U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 10-13-2011, 12:43 PM
 
1,461 posts, read 2,942,423 times
Reputation: 598

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
One of the universalities of the Republican party, especially among its top practitioners of the political arts, is the absolute inability to grasp that your own experiences are not necessarily indicative of those of average people. Those people over there aren't rich? They must be lazy. Those people don't have good health care? Don't be silly, I've got wonderful health care.

so the personal experiences of liberals ARE indicative of those of average people?

So one group can have it and the other can't?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-13-2011, 12:46 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,717 posts, read 11,560,116 times
Reputation: 5613
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcopolo View Post
When I was young and low income (1975), we made $11,000 and paid $1,000 in federal income tax, as part of the 78% who paid income taxes.

Now we are older, and pay $37,000 in federal income tax; we are the 53%.

The only number I have a problem with is that the 78% turned into 53%. One out of four of us stopped rowing the boat during my career, so I am hauling their dead weight around.
There are two things here. The first is that $11K in 1978 is the same as $27K today. [edit typo: $37K today.]

The second is that Bush wanted to lower taxes on the rich but couldn't sell a blatant tax-cut for the rich. So, he called it a general tax-cut, in which the working poor didn't have to pay any taxes along with lowering rates on the rich (15% cap gains). The amount of tax revenue lost on the low income was minimal because these people didn't earn much or have much liability. However, on the top side, these were hefty dollar cuts.

Last edited by MTAtech; 10-13-2011 at 01:08 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 12:49 PM
 
1,461 posts, read 2,942,423 times
Reputation: 598
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
There are two things here. The first is that $11K in 1978 is the same as $27K today.

The second is that Bush wanted to lower taxes on the rich but couldn't sell a blatant tax-cut for the rich. So, he called it a general tax-cut, in which the working poor didn't have to pay any taxes along with lowering rates on the rich (15% cap gains). The amount of tax revenue lost on the low income was minimal because these people didn't earn much or have much liability. However, on the top side, these were hefty dollar cuts.

I am far from the 1% ...but thanks Bush for not taxing the hell out of my capital gains!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 12:52 PM
 
34,365 posts, read 41,446,089 times
Reputation: 29853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Earlyretired View Post
Im the 53%

I worked hard for every dime I have and now Im forced to put it at risk in investments that are a crap shoot due to reckless Kenyansian economic policies...
That would be
Keynesian economics

Nothing to do with Kenya
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,717 posts, read 11,560,116 times
Reputation: 5613
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
That would be
Keynesian economics

Nothing to do with Kenya
As I said earlier:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/21252586-post54.html

Earlyretired is blaming a model for his woes. (and a model that has stood up well compared to other models.)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 01:16 PM
 
33,046 posts, read 22,043,990 times
Reputation: 8970
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Originally Posted by Earlyretired
Im the 53%

I worked hard for every dime I have and now Im forced to put it at risk in investments that are a crap shoot due to reckless Kenyansian economic policies...

That would be
Keynesian economics

Nothing to do with Kenya

Wrong, Obamanomics IS Kenyansian economics.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 01:38 PM
 
Location: it depends
6,074 posts, read 5,333,179 times
Reputation: 5771
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
There are two things here. The first is that $11K in 1978 is the same as $27K today. [edit typo: $37K today.]

The second is that Bush wanted to lower taxes on the rich but couldn't sell a blatant tax-cut for the rich. So, he called it a general tax-cut, in which the working poor didn't have to pay any taxes along with lowering rates on the rich (15% cap gains). The amount of tax revenue lost on the low income was minimal because these people didn't earn much or have much liability. However, on the top side, these were hefty dollar cuts.
MTAtech, help me out on this.

During the debt/deficit debate, it was said that the cost of extending ALL of the Bush tax cuts over a ten year timeframe was $3.6 trillion. The cost of extending it for just the top 2% (top two brackets) was like $800 billion.

So didn't the bulk of the money go to the lower 98%, like three times as much as went to the top 2%?

I think you are right about the few getting "hefty dollar cuts" but I think you misunderestimate (Bushism) the serious amount of good these cuts did for the rest of us. It was not "minimal" as you say.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 01:39 PM
 
3,402 posts, read 4,310,897 times
Reputation: 2403
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3~Shepherds View Post
For those states with no tolls would be difficult and those states that have no income tax would have no revenue. That's one of the problems I hear in Oregon, no sales tax, but property taxes are through the roof, it's how they pay for their repairs and state needs.

As I said before, there are people out there that can claim exempt on their federal withholding. If the employer doesn't withhold and the employees not paying, the Feds get no dollars. For the most part these same people are being refunded. The tax system is wacky............ I would like to see a flat tax.

As far as the old man/lady at age 65-70 somewhere in between, let's say they stop paying taxes. This would allow them to stay in their homes that they worked for, until they die.
That won't work. If gramma doesn't have to pay taxes then all relatives will be putting the title of their house in her name.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 01:46 PM
 
999 posts, read 1,725,168 times
Reputation: 1169
Hmmmmm....

The Tumbler page account is at 85 for the 99 Percenters vs. 10 pages for the 53 Percenters.

This tells me that the Tea Party people have less to complain about because they love to be wage slaves.

Here's the thing: LIFE is more than making money and working three jobs to get by. I know conservatives love to work and they love to participate in the market economy. They feel that earning money is empowering and gives them a sense of meaning in life. Making more money than the neighbor, friend or old classmate is a status goal. Gotta pay your dues now so you could get rewarded in the end.

The problem is that conservative Americans are getting f#kked over just the same as the OWS/99 Percent people. They are getting screwed over with lousy health care and a lousy educational system. They are getting laid off during lean times or because of company mergers. The bills are mounting up like crazy and the debts are a chain on the neck. Bad fortune happens to people whether they are Republican or Democrat; Conservative or Liberal; Fascist or Anarchist.

The OWS folks pinned the blame on the richest and most powerful individuals. The most wealthiest Americans make the rules of the game of which we ALL play. The wealthiest Americans control the Congress and The White House. Instead, the Tea Party types blame the victims of layoffs, the disabled, the persons of color, the working poor; basically the most defenseless segments of society. This is plain madness.

If money ceased to exist.

If the market economy ceased to exist where there were no more owners and laborers.

If the land had no monetary value.

If there was no government where one can salute the national flag, sing patriotic songs and wreak violent destruction on foreign lands.

The "53 Percent" people would become lost souls.

They do not understand the beauty of art, music or nature. The status symbol comes crashing down because you no longer have money; you are no longer superior to me or to others. When everyone has no monetary value, trust begins to build between people. All you have is the Earth for food and shelter and not much else. It doesn't get more equal than that.


Until then...

I am a slave to your market economy. I am a slave to an undemocratic government that starves its people at home and commits violence abroad. My worth as a human being is tied to my salary and my bank account according to the rules promulgated by the wealthy elite and enforced by the Tea Party/53 Percent foot soldiers.

To hell with the United States government.

To hell with your insane money hustling system.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-13-2011, 02:24 PM
 
3,402 posts, read 4,310,897 times
Reputation: 2403
Quote:
They do not understand the beauty of art, music or nature. The status symbol comes crashing down because you no longer have money; you are no longer superior to me or to others. When everyone has no monetary value, trust begins to build between people. All you have is the Earth for food and shelter and not much else. It doesn't get more equal than that.
First of all, why do some liberals think that art, beauty and nature are only liberal things?

The rest of what is said here is typical of what most liberals think. They want everyone to be poor. What a boring existence of mediocrity it would be. Don't they realize it is possible to have all the mediocrity you want without dragging the rest of us down too? Can't enjoy your mediocrity if I have more?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top