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Ok mr desperate for my attention that you had message me to get me to reply... I believe the phrase new antisemitism would mean it is NEW - but in order to be naming cities with this moniker there must be some hard evidence to back it up otherwise you are being anti San Franciscan.
So please provide the study or links because I live there and never hear anything like that.
Secondly orthodox I believe we have very few. So are you saying my Jewish friends who are not orthodox don't count??? They have kids who are circumcised. Stay on topic. This is about circumcision and the incorrect assumption it is a hidden threat to Jewish families but the correct assumption that it violates our rights. Like I stated, not Jewish but my kids are circumcised, so you are diminishing he fact that this would prevent ME from having the right to circumsize my sons Which is EQUALLY important as a Jewish believer losing their right to circumsize their son.
This will affect Jews and non Jews alike so quit making it about religion because it is not.
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Originally Posted by NY Jew
do you know what the term "New Antisemitism" means?
do you know anything about those Jewish communities?
from History of Orthodox Congregations
"Memphis’s Jewish community has among the largest Orthodox population per capita of any southern city. In most other cities, many Orthodox congregations founded over a century ago have long since closed or moved away from traditional Judaism. In 1941, Memphis had four congregations that belonged to the Union of Orthodox Congregations of America. Today, Memphis has managed to maintain two significantly sized Orthodox synagogues, including one that boasts of being the largest Orthodox congregation in the United States."
for goodness sake the only Orthodox school in SF is an outreach school and advertises it's self as the only place you can be guaranteed a minyan during the week.
your right their are probably a higher percentage of Orthodox jews out of the total number of jews in SF then Huntsville, but I wasn't counting Huntsville because according to the federation their are only 750 Jews in Huntsville SF has 50,000+ with 210,000+ in the Bay area.
Let them go ahead and pass the law. Then anyone in San Francisco who does want to have male children circumsized will have to go outside the city boundaries. Possibly to live, since they will have committed an illegal act and be subject to who-knows-what kind of penalty. When the city has lost enough taxpaying residents, they'll rescind the law.
If you believe that I suppose you would have believed the same Nonsense when the Soviet's did the same thing after all the Soviet Union had freedom of worship (not religion) so they couldn't be anti religious ceremonies. This is law if passed would be the most Anti Semitic law in the United States history.
Do you really think this law would be more anti-semitic than Ulysses S. Grant's General Order No. 11 which tried to create a "Pale of Settlement" in the US by barring Jews from living in Kentucky, Mississippi, and Tennessee? That was the most antisemitic law in US history. Lincoln forced him to revoke the order.
No one is banning Jews from living in San Francisco, which has the 2nd highest percentage of Jews of any county in the state, next to Marin on the other side of the Golden Gate Bridge. San Francisco is not antisemitic at all.
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In addition SF already has a repuation for being one of the most "New antisemitic" city is the whole country so why would I be shocked if they throw in little old antisemitism going back at least to the Seleucid Greeks.
Let them go ahead and pass the law. Then anyone in San Francisco who does want to have male children circumsized will have to go outside the city boundaries. Possibly to live, since they will have committed an illegal act and be subject to who-knows-what kind of penalty. When the city has lost enough taxpaying residents, they'll rescind the law.
For one thing, this initiative will probably not pass, and if it does a court would strike it down on freedom of religion concerns.
And a SF ordinance would not affect what SF residents do in Marin County, San Mateo County, Alameda County, etc.
Do you really think this law would be more anti-semitic than Ulysses S. Grant's General Order No. 11 which tried to create a "Pale of Settlement" in the US by barring Jews from living in Kentucky, Mississippi, and Tennessee? That was the most antisemitic law in US history. Lincoln forced him to revoke the order.
yes and and more anti semetic then not getting the right to vote in certain states either (Maryland 1828, Rhode Island 1842, North Carolina until 1868, New Hampshire 1877)
so you are diminishing he fact that this would prevent ME from having the right to circumsize my sons Which is EQUALLY important as a Jewish believer losing their right to circumsize their son
The following stories (I could show countless of them) tells you why this is the most anti Semitic law
The Bluzhever Rebbe was a survivor of the Holocaust who had suffered in the camps throughout the war. During one particular brutal assignment of chopping wood, he overheard the Nazi's instructing all infants, children and mothers to line up. The Rebbe understood very well that this meant that they were next to be killed. Amidst the cries and moans of the mothers, the Rebbe heard a mother cry out, "A knife, a knife. I need a knife." The Rebbe thinking that it was a distraught woman who wanted to take her life, quickly ran over and tried calming her down. An S.S. officer who witnessed the scene, came over and hit the Rebbe over the head with his gun, knocking him down to the ground. Smiling, the officer proudly presented the woman with a knife. The Rebbe still in a daze, looked away, so as not to see what the lady was about to do. Surprisingly, he began to hear the lady talking in a very calm and controlled voice. He turned around and saw the lady place her infant on the ground, unbutton his clothing, and proclaim, "Hashem, you granted me this beautiful baby. Today, he is eight days old. I know that he will be returned to You very shortly. Let me at least return him to You as a Jew with a Bris." She then recited the blessing and circumcised her son, before the stunned Nazi.
The famous Mohel, Rav Zvi (Harry) Bronstein is a modern day example of incredible dedication to Brit Milah. Rav Bronstein traveled to the Soviet Union on his American passport and clandestinely performed large numbers of Brit Milah until the KGB caught him and placed him in a Soviet prison. The Soviets released him after he suffered a serious heart attack and American leaders pressured Premier Brezhnev for Rav Bronstein's release.
yes and and more anti semetic then not getting the right to vote in certain states either (Maryland 1828, Rhode Island 1842, North Carolina until 1868, New Hampshire 1877)
So banning circumcision is more antisemitic than depriving Jews of the right to vote or banning Jews from living in certain US states?
I don't believe in banning circumcision (for reasons previously stated in this thread) but that has to be one of the most absurd things I've read on C-D.
I grew up around Jews. I went to schools and colleges with many, many Jews. I know Jews quite well, and I generally like them and respect them. However, to claim that circumcision is more important than the right to vote is insane.
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would you risk your life to circumcise your son?
"They won't take this moyel knife from me until they pry it out of my cold dead hands"
Re: the Seleucid Greeks, a rather complex story ; there was a full fledged religious/political conflict in Judea going on and they made the mistake of intervening, and thought the locals would adhere to their cultural norms. They were quite wrong and wound up getting into a situation that was worse than anything they expected. If you're going to call them evil, then you'd have to refer to America as evil because it got into situations of that type in Vietnam and Iraq. While I think Vietnam was a horrible error and I have opposed the Iraq war, I do not think of America as evil.
Re: San Francisco, I've lived there, and it's not antisemitic at all. No political leader or official in San Francisco, for example, has publically stated, using traditional antisemitic code words, that the Jews were out to get him, as Joe Arpaio, the sheriff of Maricopa County, Arizona, has. Jews are well established as part of the SF community and most Bay Area counties have higher than average percentages of Jews in their population.
Anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism are not the same thing. In said Chronicle article some of the Jews quoted rejected said assertion that they are, including a rabbi in Berkeley.
If anti-Zionism is anti-Semitism than many Orthodox Jews would be anti-semitic. Satmar, for example, is unquestionably weird and extreme, but are they anti-Semites? No.
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