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Very few people are able to follow Jesus. It's a tough act to follow. I can count the number of people in my hand who I have known who have tried to emulate Jesus.
Unless you're a "theologian", yours is simply the "interpretation" of one (pseudo) "christian". And you obviously know even less about "liberals" (especially since by your own rules, you're obviously not one and therefore incapable of "interpreting" them).
But no matter how one tries to spin it, Christ reserved his strongest condemnation, not for the prostitute or the thief, but for the Pharisees, "you also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness" (Mat 23:28 )
Which perfectly describes Perry.
phar·i·see Noun/ˈfarəsē/ 1. A member of an ancient Jewish sect, distinguished by strict observance of the traditional and written law, and commonly held to have pretensions to superior sanctity. 2. A self-righteous person; a hypocrite.
That is not my interpretation- it is that of our priest. I think he knows a little bit more about the Bible than you, so I will accept his interpretation. We had that very passage as the homily for a mass last month. Thank you, however, for your attempt to explain that passage to me. I am touched by your sincerity and concern.
I find that it is interesting that you think I am not a Christian. I don't care what you think. However, given that most liberals ARE ATHEISTS, why are you and other liberals so obsessed with the Bible? Are you just carrying out your liberal marching orders, as instructed by the Franfurt School, and attacking all and everything Christian?
That is not my interpretation- it is that of our priest. I think he knows a little bit more about the Bible than you, so I will accept his interpretation. We had that very passage as the homily for a mass last month. Thank you, however, for your attempt to explain that passage to me. I am touched by your sincerity and concern.
It is a pretty standard interpretation as well, at least through all the congregations I have known it is exactly the same message.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009
I find that it is interesting that you think I am not a Christian. I don't care what you think. However, given that most liberals ARE ATHEISTS, why are you and other liberals so obsessed with the Bible? Are you just carrying out your liberal marching orders, as instructed by the Franfurt School, and attacking all and everything Christian?
You know why, but you also know that wasting breath arguing with such is foolish.
I see once again the novices are trying to handle christian scripture and bend it to some political perspective.
First the passage is found in Mathew 6 not 5.
But let us consider several things together.
First, Yes Jesus did state as has been quoted. Don’t pray like the hypocrites who love to be seen when they pray. Instead pray in private…. But let’s see what the hypocrite prayed that led Jesus to make the statement. “That they may have glory of men”. Jesus was addressing this attitude. Not the concept of people praying corporately in the open.
In Luke 18 Jesus teaches a parable. He says that two men went to pray. One a Pharisee the other a publican. The Pharisee prayed aloud thanking God that he was not a sinner and boasting of his prayer life and fasting. The Publican simply asked God to forgive him for his sin. Jesus states the sinner was justified not the Pharisee who boasted.
This passage in Luke is instructive as to what Jesus meant in Mathew 6.
It is not the idea of calling for corporate prayer that was rejected by Jesus. It was the idea of a man standing before the public and issuing a statement to God on how good a man he is.
Jesus prayed in public. In fact his instruction to his followers on HOW to pray was a prayer he prayed before them.
The old testament is a “type and shadow of things to come” and the OT is replete with leaders calling for solemn assemblies where the whole nation would come together and pray.
We have in the first and second chapter of Acts multiple prayer meetings of the faithful where they prayed together. In Acts 2, the meeting became so boisterous that it drew a crowd of thousands who heard these men and women praying aloud.
That prayer meeting spilled out into the street and ended with Peter preaching and as many as 5000 people right on the streets of Jerusalem responded in prayer.
We find other instances in Acts where the Apostles prayed openly. In Samaria they laid hands on many to receive the Holy Ghost. This was done in public.
One cannot use the passage in Mathew 6 to suggest that prayer should be done in private. The passage and the instruction of Jesus is that we approach God with all humility. Prayer is not a time to boast pridefully of one’s own great “Christian faith”.
Did Rick Perry stand before the crowd and pray “God I am thankful that I am not like these sinners?” Has he ever done anything like that? If so then he has sinned and fallen short. However, if as a leader of a state, he called for corporate prayer, approaching God with needs, then not only is he not in violation of Jesus’ command, he is in fact following biblical precedent.
I will not weigh in on the merits of prayer or the validity of the Christian Bible. This is a public secular forum and that is best left to places where religion is discussed. But clearly you cannot use the bible and some individual passage separated from the totality of scripture to bring an indictment against a public figure for calling for public, corporate prayer.
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009
That is not my interpretation- it is that of our priest. I think he knows a little bit more about the Bible than you, so I will accept his interpretation. We had that very passage as the homily for a mass last month. Thank you, however, for your attempt to explain that passage to me. I am touched by your sincerity and concern.
I find that it is interesting that you think I am not a Christian. I don't care what you think. However, given that most liberals ARE ATHEISTS, why are you and other liberals so obsessed with the Bible? Are you just carrying out your liberal marching orders, as instructed by the Franfurt School, and attacking all and everything Christian?
Since when did such intolerance, hate & paranoia become part of being a good Christian...? Although I suppose Islamic extremists probably think they're being "good Muslims" too!
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