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View Poll Results: Is Fred Phillips willfully negligent for burning the Qur'an?
Yes, he should be tried as such by the families of soldiers and civilians who may be harmed. 13 21.67%
No, burning the Qur'an isn't an unreasonable act 38 63.33%
Other (please explain) 9 15.00%
Voters: 60. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
Old 04-03-2011, 10:20 PM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,866,888 times
Reputation: 2519

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Should the cartoonist who drew this:


Be responsible for what Muslims did?

Especially when Westergaard said this:"many of the immigrants who came to Denmark, they had nothing. We gave them everything – money, apartments, their own schools, free university, health care. In return, we asked one thing – respect for democratic values, including free speech. Do they agree? This is my simple test."
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:21 PM
 
Location: Texas State Fair
8,560 posts, read 11,212,862 times
Reputation: 4258
Apparently, connecting the burning book to events in Kandahar is just a pretext for limiting privileges of speech in the U.S.

Petraeus condemns Quran burning as protests rage on - CNN.com
Quote:
However, President Karzai's brother denied that the Kandahar protests were a result of the Quran burning.

"The protests in the last two days in Kandahar have no link to the Quran burning in U.S. at all, but were all organized by some people to loot public and government properties," Ahmad Wali Karzai told CNN, adding that he condemned the desecration of Islam's holy book
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:21 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,868 posts, read 26,498,769 times
Reputation: 25766
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
Lol, we're discussing freedom of speech, and Graham and Reid are guilty of treason for exercising their freedom of speech?
As individuals they are welcome to say anything they want. As elected officials, to propose suspension of civil rights is, or should be considered, an act of treason. What's next, we can't criticize an elected official because it might offend them? Throw away protections against unreasonable search and seizure because someone might have a Koran and a bottle of lighter fluid?
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:23 PM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,771,287 times
Reputation: 7020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speleothem View Post
They are free to express their opinions, but passing
unconstitutional legislation is not freedom of speech.
They can pass it all they want. It will just get shot down by the Supreme Court.
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:24 PM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,866,888 times
Reputation: 2519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
And correct me if I'm wrong - the only threats and attacks were against him?
5 were killed in rioting in Afghanistan(surprise surprise...)
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:26 PM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,771,287 times
Reputation: 7020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
As individuals they are welcome to say anything they want. As elected officials, to propose suspension of civil rights is, or should be considered, an act of treason. What's next, we can't criticize an elected official because it might offend them? Throw away protections against unreasonable search and seizure because someone might have a Koran and a bottle of lighter fluid?
Of course you can criticize public officials - in fact, laws regarding criticizing them are more lax than criticizing non public officials. But if you say you're going to kill the President - expect the FBI to show up at your door.
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Old 04-04-2011, 05:34 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,266 posts, read 26,192,233 times
Reputation: 15636
Quote:
Originally Posted by 808s View Post
However, I believe that with the freedoms we have and take for granted, there is a price for those freedoms. In the case of Terry Jones, while he has his right to free expression, he is also responsible for the consequences of that expression. He knew how people in Afghanistan, Pakistan, and other places would react with his actions and he was warned numerous times about it. In my opinion, what he did was no different than yelling "fire" in a crowded movie theater. While I believe he shouldn't be brought up on criminal charges due to free speech laws, I would NOT be surprised if he's named the defendant in a wrongful death suit brought by the families of the people who died.

As a Catholic myself, I believe burning the Qur'an (and anti-Muslim prejudice in any form) is reprehensible and highly offensive to the followers of the Islamic faith, not to mention un-Christian.
Petraeus warned that this was mistake last year and that burning the Queran would be a big set back for our forces in Afghanistan. The radical Islamic factions use situations like this as a poster for recruitment and adds to confirm their worst fears about the US.

I'm not sure what the good pastor from Florida accomplished other than to get innocent people killed.
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Old 04-04-2011, 06:44 AM
 
7,871 posts, read 10,128,950 times
Reputation: 3241
No, I think this falls under the protection of the First Amendment.

Now if the did this in front of a mosque full of angry muslims, he probably should be charged with inciting a riot, depending on the circumstances.
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Old 04-04-2011, 07:02 AM
 
Location: Orlando
8,276 posts, read 12,857,391 times
Reputation: 4142
Here is my issue. while I view the rights granted under the constitution as important. Why are not the rights of those the Fred Phelps of the world hurt important? He is protected for his free speech but the mourning families aren't protected from his assault. I don't believe we have rights so we can trample on those of others. I do not view others to include corporations or governments, but only sentient beings.

Why does the Matthew Sheppard family have to be assaulted? Have they not been harmed already? Why allow additional insult and injury? The familes of fallen soldiers, have they not suffered enough?

I have no issue with a restraining order on all the wbc and its members from any funeral they have no part in. and I'd give them a 1/2 mile distance limit, then provide no media coverage. I'm a bit surprised some Vet hasn't taken their assaults personally.
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Old 04-04-2011, 07:17 AM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,771,287 times
Reputation: 7020
Quote:
Originally Posted by AONE View Post
Here is my issue. while I view the rights granted under the constitution as important. Why are not the rights of those the Fred Phelps of the world hurt important? He is protected for his free speech but the mourning families aren't protected from his assault. I don't believe we have rights so we can trample on those of others. I do not view others to include corporations or governments, but only sentient beings.
Mainly because Phelps was within legal distances for protesting, and didn't cause any demonstrateable emotional damage to the people he was protesting. As a former lawyer, Phelps knows how to push people's buttons to the maximum, while still staying within legal guidelines. It's one of his more... endearing qualities
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