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Old 07-19-2011, 04:10 AM
 
Location: western East Roman Empire
9,357 posts, read 14,297,668 times
Reputation: 10080

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Quote:
Originally Posted by emilybh View Post
...seems our Military's main objective has been switched from protecting our freedom to protecting certain Corporatists economic interests and the wars they've been waging aren't exactly fair. [/url]
There was never a time in US history, or human history, when the military's main objective was to protect the freedom of a population at large.

There was never a time in US history, or human history, when the military's main objective was not protecting special economic interests.

There was never a time in US history, or human history, when waging war was "fair".

Where is the evidence that life is "fair" from the human point of view?

To be sure, there may have been a time when the US at least appeared to be exceptional in world history, but what is happening now is that the veneer of propaganda is fading more and more for at least a portion of the population, perhaps growing, but still small and probably containable.

If you have the power to shape the social environment, even in cooperation with others, then do so. If not, then use what power you have to deal with it as is and to shape your own attitude.

Good Luck!
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Old 07-19-2011, 10:00 AM
 
15,060 posts, read 8,622,286 times
Reputation: 7413
Quote:
Originally Posted by emilybh View Post
It is SO SAD and SUCH a WASTE! IMAGINE, 51 cents of every federal tax dollar goes to pay for this killing and destruction of other countries. Other countries that we invade like this are 100% justified in hating this country. I just wish they knew that WE THE PEOPLE are mostly clueless and aren't even aware it is going on. It is our leaders who are culpable.

I applaud your efforts here ... as you are always trying to bring important matters to attention on numerous issues

This past weekend I was working an event in which there was a Texas National Guard recruiter with an entire display setup ... camo tent, free hats, tee shirts etc. And I talked to this guy for several hours ... and he was very well informed on many issues ... but still, he was totally off the mark on others.

One example ..... he told me how the media has distorted Iraq, and the alleged WMD's that everyone thinks were never found. He claimed they were found (guys he knew that were there, told him so) and the news was just covered up, because they (the troops) had been attacked with those WMDs. Of course, the reality is, even the Bush administration admitted that no WMDs were found ... and of course they had every incentive to not admit that, and would have used any evidence of them, no matter how insignificant, to justify the Iraqi invasion on those initial grounds.

The point is, the "lie" is different at every level ... the public recieves one set of lies ... the troops, another ... fashioned for the target audience, to facilitate the goals.

The hard cold reality is that one of the biggest "facilitators" of this is the psychological manipulation employed on the public to "support the troops". You don't need to agree with the politicians and the leadership's decisions to go to war ... but once our young men and women are in harms way .. the required patriotic duty is to support their efforts.

And this is a very difficult position to grapple with. We have many fine young people being put in difficult circumstances ... and the public's apathy in holding our elected officials to account contributes to this terrible situation. However, that public support tends to reinforce the propaganda fed these young people regarding the valuable service they are providing to America. So it's really that proverbial "rock and a hard place" here.

This situation, coupled with a significant contingent of soldiers who are committing egregious acts of violence against innocents as depicted in the video posted ... requires a new philosophical and psychological approach to be taken by the public to do what we SHOULD be doing ... demanding an end to this outrageous behavior on the part of our leaders, civilian and military, as well as engaging a measure of tough love with regard to the soldiers ... many of whom have only public outrage and demands to end these wars as their only hope of coming home to a normal life.

That means, withdrawing this psychologically manipulated "support the troops". We can only truly support the troops by demanding an end to these wars of aggression ... fervently punishing those who commit atrocities, and stop molly coddling the other troops .... because, even though these are just kids ... they are kids with weapons and tanks and jets and bombs .... and this American military is comprised of an "all volunteer" force. There are no "draftees" as was the case in Vietnam, sent to war against their will. These "Kids" all joined the military by their own choosing ... and they are accountable for their own situations too.

And we have many of these young people speaking out against the wars ... refusing to deploy for second or third tours ... what do we do? We call them cowards ... instead of supporting them ... while we support those who are willing to do the killing.

What we are telling these young people is ... "we expect you to be patriotic killers ... and we will turn our backs on those who choose to be conscientious objectors.

We've got the entire situation backwards ... and we need to get our collective heads screwed on straight.
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Old 07-19-2011, 11:41 AM
 
1,081 posts, read 915,786 times
Reputation: 551
Well thanks for the monthly check, job preference, health care...you get the idea. Now I must run, I'm late for my sadist encounter group meeting haha
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Old 07-19-2011, 11:47 AM
 
Location: SC
9,101 posts, read 16,449,841 times
Reputation: 3620
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Major General Smedley Butler, USMC said as much back in 1933:

War Is a Racket - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Good find on that quote !
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Old 07-19-2011, 11:56 AM
 
Location: SC
9,101 posts, read 16,449,841 times
Reputation: 3620
Quote:
Originally Posted by odanny View Post
We fight wars because it makes so many people rich. It's that simple. The reason so many soldiers have PTSD is because they see through these lies that justify war and they feel sorrow and shame for their roles in these atrocities that war brings, because, at its very core, war is an atrocity.

