about 10.75% for the year. When Carter took office in January 1977, the prime was about 6.5%. When he left in January 1981, it was about 19%.
Source: CBO, 6133 Series, Historical Table 1C -- Number of Households, Average Income and Income Shares, and Income Category Minimums for All Households, by Household Income Category
I would be careful about looking at those numbers from a static point, which is what you are doing.
During the Carter administration, as unemployment went up so did lowest quintile averages. As unemployment went down and the number of teenagers between the ages of 16 and 19 got jobs shot up dramatically during Reagan's term, the quintiles dropped. This should be expected since more entry level jobs were being created. This in effect pushed those who had been counted as being in the lowest quintile during the Carter Administration into the second quintile during Reagan. The net effect is a lower quintile average during the Reagan term, not lower incomes.
Incidentally, disposable income for the lower and middle-class went up during the Reagan Administration. Under Carter, it as anemic at best. In fact, disposable income for lower and middle class peaked higher under Reagan than at any time during the boom of the 1990's.
Peculiar. As it happens, I bought a house just around the mid-point of Carter's term in office. The interest rate was about half that. Of course, things did get worse from there, especially once the Reagan Depression set in. In 1982, for example, the average commitment rate for all fixed-rate first mortgages was 16.08%. Pretty steep.
Well goody for you the rest of us were slammed to the ground by inflation and high interest rates. I bet you didn’t try to refinance toward the end of Carters term.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
The middle of Reagan's first term might have been the glorious year of 1983. By then, the average commitment rate for all fixed-rate first mortgages had tumbled all the way to 13.23%. You got a real bargain alright.
The interest rate was around 10.5% and that was considered a good rate. I qualified for first time buyer finance at 9.375%.
What you are leaving out with your statistics is the high inflation, the fumbling missteps by Carter, the uncertainty that everyone felt about the economy. It seemed all Carter wanted to do is turn the other cheek when it came to foreign policy. Anyone remember the hostages?
Once Regan got into office, everyone I knew felt better about America and being an American. Those were great times. I only wish we had another Regan to vote for now.
Actually, the prime rate peaked at 21.5% on Dec. 8, 1980. Last time I checked, Carter was still president.
That particular discussion was with respect to claims re the purchase of a home. The bank prime rate does not enter into such transactions. Contract interest rates on commitments for fixed-rate first mortgages are the far more relevant numbers, which is why I referred to them.
Prime rates, meanwhile, are relatively volatile measure, as might be suggested by the fact that the monthly figure for December 1980 of 20.35% was preceded by a rate of 13.79% in October 1980, just prior to the election. Do you suspect that this eight-week jump of 6.5% in the bank prime was in any way driven by inflationary fears resulting from the prospect that Reagan's campaign rhetoric of massive tax cuts coupled with massive increases in defense spending might actually be realized?
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