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Obama's history is not your typical black American history. He is from a different culture - therefore, I don't think this has the historical significance in HIS mind - to support what you are saying.
If Jesse Jackson were president - then I could understand your point.
I'm pretty sure it has historical significance in his mind, or he wouldn't have hung it in his White House. I don't know though, maybe you're a mind reader.
It may inspire a teachable moment, but in itself, this has zero educational value.
Teachable moments are for those who are open to learning. Those who have had their minds closed need not apply. Consequently, the painting has a strong point to make... what does segregation look like? Now, I won't be surprised at two opposing responses to it.
1- I find it disgusting
2- I like it
I would be in the first camp. It serves as a reminder of a society that lacks integrity (in more ways than one). A Christian (for example) should be able to look and see something they've been told about (and should follow)... don't do to others what you don't want to be done to self.
This demonstrates the beauty of great art. It can deliver a message while having an appeal to a variety of audience. If I were a black person, I wouldn't like to use it as an excuse to point at the misfortune and misery, but as a reminder to not condone a society that would do that, to ANYBODY. Do you not see that message?
obama is from a "different culture" ??? hawaii? obama understands our history quite well
Obama is from Kenya and was raised in Indonesia. The only thing he shares with blacks in this country is the color of his skin. He went to private WHITE schools his entire life.
What have you learned from this painting that you did not know before?
In itself, it is not educational. It does not teach me for example anything I did not learn in 6th grade. I think it's a good piece of art because it captures quite a bit of history. I just don't think it's educational.
This painting has actually taught me quite a bit today.
I learned that there are still people out there in the ether that think that they know everything about everything, and therefore dont think that anyone needs any education on anything.
I also learned that ignorance still rears its monstrous head in this country.
And, last but not least, that George Santayana was right.
I really wonder about some of the posters here that post such threads here, professionals could make a lifes work just studying some of the characters here, Jeeeeez
Casper
you can think what you like, I guess then for you no art is educational?
If I didn't know the n-word, perhaps I would glean the fact that it was a racial slur from looking at this painting. Maybe I would gather a tiny amount of fact from certain paintings, yes. Far from an effective method of education.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayland Woman
You do realize, don't you, that you are not the only person in the world. YOU may have "learned" something about the history of segregationist but there is always a new crop of young people on the horizon who haven't learned the history that you seem to think is too unimportant to continue teaching. As for there being "more productive things that we need to focus on" when you see senate and house sessions devoted to the art of the White House, get back to me.
Who in this day and age doesn't know about segregation? Who doesn't know that the schools had to be integrated. And even if a sizable portion of people didn't know that, we could teach them without looking at a picture of it, every day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunks_galore
Do you not see how this is a flawed statement?
You say that it doesn't teach you anything you didn't learn in 6th grade.
Do you realize that not everyone learned what you learn in 6th grade?
Do you realize this isn't actually about you?
So now you're trying to get me on a technicality. I'm sure in about 3 schools across this country, all the kids were sick and missed the days when they were taught about segregation. So let's teach them. That has nothing to do with this painting, which does not educate simply by being looked at.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunks_galore
The painting doesn't have to possess the capacity to teach SamBarrow something beyond what he learn in 6th grade in order for it to be educational. It has to possess the capacity to teach anyone anything at any point in their life to be educational. I wouldn't write a lesson plan about this painting, but I guarantee I could use this painting to teach people of a variety of age and creeds something they didn't know.
The painting itself teaches nothing. By looking at it, you learn nothing. It may inspire the desire to learn. But in itself, it teaches nothing. And there are far more effective ways to learn about these topics than looking at this painting every day.
This painting has actually taught me quite a bit today.
I learned that there are still people out there in the ether that think that they know everything about everything, and therefore dont think that anyone needs any education on anything.
I also learned that ignorance still rears its monstrous head in this country.
And, last but not least, that George Santayana was right.
No, you learned that from this thread. And you're doing the strawman thing again, it's ridiculous and it's really getting annoying. Please stop.
DRob4JC
Senior Member
befriend Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
3,376 posts, read 862,252 times
Reputation: 845
Originally Posted by reconmark
As a black guy, I teach my children that the most disrespectful thing you can do to yourself and your forebears, is to act as if they never existed and turn your back on them.
Quote:
DRob4JC
You can stop right there - because that is totally inaccurate.
Teachable moments are for those who are open to learning. Those who have had their minds closed need not apply. Consequently, the painting has a strong point to make... what does segregation look like? Now, I won't be surprised at two opposing responses to it.
1- I find it disgusting
2- I like it
I would be in the first camp. It serves as a reminder of a society that lacks integrity (in more ways than one). A Christian (for example) should be able to look and see something they've been told about (and should follow)... don't do to others what you don't want to be done to self.
This demonstrates the beauty of great art. It can deliver a message while having an appeal to a variety of audience. If I were a black person, I wouldn't like to use it as an excuse to point at the misfortune and misery, but as a reminder to not condone a society that would do that, to ANYBODY. Do you not see that message?
That it does. And I think it has a ton of value. I'm merely disputing the educational argument. Half of the posters in here are trying to equate my objection to this picture being hung in the white house to some type of advocacy to stop teaching history. And it's completely ridiculous.
I do understand your point quite well. I disagree, but you do have a very valid opinion and I respect that.
DH has had a copy of that painting hanging in his office for as long as I can remember. He had to dodge people throwing things and yelling at the black students who had the courage to integrate a small east Texas college in the fall of 1957. The word on the wall was commonly used in those days. I still hear it in my upwardly mobile NW Harris county subdivision.
Ruby and the Federal marshals are a reminder of who we ARE. They also remind me daily of the rotten things humans do to each other. Ruby and the marshals give me hope that there will always be somebody willing to do the right thing.
There is no better place for that painting than outside the office of the POTUS, whomever that may be.
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