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Old 06-28-2011, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,815,462 times
Reputation: 12341

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Consumption tax, after we eliminate the IRS and all the BS that comes with that corrupt agency.
Wealth tax?
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Old 06-28-2011, 07:49 AM
 
2,208 posts, read 1,835,880 times
Reputation: 495
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
You haven't explained why the payers are not slaves to the takers.
Slaves are not allowed to move out of the country and thus be "free". Slaves can be literally raped if they do not obey...or raped in order to obey. Slaves can be whipped for no reason...literally whipped.

There is no comparison. You were not bought. You can leave the US at any time and start life in a new country.
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Old 06-28-2011, 07:52 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,001 posts, read 44,813,405 times
Reputation: 13702
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Wealth tax?
Wealth tax punishes financial responsibility, savers, and capital investors. That would be the ideal way to screw up the country even more. Everyone would be on the verge of bankruptcy all the time, and no jobs would be created. Is that really what you want?
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Old 06-28-2011, 07:52 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,396 posts, read 9,442,097 times
Reputation: 4070
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
You haven't explained why the payers are not slaves to the takers.

You shouldn't need to have that explained to you.
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Old 06-28-2011, 07:53 AM
 
13,900 posts, read 9,769,934 times
Reputation: 6856
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
You haven't explained why the payers are not slaves to the takers.
That's not the point. Most people pay taxes in some form. The point is that taxes are not slavery. Saying otherwise would go against reality.
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Old 06-28-2011, 07:54 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,815,462 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Wealth tax punishes financial responsibility, savers, and capital investors. That would be the ideal way to screw up the country even more. Everyone would be on the verge of bankruptcy all the time, and no jobs would be created. Is that really what you want?
The royal screwing of the country began with tax structure favoring those "masters" at the expense of 95-99% of Americans.
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Old 06-28-2011, 08:04 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,001 posts, read 44,813,405 times
Reputation: 13702
Quote:
Originally Posted by calibro1 View Post
Slaves are not allowed to move out of the country and thus be "free". Slaves can be literally raped if they do not obey...or raped in order to obey. Slaves can be whipped for no reason...literally whipped.
Look it up. Collins English Dictionary:

Slave: a person who is forced to work for another against his will.

Those of us who are forced to pay federal income taxes are slaves to the 51% who don't pay but still get federal government services and benefits.
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Old 06-28-2011, 08:06 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,001 posts, read 44,813,405 times
Reputation: 13702
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks View Post
That's not the point. Most people pay taxes in some form. The point is that taxes are not slavery.
Yes, it is slavery when taxes are unequally applied so that some pay and others don't, though ALL receive the benefits paid for by the taxes.
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Old 06-28-2011, 08:06 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,815,462 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Look it up. Collins English Dictionary:

Slave: a person who is forced to work for another against his will.

Those of us who are forced to pay federal income taxes are slaves to the 51% who don't pay but still get federal government services and benefits.
A few questions...
1- Who are these 51% that don't pay any tax to the government(s)?
2- What services and benefits are you speaking of?
3- How do you keep track of such services and benefits?
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Old 06-28-2011, 08:08 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,947,200 times
Reputation: 5661
Krugman wrote about this in January 2011:

Quote:
the real challenge we face is not how to resolve our differences — something that won’t happen any time soon — but how to keep the expression of those differences within bounds.

What are the differences I’m talking about?

One side of American politics considers the modern welfare state — a private-enterprise economy, but one in which society’s winners are taxed to pay for a social safety net — morally superior to the capitalism red in tooth and claw we had before the New Deal. It’s only right, this side believes, for the affluent to help the less fortunate.

The other side believes that people have a right to keep what they earn, and that taxing them to support others, no matter how needy, amounts to theft. That’s what lies behind the modern right’s fondness for violent rhetoric: many activists on the right really do see taxes and regulation as tyrannical impositions on their liberty.

There’s no middle ground between these views. One side saw health reform, with its subsidized extension of coverage to the uninsured, as fulfilling a moral imperative: wealthy nations, it believed, have an obligation to provide all their citizens with essential care. The other side saw the same reform as a moral outrage, an assault on the right of Americans to spend their money as they choose.
If I may add, it's pathetic to consider taxes slavery when so much of what taxes pay for is to foster private enterprise.

The rich should support taxation because it is in their interest to do so. Without providing for the needy, there is risk that the masses will rise up as they did in 18th century France and 19th century Russia. Moreover, the rich take advantage of what government provides.

During the 18th and 19th Centuries, the government built canals because no private enterprise would. These canals facilitated the movement of goods throughout the populace and was a vast improvement in productivity. The same was true for the interstate highway system.

Also, having the government make rules and test pharmaceuticals, food and car seats means that I do not need to become an expert in these areas and my productivity rises.

According to some fascinating new economic research, Is Employer-Based Health Insurance A Barrier To Entrepreneurship?, there's an unexpectedly large numbers of Americans becoming entrepreneurs within months of qualifying for Medicare (over and above those you would expect to become entrepreneurs because they were fired, forcibly retired, etc.) The reason: They now have the security of healthcare, so they can take the risk of starting private companies. It's just one of the MANY, MANY ways in which a vigorous public and private sector support each other to create a successful economy that can't occur when there's only one or the other.

Recently, a massive survey of global entrepreneurship identified the number #1 nation for entrepreneurial climate as... get this: DENMARK, which has massive public expenditures for education and health.

What this proves is that modern capitalism cannot exist without government -- which needs taxes. Modern capitalism needs educated workers, a monetary system, a safe and efficient transportation system, a fair legal system, etc. None of those are possible without government.

One is not an island.

What those who contend that taxes are theft is that they want the benefits (education, police, etc.) but don't want to pay for others. In other words, they're greedy.
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