#1 way to create jobs ---- Repeal Obamacare

[Driller1]

Originally Posted by Leisesturm

Whatever. I've made my point. Water may be worth something in 20 years but right now... ... well, in my city the drinking fountains downtown don't shut off. They just run 24/7. So, if Obama is your stumbling block. Rock on. Personally I think it is [TOS Violation) to want to wait till Obama leaves office to exhale, when Bernake and his band of merry Fedster's, to say nothing of the Congress will still be there and were, are and will be of far more direct impact on present and future economic policy than Obama.

H

Yet, I clear very good money drilling for it.

BTW, many cities get thier water from water wells.

[jmking]

Originally Posted by pghquest

I never called you a lier, I called you wrong. Dont you know the difference between that either?

So you don't like me being right, I understand your frustration. I'll tell you another issue I had with our law abiding insurance company. I called them and asked them to give us a name of a doctor who will treat my wifes disease because none would and guess what they said,They never heard of her disease before, not once but twice and never returned our calls. I'm telling you what happened to us. I can cut and paste other stories of people who were in the same boat all frigging day long. Please check out the bold text below. By the way pghquest, my wife developed her severe neurological condition from a broken wrist. Take care.

by Murray Waas

LOS ANGELES - Shortly after they were diagnosed with breast
cancer, each of the women learned that her health insurance had
been canceled. There was Yenny Hsu, who lived and worked in Los
Angeles. And there was Patricia Reilling, a successful art gallery
owner and interior designer from Louisville, Kentucky.
Neither of these women knew about the other. But besides their
similar narratives, they had something else in common: Their
health insurance carriers were subsidiaries of WellPoint, which has
33.7 million policyholders -- more than any other health insurance
company in the United States.
The women paid their premiums on time. Before they fell ill, neither
had any problems with their insurance. Initially, they believed their
policies had been canceled by mistake.
They had no idea that WellPoint was using a computer algorithm
that automatically targeted them and every other policyholder
recently diagnosed with breast cancer. The software triggered an
immediate fraud investigation, as the company searched for some
pretext to drop their policies, according to government regulators
and investigators.
Once the women were singled out, they say, the insurer then canceled
their policies based on either erroneous or flimsy information.
WellPoint declined to comment on the women’s specific cases
without a signed waiver from them, citing privacy laws.
That tens of thousands of Americans lost their health insurance
shortly after being diagnosed with life-threatening, expensive medical
conditions has been well documented by law enforcement agencies, state
regulators and a congressional committee. Insurance companies have
used the practice, known as “rescission,” for years. And a congressional
committee last year said WellPoint was one of the worst offenders.

[roysoldboy]

Originally Posted by dv1033

LOL I would ask you the same question. Demand is what drives growth. Repealing Obamacare and job creation is just right wing misinformation. Businesses are hesitant for a variety of reasons, but repealing "Obamacare" isn't the answer you are looking for.

Maybe we could work up a little bet about how soon after the repeal of Obamacare small businesses begin to expand. The real problem with that bet would be that we have to get rid of Obama in order to repeal and that may be hard to do. I am beginning to see why he wanted to work on his signature legislation before he dealt with jobs. But i do think that his signature legislation has contributed to the unemployment numbers.

Wanna bet?

[roysoldboy]

Originally Posted by Leisesturm

what kept them from hiring before Obamacare? Something clearly did. Obamacare is years in the future. What is keeping them from hiring right now? I'm thinking that you don't know anything about it. The DOW slid another 400 points on news that the economy will be this way for years. That is with or without Obamacare. I don't know about you but I fell a FAIL coming on.

You already failed so I guess I might as well do it for you. Remember that this is so you can squeal FAIL and no other reason.

If you can't see that small business people wanted to wait to see what that law would look like and then didn't want to take a chance because they saw what it amounted to then you haven't been watching too carefully since January 2009.

They knew that anything close to UHC was going to be very expensive for the government and that they would have to pay much more than they were paying to get it in. Do you see anything in Obamacare that would lower the amount of money employers would have to pay to insure their employees or how much the fines would cost if they dropped employee insurance payments? If you do then you could surely help me out by explaining what you see.

[jmking]

Originally Posted by andrea3821

What do you mean by that? I saw the bills for my laparoscopy in 2007 and they were not 5 figures. I clearly remember the hospital portion was $2k. Add in the anesthesiologist and the doctor's bills, plus pathology...it was NOT anywhere close to $10k.

ETA: I had a baby last month. I just got the EOB from my insurance company. The hospital billed them $10k and the OB billed a little under $5k. I got a separate bill from the anesthesiologist for $1700 (well worth it! LOL), pathology/lab for like $80 and the neonatologist for $400. So for a delivery that went bad when the baby got stuck and required an episiotomy and forceps delivery followed by a visit by the NICU team, it was about $18k. This also includes the entire hospital stay of two nights and any medication I received.

