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Old 08-02-2011, 10:35 PM
 
4,510 posts, read 4,117,337 times
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The Debt Crisis Is A Trojan Horse To Cause The Fall of America


"A sovereign nation can always find the money to pay debts owed in its own currency. The U.S. could, if it wished, pay its bills using debt-free U.S. Notes or Greenbacks, just as President Lincoln did to avoid a crippling debt during the Civil War. Alternatively, it could eliminate the deficit with Ron Paul's plan, which amounts to the same thing." - Ellen Brown, "Forget Compromise: The Debt Ceiling Is Unconstitutional."

Behind all the flim-flammery of this manufactured "crisis," we are watching the creation of a new form of government -- or rather, the further mutation of the new form of government that the United States has been crawling toward for a long time. We called it a "neo-feudal oligarchy backed by a militarist police state" here the other day. No doubt there are many other ways you could describe this murderous, ravenous, lopsided monstrosity of a system. But the one thing you cannot call it is a "republic." - Chris Floyd, "If the Republic Had Not Died A Long Time Ago, This Would Indeed Be the Death of the Republic (Reprise)."


"Well, we are reportedly 48 hours out from a total default on the debt to the foreign governments and private Federal Reserve that have taken over this country through economic fraud, and have engaged in a conquest that the British Empire couldn't succeed in, that Hitler couldn't succeed in, that the Soviets couldn't succeed at. They have conquered us through fraud by stealth. But, the moment you become aware of the private banking cartel's global government that they're publicly admitting now they're setting up, that you'll pay your VAT taxes to, your carbon taxes, and the rest of it - the minute you're aware of it then their power begins to wane.


That's why the banksters are setting up a homeland security control grid in every country they're in under international agreements and rules to crackdown and go after anybody that criticizes the private central banks running those nations. When you get the internal training manuals from England to Australia, from Germany to Canada, to the United States, it is the same thing. The public is told, "Give your rights up because al-Qaeda is hiding underneath every table," but when you get the actual manuals its people that don't want to give up their sovereignty to the global government." - Alex Jones, "The Debt Crisis: Banksters, Thugs and Crooks," from 04:42 to 06:04.
"They are slaves who dare not be in the right with two or three." - James Russell Lowell
The long transformation of America from a relatively free society into a full-fledged, technocratic police state is now complete.
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Old 08-03-2011, 12:14 AM
 
1,850 posts, read 1,102,790 times
Reputation: 1559
Quote:
Originally Posted by KRAMERCAT View Post
The Debt Crisis Is A Trojan Horse To Cause The Fall of America

"A sovereign nation can always find the money to pay debts owed in its own currency. The U.S. could, if it wished, pay its bills using debt-free U.S. Notes or Greenbacks, just as President Lincoln did to avoid a crippling debt during the Civil War. Alternatively, it could eliminate the deficit with Ron Paul's plan, which amounts to the same thing." - Ellen Brown, "Forget Compromise: The Debt Ceiling Is Unconstitutional."

Behind all the flim-flammery of this manufactured "crisis," we are watching the creation of a new form of government -- or rather, the further mutation of the new form of government that the United States has been crawling toward for a long time. We called it a "neo-feudal oligarchy backed by a militarist police state" here the other day. No doubt there are many other ways you could describe this murderous, ravenous, lopsided monstrosity of a system. But the one thing you cannot call it is a "republic." - Chris Floyd, "If the Republic Had Not Died A Long Time Ago, This Would Indeed Be the Death of the Republic (Reprise)."


"Well, we are reportedly 48 hours out from a total default on the debt to the foreign governments and private Federal Reserve that have taken over this country through economic fraud, and have engaged in a conquest that the British Empire couldn't succeed in, that Hitler couldn't succeed in, that the Soviets couldn't succeed at. They have conquered us through fraud by stealth. But, the moment you become aware of the private banking cartel's global government that they're publicly admitting now they're setting up, that you'll pay your VAT taxes to, your carbon taxes, and the rest of it - the minute you're aware of it then their power begins to wane.


