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Since you're a member of the SCV, can you please tell me why they chose a flag that has been adopted by hate groups?
OMG! This is an utterly ridiculous question, and completely clueless post. Geez.
You ask why the SCV chose a flag that has been adopted by hate groups. Uhhhh...the SCV was founded in 1898, and the flag logo was on the seal, long before any hate-groups "adopted" it. So it is OUR symbol, not theirs. And the quickest way I know to let them have full possession of it, is to surrender it to them by default. I am not willing to do that.
And, for your further edification, the SCV has members of ALL races (including blacks) and each year the organization re-affirms a resolution passed in convention back in 1992 which condemns "in the strongest terms" the use of the Confederate Battle Flag by any group or individual in a way which expresses "racial hatred or political extremism."
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Aren't there a bunch of Confederate flags to choose from?
Yes, there are. But that one (Battle Flag) is the one adopted over a century ago. And also, to some, NO Confederate Flag would be acceptable anyway. That is just a strawman.
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Let's be honest here, we all know that KKK members and other hate groups are going to be buying these license plates to proudly display their hate, not honor Confederate ancestors.
Yes, let's be honest here. Again, this is shows your limited knowledge of the situation. The vanity plates will not feature a Confederate Flag in and of itself. Rather, the flag as part of the larger design of the SCV logo. Known skin or coneheads are NOT allowed into our organization, and behavior which indicates such renders the member to be expelled. So, why would a skin or conehead buy a vanity plate with the SCV logo on it if they were not members? That makes no sense.
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Do you think Texas should let me drive around with the Black Panther Party or Nation of Islam symbol on my plates?
Another strawman. But if those groups want to get vanity plates of their own, then it their right to apply for them. But one key difference is, the Battle Flag and and SCV have an intrinsic historical connection with Texas history. But regardless, why do you ask? Are you a member of either of those groups...?
This is stupid and unnecessary. The Civil War ended 150 years ago. "Sons of Confederate Veterans"? Seriously?
Hmmmmm. Let's see. The American Revolution ended about 220 years ago. The Texas Revolution ended about 170 years ago. The Sons/Daughters of the American Revolution? Or the Sons/Daughters of the Republic of Texas? Seriously?
Hmmmmm. Let's see. The American Revolution ended about 220 years ago. The Texas Revolution ended about 170 years ago. The Sons/Daughters of the American Revolution? Or the Sons/Daughters of the Republic of Texas? Seriously?
None of those were aimed at the continued enslavement of an entire race.
Using the logic of all these confederates then the "Sons of Nazi Veterans" should have the right to put swastikas on their cars in Germany...after all, Hitler and the Nazi party were a BIG part of German history, (how many people here in the US can name 5 German historical figures of importance without mentioning Hitler? without using Google)
As a black man while I do not like or support anything to do with the Confederates, but this is a free country so if you idolize the Southerners for whatever reason then more power to you, but please ENOUGH with the revisionist history crap. These confeds like to gloss over the slavery issue like it was 'minor' well to black people it was sure as heck not minor!!! So to try to make us look like we are "sensitive" or whatever because we do not like this flag...please, quit with the foolery. Call a spade a spade. If you think your ancestors were in the right to insist of keeping slaves, and willing to die to keep this right, then so be it, but don't expect us to smile and say "yeah you're right, it's no big deal" Because SOME of us dont' forget the past. A wise man once said that those who forget history are condemned to repeat it.
When did you become the spokesman for how all blacks feel on this issue? Anymore than I can be the voice for how all white Southerners feel on the issue?
Revisionist crap? I can say the same thing and back it up from the way many modern history books present it as a righteous crusade to "free the slaves". Or "gloss" over the fact that the slave trade itself was a purely northern commodity. Maybe it is you who needs to spend a bit more time on your history rather than pigeon hole huge issues (which yes, slavery was one for sure) in a morality play.
So far as the Germany thing goes? That is up to the Germans. I DO know though, that it was mostly Southerners who formed up the majority of the armed forces which kicked Nazi philosophy into scattered pieces. Here are two good columns on it (which are sure to outrage those whose minds are already made up):
And finally, there is nothing comparable about the Confederate States of America and Nazi Germany. Just a few differences here:
1. The Nazi policy of genocide for those races/groups deemed "sub-human." This is the most appalling and revolting of any aspect. And nothing remotely was comparable in Southern history.
