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Old 07-09-2011, 09:26 AM
 
39,534 posts, read 40,866,506 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
So you determined all of the other jurors were of "reasonable intelligence" after deliberating with them for 30 minutes over lunch. Your account is a perfect example of why jurors should become a profession with a tailored education.
I have to deal with new people on a daily basis, for me it's not that hard to gain a reasonable estimate of someones capabilities based on their speech and actions and I'm rarely wrong. Perhaps that might not be the case for everyone, I don't like to flaunt it but I have very high comprehension level. Over a 4 day period it's much more than 30 minutes, you're not prevented from socializing with other jurors prior to deliberations as long as you don't discuss anything about the case.


Quote:
When jurors are lazy or unable to do this, they often just say, "lets be safe and say not guilty and lets all go home."
In our case we were complemented by both the Judge and lawyers on both sides after the case was over for being one of the most attentive juries they dealt with. There wasn't a single person on that jury shirking their responsibilities.
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Old 07-09-2011, 09:30 AM
 
15,723 posts, read 9,660,660 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
Interesting that you were not selected to be on a jury because you have a legal background which would help you better understand the law.
Lawyers, law enforcement, or people who have any relation to someone in those fields (like the wife of a cop), etc. are very often excused or exempt from the jury pool during Voir Dire.

Having legal/criminal education allows you to see behind the smoke and mirrors so to speak. They can understand what type of manipulation the attorneys are doing to gain a certain verdict and can influence the jury based on their legal knowledge. Jurors are only supposed to base their decision on the evidence, not on how the attorneys work the case. Hence why anyone affiliated with the legal system often gets excused.

I certainly don't see a problem with a more educated juror base. A jury of your peers is not a Constitutional requirement. I do agree there is probably too much corruption risk with paid, professional juries though.
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Old 07-09-2011, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Midwest
31,438 posts, read 19,664,020 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
I have to deal with new people on a daily basis, for me it's not that hard to gain a reasonable estimate of someones capabilities based on their speech and actions and I'm rarely wrong. Perhaps that might not be the case for everyone, I don't like to flaunt it but I have very high comprehension level. Over a 4 day period it's much more than 30 minutes, you're not prevented from socializing with other jurors prior to deliberations as long as you don't discuss anything about the case.


In our case we were complemented by both the Judge and lawyers on both sides after the case was over for being one of the most attentive juries they dealt with. There wasn't a single person on that jury shirking their responsibilities.
That might be so. However, I am guessing that the evidence, in the trial you served as juror on, was an obvious smoking gun.

So many cases do not have a smoking gun, therefore the circumstances require careful analysis of scientific and statistical evidence and how this meshes with the laws concerning the offense. Your average "joe-six-pack" is not able to do that.
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Old 07-09-2011, 09:34 AM
 
39,534 posts, read 40,866,506 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
Interesting that you were not selected to be on a jury because you have a legal background which would help you better understand the law.
The one juror on our case was with the State Police and his specialty was accident reconstruction. The case involved an accident. He didn't mention this until after we had made our decision, after the decision he also pointed out some other things not brought up during the testimony which certainly would have changed any lingering doubts others might have had.
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Old 07-09-2011, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Midwest
31,438 posts, read 19,664,020 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
The one juror on our case was with the State Police and his specialty was accident reconstruction. The case involved an accident. He didn't mention this until after we had made our decision, after the decision he also pointed out some other things not brought up during the testimony which certainly would have changed any lingering doubts others might have had.
This is an great example of how education in evidence, etc.... of jurors is beneficial for an accurate verdict.
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Old 07-09-2011, 10:05 AM
 
Location: California
11,436 posts, read 17,166,596 times
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Default Should a jury become a profession rather than "peers?"

In my opinion it's a bad idea, the same people trial after trial will begin to think they know more than the judge, Jury duty shouldn't be a job.

As far as professionals and highly educated people on juries I've noticed they tend to look down on people, they don't weigh the evidence but form their own opinion because their life cannot relate to the people on trial.

Truthfully you do want people who can relate to you on a jury if you’re on trial for something.
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Old 07-09-2011, 10:05 AM
 
39,534 posts, read 40,866,506 times
Reputation: 16322
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
This is an great example of how education in evidence, etc.... of jurors is beneficial for an accurate verdict.
Not really because you're supposed to be basing it on the evidence introduced, some of the things he was pointing out were not part of the trial which brings up another very good point. How do you prevent professional jurors from presenting their own evidence in the jury room?

Let me give you another example, I personally drove through this intersection where the accident took place on a daily basis. Even if the evidence could have shown guilt the primary cause of this accident would have been the intersection itself, IMO ultimately DOT was really responsible regardless on the parties involved. This was never presented at the trial so I couldn't bring that to the jury room and to be fair like the police officer I didn't mention it until after the decision was rendered.
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Old 07-09-2011, 10:11 AM
 
14,253 posts, read 15,352,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roaddog View Post
In my opinion it's a bad idea, the same people trial after trial will begin to think they know more than the judge, Jury duty shouldn't be a job.

As far as professionals and highly educated people on juries I've noticed they tend to look down on people, they don't weigh the evidence but form their own opinion because their life cannot relate to the people on trial.

Truthfully you do want people who can relate to you on a jury if you’re on trial for something.
I don't see how you can do that. For example, would you have a jury of drug users and dealers in a drug related case?
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Old 07-09-2011, 10:16 AM
 
Location: OCEAN BREEZES AND VIEWS SAN CLEMENTE
19,899 posts, read 15,915,071 times
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The jury has spoken, and i have to accept the decision, if i disagree or not, because i am a mature adult. I am not happy with this decision, based on what i saw of the evidence they had to look at, and the case file, it was huge. Based on the interviews i saw, and i watched at least 5 of them, both the defense and the Prosecutors, stated, that real cases such as this, are not based on fake tv series, but real cases, are much more intense and not CSI like.

Eleven hours in a case as this, to me they alerady had their minds made up, when they went into that jury room. Too much evidence they did not bother to look at, or ask any important questions. I feel we need to take something away after this verdict, and learn by it. The comments the women juror stated, to me, i have a hard time beleiving she really understood all the evidence. She could have been convicted also on a much lesser charge, then that of the death penality, did not jury not understand that, i think they did, i think they had their answers, before even stepping into that deliberation room.
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Old 07-09-2011, 10:23 AM
 
Location: California
11,436 posts, read 17,166,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggy001 View Post
I don't see how you can do that. For example, would you have a jury of drug users and dealers in a drug related case?
They don't have to be drug users or such but they need to be able to relate to that. I'm not a drug user but I know some and I have taken drugs so I can relate to their circumstances. That’s what makes up a good jury.

I've served on quite a few criminal trials and have been shocked about how people who can't relate to the charges become so judgmental and will convict someone on their feelings of the crime instead of the evidence.
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