That's why the banksters are setting up a homeland security control grid in every country they're in under international agreements and rules to crackdown and go after anybody that criticizes the private central banks running those nations. When you get the internal training manuals from England to Australia, from Germany to Canada, to the United States, it is the same thing. The public is told, "Give your rights up because al-Qaeda is hiding underneath every table," but when you get the actual manuals its people that don't want to give up their sovereignty to the global government." - Alex Jones, "The Debt Crisis: Banksters, Thugs and Crooks," from 04:42 to 06:04.
"They are slaves who dare not be in the right with two or three." - James Russell Lowell
The long transformation of America from a relatively free society into a full-fledged, technocratic police state is now complete.
...okay dude, time to push away from the computer, get out of the 'rents basement and get some fresh air....you're losin' it...
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Old 08-03-2011, 12:16 AM
 
Location: In this horrid OBOMINATION
321 posts, read 315,841 times
Reputation: 154
Notsureifserious.jpeg
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Old 08-03-2011, 12:19 AM
 
954 posts, read 1,122,625 times
Reputation: 382
http://digital-lifestyles.info/copy_images/web-conspiracy-lg1.jpg (broken link)
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Old 08-03-2011, 12:20 AM
 
Location: California
30,707 posts, read 33,507,042 times
Reputation: 26137
Isn't there already an "End Of America As We Know It" thread?
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Old 08-03-2011, 12:22 AM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
6,801 posts, read 7,372,937 times
Reputation: 2960
Never give up hope, I hear more people talking about monetary reform and the fed every day.
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Old 08-03-2011, 09:19 PM
 
4,510 posts, read 4,117,337 times
Reputation: 1501
Quote:
Originally Posted by hilgi View Post
Never give up hope, I hear more people talking about monetary reform and the fed every day.
The reason I keep posting these threads is the hope that a majority of Americans will see the Fed's control of our government for what it is, and then vote for a Ron Paul or Dennis Kucinich - knowledge is the only transforming power - ignorance leads people to vote for the likes of G W Bush.
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Old 08-03-2011, 10:06 PM
 
Location: Exeter, NH
5,302 posts, read 4,407,021 times
Reputation: 5705
Quote:
Originally Posted by justus978 View Post
...okay dude, time to push away from the computer, get out of the 'rents basement and get some fresh air....you're losin' it...
Is there ANY liberal response to the real issues facing our nation, other than name-calling and personal insults?

Do they actually approve of devaluing our currency to nothing, while allowing the government to spend until financial collapse and borrow so much that even at 100% taxation we soon won't even be able to even meet the interest payments? Do they really think our nation will survive even a few more years, with government a government as large as 1/2 the entire economy confiscating more and more from a working class that has less and less as prices and cost of living explodes? Do they really think the massive government is helping America's economy by sending so much money overseas in debt payments and endless foreign wars, when the working class who earned the money would have otherwise spent it HERE and helped their local economies? Do they approve of a Big Daddy government licensing, micro-managing and taxing every action a citizen might want to make--from adding a porch on your home to going fishing in the ocean to driving your own boat around a lake that existed long before government sought to tax everyone who might want to enjoy it?

It seems like if the C-D moderators simply deleted every response that consisted solely of name-calling and insults, there would be nothing but the voice of Libertarians and fiscal conservative Americans saying Government is far too large, and is now both destructive to freedom and the economy--far in excess of the small benefit a sanely-sized government might convey.

And while we might all like the idea of a "safety net," the reality today is that Big Government ONLY serves the interests of Big Business, and does so by taxing the working classes to an extent that they would be far better without it. By using the Mafia model of throwing out pennies to children, while using force to extort thousands of dollars, liberals think Government is necessary and good. In reality it is a cancer that grows until the host is dead.

But government can't simply provide services and be frugal. It always grows, and grabs power--taking it away from citizens. It has now grown to a size where it has destroyed the economy with taxation, and sent our jobs and economic engine overseas--never to return. Consequently, all those wonderful "safety net" programs will have to end in the next 5 years, thanks to fiscal mismanagement of epic proportions. The future is all the costs of massive Government, plus all the debt from government overspending, but no money left for anyone to feed off government in the future. It was inevitable.

