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Old 05-06-2011, 10:16 PM
 
1,461 posts, read 1,522,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
socialism, communism, progressivism(liberalism) and fascism all COME FROM marxism...all are a FORM OF marxism
So Theodore Roosevelt one of our most progresssive presidents was a Marxist? Humm...interesting.

"As Mankind becomes more liberal, they will be more apt to allow that all those who conduct themselves as worthy members of the community are equally entitled to the protections of civil government. I hope ever to see America among the foremost nations of justice and liberality." George Washington
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:20 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,884,748 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by newhandle View Post
JFK "...someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by a "Liberal," then I'm proud to say I'm a "Liberal."
Moreover, "if liberals = progressives = fascists" then why did JFK (and also my liberal father) volunteer that to fight the fascists during World War II? Can't we just conclude that workingclasshero is equally as informed as Joe the Plumber?
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:24 PM
 
Location: Illinois Delta
5,767 posts, read 4,997,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newhandle View Post
JFK "...someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by a "Liberal," then I'm proud to say I'm a "Liberal."

Thank you, newhandle; I've looked for that speech before but without luck. It helps to illustrate the vast differences in the meaning of the labels that have been discussed ad infinitum in this thread. Politics aside, it boils down to treating others as you would like to be treated. JFK inspired millions with his intellect and humor; how sad that most young people are only familiar with his inaugural address. He spoke for me, then and now.
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:29 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland
41,325 posts, read 44,809,653 times
Reputation: 7118
Quote:
Originally Posted by newhandle View Post
JFK "...someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by a "Liberal," then I'm proud to say I'm a "Liberal."
Everyone believes in the above. The point is how to get there. Liberals want big government, big spending and a big nanny state to "care" for the people (keep them DOWN and dependent on government).
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:33 PM
 
1,970 posts, read 1,754,114 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
Moreover, "if liberals = progressives = fascists" then why did JFK (and also my liberal father) volunteer that to fight the fascists during World War II? Can't we just conclude that workingclasshero is equally as informed as Joe the Plumber?
JFK was the old fashioned type of liberal/Democrat. he was a decent person. Democrats are no longer like that at all. They have completely went so far left that there is no distinction between them and many of the Marxists, Socialists and Communisim lights out there. Hell, look at Bernie Sanders. he is an admitted Socialist. That is not what JFK was. It is what Teddy turned into though.
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Chandler, AZ
5,800 posts, read 6,540,420 times
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Very well said, and very nicely done.
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:52 PM
 
11,155 posts, read 15,660,170 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy View Post
I wonder how many people who don't like that name for Obama have looked at the people he surrounded himself with. He said that was the way to determine things like this and he has surrounded himself with far left advisors.
Clearly...
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:53 PM
 
Location: Illinois Delta
5,767 posts, read 4,997,770 times
Reputation: 2063
Quote:
Originally Posted by MORebelWoman View Post
JFK was the old fashioned type of liberal/Democrat. he was a decent person. Democrats are no longer like that at all. They have completely went so far left that there is no distinction between them and many of the Marxists, Socialists and Communisim lights out there. Hell, look at Bernie Sanders. he is an admitted Socialist. That is not what JFK was. It is what Teddy turned into though.
Just as William F. Buckeley was the old-fashioned type of conservative/Republican, and was a decent person. Republicans are very different now as well; Buckeley understood the need for the separation of church and state. They have moved the GOP so far to the right that what one poster called "sensible shoes Republicans" are considered RINOs. The admiration for intellect that Buckeley embodied is now held in disdain by his party. Some might call neo-conservatives "theocrats" or "plutocrats." The embracing of Trump might be indicative of a move toward plutocracy.
The days of Buckeley, Nelson Rockefeller and Jacob Javitz are long gone.
Such men were neither theocrats nor plutocrats, any more than President Obama is a socialist.
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:54 PM
 
11,155 posts, read 15,660,170 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by MORebelWoman View Post
JFK was the old fashioned type of liberal/Democrat. he was a decent person. Democrats are no longer like that at all. They have completely went so far left that there is no distinction between them and many of the Marxists, Socialists and Communisim lights out there. Hell, look at Bernie Sanders. he is an admitted Socialist. That is not what JFK was. It is what Teddy turned into though.
You know, wanting to provide health care or basic protections for the least among us doesn't make someone a bad person. In fact, I'm pretty sure that's what Jesus told us to do.
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Old 05-06-2011, 11:33 PM
 
11,531 posts, read 10,255,902 times
Reputation: 3580
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
socialism, communism, progressivism(liberalism) and fascism all COME FROM marxism...all are a FORM OF marxism
Marxism came after Socialism.
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