So you think your costs in Milwaukee are the same in Washington DC or NYC? Those costs would have been 5 figures here not some dairy farm somewhere.

[pghquest]

Originally Posted by jmking

So you don't like me being right,

You arent even close to being right. In fact I linked you RIGHT TO the state of PA's insurance commission.

If insurance companies have free reign to do whatever they want, why does all 50 states have insurance commissions?

[jmking]

Originally Posted by pghquest

You arent even close to being right. In fact I linked you RIGHT TO the state of PA's insurance commission.

If insurance companies have free reign to do whatever they want, why does all 50 states have insurance commissions?

For Chits and giggles, that's why. Many of these commissioners are lackies of the insurance companies. Many are in their pocket bought and paid for just like congress. pghquest, you don't seriously believe insurance companies shiver in fear of state commissioners do you? It's a cat and mouse game, the law does one thing, the company plays dodge with a slew of cash and lawyers.

[dreamofmonterey]

Originally Posted by jmking

For Chits and giggles, that's why. Many of these commissioners are lackies of the insurance companies. Many are in their pocket bought and paid for just like congress. pghquest, you don't seriously believe insurance companies shiver in fear of state commissioners do you? It's a cat and mouse game, the law does one thing, the company plays dodge with a slew of cash and lawyers.

exactly- Liberty Mutual Insurance Leviathan, they have armies of lawyers designed JUST to deny your claim. I worked for one of their trial attys in FL. Liberty dragged and litigated cases for over a decade without paying any policyholders.

a piddly state commissioner is nothing but road dirt to them and every corporation.

[dreamofmonterey]

A Civil Action is a 1996 work of non-fiction by Jonathan Harr depicting a water contamination case in Woburn, Massachusetts in the 1980s. The book became a best-seller and won the National Book Critics Circle Award for nonfiction.
The case is Anderson v. Cryovac. The first reported decision in the case is at 96 F.R.D. 431 (denial of defendants' motion to dismiss).
A film by the same name based on the book was produced in 1998.

Class Action: The story is about a lawsuit concerning injuries caused by a defective automobile. The suit takes on a personal dimension because the injured plaintiff's attorney, Jedediah Tucker Ward is the father of the automobile manufacturer's attorney his estranged daughter. The central premise of the film is roughly analogous to the controversy surrounding the Ford Pinto.
Jedediah Ward is a liberal civil rights lawyer who has based his career on helping people avoid being taken for a ride by the rich and powerful; he's pursued principle at the expense of profit.

His daughter also has made a career in law, she has taken a very different professional route by working for a high-powered corporate law firm and has adopted a conservative political agenda.

Jed is hired to help field a lawsuit against a major auto manufacturer whose station wagons have a dangerous propensity to explode on impact while making a left turn, but while his research indicates he has an all but airtight case against them, the case becomes more complicated for him when he discovers that Maggie is representing the firm he's suing.
The auto manufacturer in the film also utilizes a "bean-counting" approach to risk management, whereby the projections of actuaries for probable deaths and injured car-owners is weighed against the cost of re-tooling and re-manufacturing the car without the defect (exploding gas tanks) with the resulting decision to keep the car as-is to positively benefit short term profitability.

Corporate law is where the big money is, and they all represent the Plaintiff, i.e. MetLife, Colonial Penn, Liberty Mutual, vs. you the little average Joe. Whom do you think wins these cases? [rhetorical quest.]

watch these films based on true cases. pgh, we dont have time to cite corporate law cases that speak volumes.

[FrugalYankee]

Originally Posted by roysoldboy

Maybe we could work up a little bet about how soon after the repeal of Obamacare small businesses begin to expand. The real problem with that bet would be that we have to get rid of Obama in order to repeal and that may be hard to do. I am beginning to see why he wanted to work on his signature legislation before he dealt with jobs. But i do think that his signature legislation has contributed to the unemployment numbers.

Wanna bet?

I'll take that bet my friend.

You see, I have a small business myself. I honestly do not think that the reason that businesses are not expanding is a fear of the health care law. From where I am sitting (bottom feeder to manufacturing, hubby's business is in manufacturing directly), things are simply sluggish. If people aren't buying cars, building materials, sporting goods, etc then the demand for consumer and manufactured goods is not there. If the demand isn't there then there is no sense in expanding.

Personally I think the complaints about health care are just an excuse. I'm in a state where providing health insurance to employees has been mandated for quite some time and it doesn't have the effect that I see in the headlines.

I also think a large part of the current stagflation has to do with the housing market. A lot of people like you and me have money tied up in real estate that isn't moving. Houses take an average of 18 months to sell in my neck of the woods. Mortgage rates are low, but too bad no one qualifies for them.

I am not an economist bit I am convinced that once the housing market gets moving again, people will have money in their pockets, they will feel more confident, start buying and driving revenues for retail and manufacturing.