Liberals won't face that the Social Security Trust Fund--all $2.6 trillion--is not in dollars or investments or assets, since it was spent long ago. The SS Trust Fund is full of "non-negotiable securities" that are nothing more than promises to raise future taxes. And how can that happen, when we are already taxed to the maximum possible just to pay for government TODAY--with more trillions added yearly to the federal debt of over $14.7 trillion? And that doesn't include all the unfunded obligations of the federal government, nor of the equally insane amount due to state and local promises.

Big Government is incredibly costly and Washington will now spend every day finding new ways to raise taxes, and place new ones. The promises to my generation, the ones we lost huge portions of our incomes in taxes to pay for, cannot be kept no matter how much government wants to. There's simply no more income in the working class to confiscate for our retirement.

Social Security was a Ponzi Scam to start with, and when the designers placed new taxes on Americans in return for future promises, we were already doomed. I can see why early Baby Boomers, who won the Ponzi Scam lottery and paid far few taxes, while actually GETTING money from the government, think Big Government is a good idea.

But for anyone born in 1960 or later, as I was, we are suckers at the bottom of the Ponzi Scams, and we pay for everyone else's retirement and "safety net," while ending up with absolutely nothing in return for a lifetime of working 80 hours a week. I guess in human history, we're the much more common situation: a slave class that was brainwashed into a life of workaholism by the false promises of being able to "get ahead" in the end.

I hope all the Americans who will lose everything in the coming crash know who to blame, and that the Big Government and Big Business fatcats who destroyed our nation cannot use the wealth they stole to keep justice from finding them.
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Old 08-04-2011, 07:46 PM
 
4,510 posts, read 4,117,337 times
Reputation: 1501
Quote:
Originally Posted by NHartphotog View Post
Is there ANY liberal response to the real issues facing our nation, other than name-calling and personal insults?

Do they actually approve of devaluing our currency to nothing, while allowing the government to spend until financial collapse and borrow so much that even at 100% taxation we soon won't even be able to even meet the interest payments? Do they really think our nation will survive even a few more years, with government a government as large as 1/2 the entire economy confiscating more and more from a working class that has less and less as prices and cost of living explodes? Do they really think the massive government is helping America's economy by sending so much money overseas in debt payments and endless foreign wars, when the working class who earned the money would have otherwise spent it HERE and helped their local economies? Do they approve of a Big Daddy government licensing, micro-managing and taxing every action a citizen might want to make--from adding a porch on your home to going fishing in the ocean to driving your own boat around a lake that existed long before government sought to tax everyone who might want to enjoy it?

It seems like if the C-D moderators simply deleted every response that consisted solely of name-calling and insults, there would be nothing but the voice of Libertarians and fiscal conservative Americans saying Government is far too large, and is now both destructive to freedom and the economy--far in excess of the small benefit a sanely-sized government might convey.

And while we might all like the idea of a "safety net," the reality today is that Big Government ONLY serves the interests of Big Business, and does so by taxing the working classes to an extent that they would be far better without it. By using the Mafia model of throwing out pennies to children, while using force to extort thousands of dollars, liberals think Government is necessary and good. In reality it is a cancer that grows until the host is dead.

But government can't simply provide services and be frugal. It always grows, and grabs power--taking it away from citizens. It has now grown to a size where it has destroyed the economy with taxation, and sent our jobs and economic engine overseas--never to return. Consequently, all those wonderful "safety net" programs will have to end in the next 5 years, thanks to fiscal mismanagement of epic proportions. The future is all the costs of massive Government, plus all the debt from government overspending, but no money left for anyone to feed off government in the future. It was inevitable.

Liberals won't face that the Social Security Trust Fund--all $2.6 trillion--is not in dollars or investments or assets, since it was spent long ago. The SS Trust Fund is full of "non-negotiable securities" that are nothing more than promises to raise future taxes. And how can that happen, when we are already taxed to the maximum possible just to pay for government TODAY--with more trillions added yearly to the federal debt of over $14.7 trillion? And that doesn't include all the unfunded obligations of the federal government, nor of the equally insane amount due to state and local promises.

Big Government is incredibly costly and Washington will now spend every day finding new ways to raise taxes, and place new ones. The promises to my generation, the ones we lost huge portions of our incomes in taxes to pay for, cannot be kept no matter how much government wants to. There's simply no more income in the working class to confiscate for our retirement.