A war without end is the best possible outcome for those profiting. And we have that whenever we invade another country, so for them it's win-win, for the military and the U.S., it's lose-lose.
So true! It is sad but true. Isn't it time we did something about it considering our troops lives and health is at stake not to mention the costs!?!
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Old 07-19-2011, 12:13 PM
 
Location: SC
9,101 posts, read 16,449,841 times
Reputation: 3620
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
I applaud your efforts here ... as you are always trying to bring important matters to attention on numerous issues

This past weekend I was working an event in which there was a Texas National Guard recruiter with an entire display setup ... camo tent, free hats, tee shirts etc. And I talked to this guy for several hours ... and he was very well informed on many issues ... but still, he was totally off the mark on others.

One example ..... he told me how the media has distorted Iraq, and the alleged WMD's that everyone thinks were never found. He claimed they were found (guys he knew that were there, told him so) and the news was just covered up, because they (the troops) had been attacked with those WMDs. Of course, the reality is, even the Bush administration admitted that no WMDs were found ... and of course they had every incentive to not admit that, and would have used any evidence of them, no matter how insignificant, to justify the Iraqi invasion on those initial grounds.

The point is, the "lie" is different at every level ... the public recieves one set of lies ... the troops, another ... fashioned for the target audience, to facilitate the goals.

The hard cold reality is that one of the biggest "facilitators" of this is the psychological manipulation employed on the public to "support the troops". You don't need to agree with the politicians and the leadership's decisions to go to war ... but once our young men and women are in harms way .. the required patriotic duty is to support their efforts.

And this is a very difficult position to grapple with. We have many fine young people being put in difficult circumstances ... and the public's apathy in holding our elected officials to account contributes to this terrible situation. However, that public support tends to reinforce the propaganda fed these young people regarding the valuable service they are providing to America. So it's really that proverbial "rock and a hard place" here.

This situation, coupled with a significant contingent of soldiers who are committing egregious acts of violence against innocents as depicted in the video posted ... requires a new philosophical and psychological approach to be taken by the public to do what we SHOULD be doing ... demanding an end to this outrageous behavior on the part of our leaders, civilian and military, as well as engaging a measure of tough love with regard to the soldiers ... many of whom have only public outrage and demands to end these wars as their only hope of coming home to a normal life.

That means, withdrawing this psychologically manipulated "support the troops". We can only truly support the troops by demanding an end to these wars of aggression ... fervently punishing those who commit atrocities, and stop molly coddling the other troops .... because, even though these are just kids ... they are kids with weapons and tanks and jets and bombs .... and this American military is comprised of an "all volunteer" force. There are no "draftees" as was the case in Vietnam, sent to war against their will. These "Kids" all joined the military by their own choosing ... and they are accountable for their own situations too.

And we have many of these young people speaking out against the wars ... refusing to deploy for second or third tours ... what do we do? We call them cowards ... instead of supporting them ... while we support those who are willing to do the killing.

What we are telling these young people is ... "we expect you to be patriotic killers ... and we will turn our backs on those who choose to be conscientious objectors.

We've got the entire situation backwards ... and we need to get our collective heads screwed on straight.
It's true! Some who volunteer are totally clueless and think they are doing a noble thing joining up to "protect our freedom" when perhaps with the exception of Afghanistan which hasn't been done in ages.

In fact your story reminds me of a 39 year old male caller into a right wing talk radio show that said the host was responsible for changing his life and announced that at his age he just had signed up to join the Army to "protect our freedom". I couldn't believe my ears! This guy really thought our country was still free and that the wars we are fighting were just?

All the other wars recently have done more to jeopardize our freedom by getting other countries rightfully mad at us while our president sends drones with bombs and more troops over... to Libya for example to kill their civilians. Of course in Libya they are calling it a "humanitarian effort" and the troops being sent over aren't being called that, they are being called "diplomats". Come on! The next thing you know they'll be telling us the sky isn't blue, it is red. it Prospective soldiers need to WAKE UP!
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Old 07-19-2011, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,687,243 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Major General Smedley Butler, USMC said as much back in 1933:

War Is a Racket - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
General Butler also accused Prescott Bush of organizing a Facist pro Hitler Coup to overthrow the elected goverment backed by Big Business
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Old 07-19-2011, 12:45 PM
 
15,060 posts, read 8,622,286 times
Reputation: 7413
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
General Butler also accused Prescott Bush of organizing a Facist pro Hitler Coup to overthrow the elected goverment backed by Big Business
And the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree ... does it?


‪George Bush New World Order‬‏ - YouTube
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Old 07-19-2011, 12:56 PM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,479 posts, read 59,756,720 times
Reputation: 24863
I feel some guilt about being in the Mekong Delta in '66 but I do not feel guilty about what I did to keep me and my buddies alive.

WAR is a very bad joke played on everybody for the sake of the few. We need to just leave the entire Midle East to its own fate and tell the western petroleum monopoies to stuff it. So long as the oil flows I could care less who makes the profit.
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Old 07-19-2011, 01:20 PM
 
Location: SC
9,101 posts, read 16,449,841 times
Reputation: 3620
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
And the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree ... does it?


‪George Bush New World Order‬‏ - YouTube

No it certainly doesn't.

I remember watching that news broadcast. The mentioning of "world peace" makes it sound good. Little did I know then that it would mean more wars and loss of sovereignty and continued lowering of our standard of living and loss of our FREEDOM!
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