2. At the time of the WBTS, slavery still existed in the Western world. And it was being struggled with in the same, as a moral question (in the American South as well). Whereas? Those enslaved in Nazi Germany were at a time when it had disappeared from said Western Civilization for almost a century...and then was brought back.
Too? Those enslaved by the Nazi's were literally starved, beaten, and worked to death. Not even the severest critic of slavery as it existed in America alleges such inhumanity was commonplace. Sure, there were sadistic slaveowners, but there were still laws in the Southern states against deliberate mistreatment and slaveowners were obligated by law and common humanitarian/Christian ethics to take care of the sick, injured and old.
3. The Confederate States of America was a constitutional republic like the United States. Nazi Germany was a dictatorship. Free speech, religion, assembly, bearing arms, etc. did not exist in the latter, and in fact, could be punishable by death if deemed to be harmful to the state.
4. Nazi Germany pursued a militaristic and agressive foriegn policy with the intention of world domination. The Confederacy only wanted to be left alone and peacefully pursue its own destiny.
5. The political principles the South fought for were deeply rooted in those set forth in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution (which itself had largely been written by Southerners).
None of those were aimed at the continued enslavement of an entire race.
Did or did not the original United States constitution permit slavery? Was or was not the Republic of Texas a slave-holding nation? (But of course, I realize you don't hold Texas history in much esteem either! )
And also, to go ahead and kill two birds, to address your earlier post quoting a section from the Texas secession document? The document also mentioned reasons for secession as the failure of the federal government to live up to certain terms in the annexation treaty which had nothing to do with slavery at all. Too, of the 11 Confederate states, only four mentioned slavery, and even those four -- as noted about Texas -- listed other reasons as well. So it wasn't so clear cut and dried as some want to make it out to be.
I wonder how many vehicles/persons will be vandalized/assaulted by people in disagreement with the license plate? I'm going with tons! But get over it. It is just a license plate not a burning cross.
This might be a good opportunity to question the purpose of license plates and whether states ought to be in the business of providing license plates as a means of self-expression rather than simply as verification of motor vehicle registration and identification. AFAIK all states offer a variety of customised license plates, but maybe it's time to call a halt. If people must advertise affiliations on their cars, that's what bumper stickers are for (if you must be so tacky and tasteless).
Honoring those who took up arms against the United States, what about al Quieda will they be honoring them too. Secession is Treason and secessionist arte traitors.. The United states needs to withdraw all US Troops and Federal Facilities from Texas, then stop all federal funding
I third this. Exactly. This is only an issue because, mostly, the media decided to make it one. Hells bells...I have a small SCV bumper sticker on my car that is the exact same thing as the logo of which is proposed for being on the license plates (and only if one wants to purchase one, anyway). Here it is (I hope this comes out as a link):
So is that so offensive? It is a logo which incorporates the Battle Flag, and is the one copyrighted by an historical and genaological organization. Nothing more.
One of my closest friends is a black man (we work together as teachers), and his opinion is the same. That is, why all the damn fuss? And I guarandammtee that NOBODY would call this man an Uncle Tom...at least not to his face!
It doesn't matter what the flag was supposed to mean. The swastika was an Indian symbol. That's surely not what it means now.
See above on difference in Confederate and Nazi philosophy.
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I find the whole Confederacy thing ridiculous. You're celebrating a war that was started so that an entire race of people could be kept in slavery.
If find the whole deification of Lincoln ridiculous. He was the one who started the war, anyway.
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That's what the Confederate flag symbolizes, and yet you get upset when people question whether it is appropriate for a state to support that. Of course it's not.
No, that is what it symbolizes to YOU. And if you are addressing me, I don't get upset about it at all. Yes, I find a lot of the historical ignorance out there highly amusing, but hey, symbols mean different things to different people. Regardless though, according to your last sentence logic, then would you say it is inappropriate for the state to continue to fly the Confederate Flag as part of the Six Flags over Texas displays which exist on just about every government building in the state?
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