Social Security was a Ponzi Scam to start with, and when the designers placed new taxes on Americans in return for future promises, we were already doomed. I can see why early Baby Boomers, who won the Ponzi Scam lottery and paid far few taxes, while actually GETTING money from the government, think Big Government is a good idea.

But for anyone born in 1960 or later, as I was, we are suckers at the bottom of the Ponzi Scams, and we pay for everyone else's retirement and "safety net," while ending up with absolutely nothing in return for a lifetime of working 80 hours a week. I guess in human history, we're the much more common situation: a slave class that was brainwashed into a life of workaholism by the false promises of being able to "get ahead" in the end.

I hope all the Americans who will lose everything in the coming crash know who to blame, and that the Big Government and Big Business fatcats who destroyed our nation cannot use the wealth they stole to keep justice from finding them.

Social Security is not a Ponzi scheme - it is a deferred annuity, paid for by the recipients of the annuity. The tax dollars put forth by the Boomers is proportionally the same as the money put forth by current taxpayers. If anything, it was more, in inflation adjusted dollars. The money we put in is OUR money. I would gladly forgo SS benefits if I could get ALL of the money I put into it, along with an averaged interest for the years I put in.
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Old 08-04-2011, 08:46 PM
 
Location: Exeter, NH
5,302 posts, read 4,407,021 times
Reputation: 5705
Quote:
Originally Posted by KRAMERCAT View Post
Social Security is not a Ponzi scheme - it is a deferred annuity, paid for by the recipients of the annuity. The tax dollars put forth by the Boomers is proportionally the same as the money put forth by current taxpayers. If anything, it was more, in inflation adjusted dollars. The money we put in is OUR money. I would gladly forgo SS benefits if I could get ALL of the money I put into it, along with an averaged interest for the years I put in.
An annuity is a contract with an insurance company, which invests money today and gives you a guaranteed return. Washington does not invest the money, and never has. It spends it, and replaces the money with an IOU to the "lockbox" Trust Fund, which is non-negotiable and has absolutely no value, other than as a promise to raise taxes in the future. Washington also has NO legal obligation to give you ANYTHING back for your tax dollars. Nothing like an annuity.

Social Security rates were increased dramatically in 1983, to "fix" the problem of the Baby Boom retiring. Everyone who paid SS taxes before that time paid a much lower rate. Consequently, anyone who is now 50 will have paid the new, higher SS rates their whole professional working lives, as I did--graduating college in 1983. This is also the group that don't get to collect SS until age 67, being born after 1960. So this group pays the most, and gets the least--even if SS could pay the benefits promised to us, which it can't.

SS is a Ponzi Scam because nothing is invested, and the money from new people coming into the system is used to pay those at the top. It is bound to collapse as the number of new people required to pay for their successors must increase exponentially to keep the scam running. In 1940, there were 42 workers per retiree. Today, a little over 3 workers support each retiree, and there is not enough money generated by SS taxes to pay for current obligations. By 2035, only 2.1 workers will support each retiree. And those demographic trends don't even consider all the structural unemployment in our new economy, or the fact that workers get paid less and less every year.

Social Security now rely on subsidy from the rest of the federal government, which is bankrupt and deeply in debt. There is no actual SS Trust Fund to tap, despite politicians ignoring the problem in the hopes of pushing reform to future politicians: "These [Trust Fund] balances are available to finance future benefit payments and other Trust Fund expenditures but only in a bookkeeping sense.... They do not consist of real economic assets that can be drawn down in the future to fund benefits. Instead, they are claims on the Treasury that, when redeemed, will have to be financed by raising taxes, borrowing from the public, or reducing benefits or other expenditures." (from FY 2000 Budget, Analytical Perspectives, p. 337)

I agree that you (and I) paid dearly for Social Security benefits. The problem is because our corrupt politicians spent the money, instead of investing it on our behalf, there is no money to pay for our retirements--or to pay us back even what was confiscated. The only money government has, is money confiscated from taxpayers. And with the foolish overspending of government, and huge debts racked up, future taxpayers will already be taxed to death just to pay for past government mistakes.

It's sad, it's sick, it's theft of the worst kind, and it's a good lesson: NEVER, NEVER, NEVER trust government to handle your money, or tax you now for a promise of the future. You'd have a better chance getting your money back from Bernie Madoff.
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